Ain't that a shame...

[CSnyder]

Perhaps all of us TDR members need to get our noses wet in the business world?. ? Maybe we should consider taking our 25,xxx membership into full swing and open a member owned USA made wholesale outlet with markups only allowing our cost plus some interest. We could eventually have a 100,000 store chain and force those that support the Chinese economy out of business or at least hurt them where it counts. We as TDR members have a strong community with a mostly strong backbone and we could really do this. I feel that if we opened one store in our most TDR populated area and ran it properly we could have 5 more stores in one years time and this would include not paying our CEO 1 billion a year as a salary but rather a modest income. I'm sure we could find within our community enough employees that would quit their factory or meaningless jobs to help run our store chains and we could promote within. We can definately do this because I know the majority of the USA population would buy from us if we sold NOTHING but USA made products for the same price as Walmart does and we can do this because we won't have top execs making huge salaries. I would quit my hauling contract and become an employee as well just to help do my part in boosting the USA economy. Some of you are probably thinking I've lost my mind suggesting the sorts of this but until you take a hard look into your lives and have a family that you really care about and think of what they will endure once you are gone you will understand what I feel here. I am terrified of what my kids will have to tolerate as a US citizen many years after I am gone. Maybe we should start a new thread and get a poll going as to who would get involved in this and start standing up for their God given rights!



Chris

 

[WyattEarp]

I agree with HBarlow, and as long as these pple keep voting for their interests and not for the good of the common pple as a whole this is what you get, this started way befor Bush, clinton or Bush senior, even before Reagan... Its like a disease that has infested and destroyed our Gov't way of thinking, as for wealthiest at this rate of spending and giving away dollars that isn't there to begin with, it will come to an end, and frankly im not going to be paying for my gov'ts spending until i die...

The system has gotten way off base as to what its goal was, and well taking care of the American pple has gotten side swiped with political hogwash. We have former War vets in DC, that are homeless not to mention all the other pple that have no homes and right in our nations capitol, any country that lets this happen should be ashamed, I maybe considered American by Birth but otherwise just consider myself a Citizen of a country that has abandoned its own pple for the mere fact of saving Face and political gain.

 

[SSabick]

I still say that it just sucks to have to be reformed to think that the now $1. 98/gal. for regular gas is cheap!!! :--) not to mention the $2. 98/gal for diesel fuel. I mean shoot Kerosine is only $2. 45/gal. Must be some way to dilute the kerosine down with dino oil and other sludges to get it close enough to diesel again so we can run it... I wish I had those kind of profits in real estate. I am usually only charging 6%, that is 1% less than national average, and much less than the profits that oil companies make. We should all be so lucky to see the profits that they make. I'm in the wrong business again. :-laf Profit isn't at all bad, but taking advantage of any given situation... what's next oh no there was a tornado in Indiana, there must be some way we can up the prices. Make them all pay... ha-ha-ha. Kick them when their up kick them when their down . I swear that song must be playin through the whole board meeting :-laf

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

WyattEarp said:



"The system has gotten way off base as to what its goal was, and well taking care of the American pple has gotten side swiped with political hogwash. We have former War vets in DC, that are homeless not to mention all the other pple that have no homes and right in our nations capitol, any country that lets this happen should be ashamed, I maybe considered American by Birth but otherwise just consider myself a Citizen of a country that has abandoned its own pple for the mere fact of saving Face and political gain. "



I posted this in another thread - but it fits here equally well...



YUP - it's all about controlling the masses - the wolves herding the sheep...



Harder to control and police a society scattered in widely separated areas - lets "persuade" them to migrate to larger population centers for better monitoring and control - make moving around harder and more regulated...



As a society, we, in past decades, have enjoyed the freedom this country was founded upon - and until more recent times also enjoyed the ability of free travel and choice of places to live.



The Socialist countries envied our liberties and freedoms - and the lifestyles that came with them - even as THEY enjoyed many of the fruits and grains our country also produced as a direct result of those basic freedoms.



The Liberal Socialists have LONG been involved in attempting to make US here in the USA more like what we see in the countries many HERE came to escape - and the steady pressure to increase fuel costs is only ONE of those!



SO, instead of the free choice of transportation, and in many cases the related pressure to relocated closer to population centers to reduce transportation costs, we now see many abandoning driving vehicles they earlier enjoyed and paid good $$$ for - and parking them in the garage as they buy some econobox to bend to the force of outside pressure - just like good sheeple should...



Where will it end - and how MUCH external control by government, EPA, Big Oil, Sierra Club, the UN, and MANY others will we tolerate?



