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AFE PG7 and water

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I placed a post here a while ago about the AFE intake and its susceptibility to getting wet from rain water and splash from the roadway.



I drove 100 miles today in the rain, and opened my hood at about 1/2 way.



Sure enough, there was water on the air filter (in the and in the air box.



My questions:



1) Won't the water cause the oil to separate from the gauze filter media?



2) Will the filter become less effective?



3) Anyone else notice this and/or have a solution?



I'm contemplating putting my stock air box over for the rest of winter. If so, can I use the torque tube with the stock air box?
 
I have to agree with Silverram03. My understanding is that the Pre-filter is supposed to "wick away" water drops before they can get to the filter. An added advantage is that it keeps bumble bees, butterflies, leaves and other big junk out of the filter. Joe F. (Buffalo)
 
Could you just block the forward opening with cardboard or some other substance for the winter and let it pull air from the other gaps? The water issue is exactly why I'm building my own enclosure. I can soak the stock box just going to the carwash!
 
I have the pre-filter on mine & don't even worry too much when washing off the engine. Do not spray it directly but that is the only care I take. Mine also will get snow in the box but so far I have not noticed any ill effects on the filter. I take the pre-filter off fairly often and rinse it out to remove bugs, small birds & pieces of ungulates.
 
DCaswell said:
I have the pre-filter on mine & don't even worry too much when washing off the engine. Do not spray it directly but that is the only care I take. Mine also will get snow in the box but so far I have not noticed any ill effects on the filter. I take the pre-filter off fairly often and rinse it out to remove bugs, small birds & pieces of ungulates.

Same here, minus the snow. The prefilters are a bit spendy but worth it IMO.



-Scott
 
I drove another 90 miles in the pouring rain today, and once again the front and top of my PG7 were wet. I pulled the truck into the shop and started removing the entire AFE system.



First I pulled the filter off. No dirt on the inside, but you could feel moisture and oil. The filter media looked clean on the inside. The dirt (black dust) that was on the outside surface of the filter before it got wet is now in the gauze itself, not on top as it was before.



Second, I pulled off the torque tube. Man, was I surprised. I did not know that the tube isn't completely powder coated, inside and out. Only the first 1" or 2" on the inside are coated. I inspected the tube, only to find that there's a powdery white coating on the inside of the tube. There area white streaks running in line with the airflow. Evidence to me that the filter sucked water, and corrosion has started on the inside of the tube. Amazing, considering I only have had this on my truck for 2000 miles. The white powdery stuff easily comes off when you brush it with your finger.



Third, I checked the turbo, and the blades and shaft feel sticky. The leading edges of the turbo have some black on the leading edges of the blades that fades about 1/8 inch back.



Overall I have to say that I have no confidence in the AFE filter system. I'm sure it works extremely well in dry conditions, but it seems that when the filter gets wet, the oil gets displaced and sucked into the air stream as well as water, causing some corrosion in the torque tube.



I have to say, I really miss the sound and look of that intake.



I really like the idea of a more efficient intake, I just can't justify leaving this system on my truck when the filter gets soaked every time it rains.



I think an optional weather shield or something that would mount between the grille and the intake would take care of it.



If anyone is interested, I can take some pics of the tube so you can see what I'm talking about.
 
J Cleary

My torque tube had a seemingly powdery white streaking on the inside, brand new before I installed it. I tried to wipe it off with some alchohol and saw that it was somewhat sticky. Are you saying that the turbine blades now have a sticky residue on them as well. I love the sound of the system and as you say the look, but I'm fearfull of decreasing the life of my turbo or my engine. I know there are many experienced Cummnis owners out there that swear by this system. I put it on mainly to get better airflow and to control EGT's with my TST box. Mark at TST told me it was unecessary. He told me that they had done testing with and without and it didn't make a bit of difference from the viewpoint of EGT reduction. I noticed that with the stock air box and TST the EGT's might have been slightly less but I also noticed they seemed to come down a little quicker. I may have been imagining this and would have to experiment in a more controlled manner. We have had a ton of snow in southwest Ohio and with that snow melting comes the moisture and slush. I'm hoping that I haven't messed anything up running this intake system without a prefilter during this time.