This certainly is NOT the USA of earlier decades - and MOST of the changes were due to profit-based agendas developed in smoky back rooms, NOT out of necessity or "compassion" for society or saving the planet!

 

[Hohn]

WyattEarp said:

... any country that lets this happen should be ashamed, I maybe considered American by Birth but otherwise just consider myself a Citizen of a country that has abandoned its own pple for the mere fact of saving Face and political gain. "

There is no freedom without the freedom to fail...

 

[smd]

Ditto

I agree with you Gary. I have written to both of our legislators (State of NV) about two months ago about the price of fuel & neither one had the decency or courtesy to respond to my letter. Yes Gary you are right, it is a shame.

Likewise, I even wrote to the State Attorney General Office with a mid change in office. Still I expect a response even from some snot nosed inturn What ever happened to; the Pen is Mightier than the Sword? I`ll bet that too many folk have given up, they don`t care and to spend 10 minutes to write a letter, forget it! Both sides of the fence Dems and GOP alike should be taken behind the shed for a good `ol fashion whipen :-laf Modern day mafia = OPEC, corporate Cheveron, BP!



Every business must make a profit just to keep the lights on for small business to major R and D for large industury. But when record profit after record profit 1/4 after 1/4 is the norm, it time to say wait a minute!! Too many small business, farmers, truckers, consumers, ect feel the pinch. Profits are good, they keep America rolling - unjust Billion $$$ profits in turn have a negitive impact on our economy.

 

[barbwire]

excellent idea!!!!!!

Perhaps all of us TDR members need to get our noses wet in the business world?. ? Maybe we should consider taking our 25,xxx membership into full swing and open a member owned USA made wholesale outlet with markups only allowing our cost plus some interest. We could eventually have a 100,000 store chain and force those that support the Chinese economy out of business or at least hurt them where it counts. We as TDR members have a strong community with a mostly strong backbone and we could really do this. I feel that if we opened one store in our most TDR populated area and ran it properly we could have 5 more stores in one years time and this would include not paying our CEO 1 billion a year as a salary but rather a modest income. I'm sure we could find within our community enough employees that would quit their factory or meaningless jobs to help run our store chains and we could promote within. We can definately do this because I know the majority of the USA population would buy from us if we sold NOTHING but USA made products for the same price as Walmart does and we can do this because we won't have top execs making huge salaries. I would quit my hauling contract and become an employee as well just to help do my part in boosting the USA economy. Some of you are probably thinking I've lost my mind suggesting the sorts of this but until you take a hard look into your lives and have a family that you really care about and think of what they will endure once you are gone you will understand what I feel here. I am terrified of what my kids will have to tolerate as a US citizen many years after I am gone. Maybe we should start a new thread and get a poll going as to who would get involved in this and start standing up for their God given rights!



Chris

This is one of many good posts on this thread. Too bad that there is not enough get up and go to get something like this going. ( sorry about the pessamism) I've been beaten too many times.

 

[rivercat]

A couple of random thoughts on this post: 1) I believe that the state and federal taxes on fuel are on a per gallon basis so unless more gallons are sold the governments don't make more money on increased prices. 2) Any one who believes that the oil companies didn't make the most of this situation is fooling themselves. 3) Sarbane Oxley has had one very large effect in that it has forced many small accounting firms out of the auditing business due to the increased expense and demands made on them. 4) Take a look at all of the big accounting firms and you will see that they have all had some problems. 5) I have no doubt that the big oil companys have done all they could to beat those profits down to the levels that they are.

I belive the crime is commited on the COMEDOWN that is when the price basis crude or what ever they go by drops and the station recives the next load cheaper they down come down NEARLY as fast as they SHOOT up so the whole area rides the higher price for several days or loads intil they have come down due to competion no one wants to be the first to drop the price. The stations have been the ones to make the killing this year because of all the spikes. Every spike they make money after and sometimes right upuntill the next spike.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I belive the crime is commited on the COMEDOWN that is when the price basis crude or what ever they go by drops and the station recives the next load cheaper they down come down NEARLY as fast as they SHOOT up so the whole area rides the higher price for several days or loads intil they have come down due to competion no one wants to be the first to drop the price. The stations have been the ones to make the killing this year because of all the spikes. Every spike they make money after and sometimes right upuntill the next spike.

YUP, spiked OVERNITE substantially here the day BEFORE the first huricane even hit LA, and only YESTERDAY returned to previous levels...



I usually don't figure the local suppliers make out as well as those further upstream in fuel supply profits - but THIS time proved to be an exception...