As a side note. I never barked my turbo with the tst and stock air box. Maybe it sounds different when it does and I just didn't recognize the harshness of the sound because it was dampened by the paper filter, intake baffles and silencer ring all which are now gone or replaced.
 
Just a comment on the stock filter assembly, Last winter after driving home from work 500 mile in a snow storm, Fired up the truck the next day to go on a 50 trip, pulled out to pass a Duramax & just barely crawled by, Truck smoking & running like crap,looked over at my egt guage 1400 deg and no power - What the hey! Pulled over & checked my drop in AFE filter - Totally solid in snow and ice = Destroyed. Had a stock filter with me luckily - Carried on power back hwys still snowy - got home checked filter again - full of snow once again. Put my Bd system back in with a prefilter & drove in same conditions since - no problems !

What do I think of the stock system - Total Junk!

By the way also talked to a private lube shop who service many vehicles & says he gets to sell alot of filters in the winter due to snow & ice filled Stock air boxes in the 03 & up cummins.
 
Punch a 4" or 5" hole in the bottom of the stock airbox. Snow problems go away and you'll double the life of the filter.



Richard
 
Papa Delta said:
My torque tube had a seemingly powdery white streaking on the inside, brand new before I installed it. I tried to wipe it off with some alchohol and saw that it was somewhat sticky. Are you saying that the turbine blades now have a sticky residue on them as well. I love the sound of the system and as you say the look, but I'm fearfull of decreasing the life of my turbo or my engine. I know there are many experienced Cummnis owners out there that swear by this system. I put it on mainly to get better airflow and to control EGT's with my TST box. Mark at TST told me it was unecessary. He told me that they had done testing with and without and it didn't make a bit of difference from the viewpoint of EGT reduction. I noticed that with the stock air box and TST the EGT's might have been slightly less but I also noticed they seemed to come down a little quicker. I may have been imagining this and would have to experiment in a more controlled manner. We have had a ton of snow in southwest Ohio and with that snow melting comes the moisture and slush. I'm hoping that I haven't messed anything up running this intake system without a prefilter during this time.



As a side note. I never barked my turbo with the tst and stock air box. Maybe it sounds different when it does and I just didn't recognize the harshness of the sound because it was dampened by the paper filter, intake baffles and silencer ring all which are now gone or replaced.



When I first took the system off, I touched the turbo shaft to see how freely it spun. Before I even moved it, I felt the nut was sticky. I then washed my hands completely. I came back and looked at the compressor wheel, where I noticed the black stuff (for lack of a better word). I rubbed one of the blades with my finger, and sticky black stuff came off and stuck on my finger.



I don't think there will be any problems with the turbo. The sticky matter shouldn't make a difference as long as you have clean intake air. I think the compressor wheel spins too fast for anything solid to stick to it anyway.



The main reason for me removing the system was the soaking part. I do not think moisture in the intake is going to help anything. Additionally I did not want the water to displace the oil in the PG7 (which I think is a really good filter) reducing the effectiveness of the filter media. If the oil is gone, the dirt will have to be trapped by only the 7 layer gauze. I'm sure the oil combined with the 7 layers of fabric is the magic combination. No oil = fine dust coming through.



I think I may try the Volant intake next. I haven't seen anyone on this site talk about it, I'll have to do a search. Their box is enclosed and draws air from both the stock location and from the front of the box. It also has a tube similar to the AFE tube. The front opening looks as if it can be blocked to keep water out, plus there's an additional cool air tube available that will draw from the front of the truck.



I don't think any system will sound any better than the AFE except maybe a BHAF, but it is susceptible to the same soaking problem. I would imagine the paper getting wet is even worse.



Lastly, I have been told that the stock airbox will work fine until you get a bigger turbo. Apparently the stock turbo won't flow much air anyway. I bought it to make my truck sound better, along with a Banks exhaust.
 
Then how do we explain the increase in RWHP with the AFE, if the stock turbo won't flow more air? The snow thing is a real concern, if the snow damages the AFE? Doc
 
I'm running the pre filter on mine and no problems with snow or ice or rain for that matter. Truck has seen its fair share of all the past few months going through NM and AZ in all kinds of weather pulling trailers at the speed limit or " slightly above" ! :rolleyes: Have inspected filter several times and no evidence of any wet stuff getting through the pre filter. I do however when I clean the sock give it a healthy shot of silicone spray to help out.
 
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