 

[rivercat]

There is no freedom without the freedom to fail...

WELL SAID
meaning no one held a gun to your head and made you smoke that first crack rock till you lost everthing stole from your own mother and ended up on the street homeless with nothing. As in some instances of Katrina. Support can become enablement. That being said. Vets DO need special attention for the things they experienced, saw ,participated in, under orders, Not only MENTALY but Physically also. A dear Attack Chopper pilot freind of mine has severe swelling in his legs due to exposure to agent orange and is still fighting for medical help.

 

[ilovetrains]

a few facts

There is a certain fallacy that has been put out here: 7-10% profit margin is OK for the oil companies. Not so. In fact, the oil company whose name you might see is only one of 3-5 business entities that will be making a profit, whatever margin it might be, on the sale of one gallon of gasoline. Perhaps you would like to compare that to other industries that sell what we can all agree is an essential product of an American's everyday life. Grocery stores typically operate on less than 1% margin. A substantial difference to be sure. Insurance carriers shoot for . 5% margin. they rarely make that much.



Another falacy is the idea that the respective governments of the United States (stae, local and federal) do not have a vested interest in the amount of gasoline/diesel fuel sold. The largest line item revenue of any state government is fuel tax. It typically for mid-western states is almost double what the state takes in sales tax and income tax combined. Likewise, the single largest line expenditure is highway maintenance. Most states have 60-75% of their total state employees engaged in highway maintenance.



As has been pointed out, we have quite a few state sanctioned and montired monopolies in the utility field. Fuel should be no different. The only argument to the contrary is that of free market economy, which is to be sure a founding principle of this nation. However, we have seen again and again in our nations history that in order to protect the greater good, individual markets are brought under state control.



If you truly are unhappy with fuel prices, why don't you ask the question, why does America use so much fuel? The most logical answer is: because we can. We routinely shun economy of choice for convenience. It cost far less to transport a pound of freight by rail rather than by truck, but it is not as convenient. The consequence of that descision is highways that are clogged with trucks, high costs for highway repair, and dramatically increased national fuel consumption. The same analogy applies to personal conveyance, it much more econmical to transport people by rail, or even bus, than by personal automobile.



I live in Kansas City. A city that has routinely voted down every light rail proposal that has come along, even those that would not have raised taxes. The price of fuel should be taxed at $5 a gallon to support any city that is so manifestly stupid.



Most of you should be too.

 

[mhenon]

"I live in Kansas City. A city that has routinely voted down every light rail proposal that has come along, even those that would not have raised taxes. The price of fuel should be taxed at $5 a gallon to support any city that is so manifestly stupid.



Most of you should be too. "



ilovetrains... . a stupidity tax... I like it. But wait. . we don't like taxes. . we like tax breaks. So. . OK. . no stupidity tax... just raise the price of goods. . like fuel and stuff and we'll spend most of our income on gas getting to our new minimum wage jobs.

Then. . we could start a war in Iraq (you know. . 15% of the worlds oil reserves) and get our fatcat buddies (Halliburton, Betchtel... those guys) some really nice government contracts to rebuild the country we're about to blow to crap.

Then... . the price of fuel will skyrocket and certain people who have been in the oil business (you know. . the Bush's, Cheney's,Saudi family and others) will make fortunes as the fear of war causes fuel prices to soar. But. . we'll have to create a new energy bill that protects the profits the oil companies have just made. We'll just call that "The Energy bill".

I know the people will fall for this... . they're stupid remember. But hey. . we didn't have to roll out the stupid tax. Just create a lot of little McJobs and new interest only bank loans (keeping those payments down now that the people aren't doing to well) to buy a useless SUV (gotta have one of these babies!!!) and use more gas. Brilliant!!!

I'm sure glad they didn't use the stupid tax... Whew!

Mike

 

[WyattEarp]

I like that... i would have to say you hit the nail right on the head and drove that sucker all the way through.

 

[WyattEarp]

CSnyder i had the chance to read your post on up the list, thats a very good idea, actually next year i am attempting to go into produce farming, my family all the way back to the first generation was tobacco farmers, well the buck stops here with me, im tired of getting screwed over and taking a excellent product to market so the companies can makes millions over the pennies i recieve. So next year im going with produce and right now i work full time for the state and if the farming pans out over the next couple of years, the state can have their job, insurance and night shift as far as im concerned. .

People have to eat and the demand will always be there for a grower, But i was enthusiastic about your idea of opening a TDR member run chain store...

 

[HBarlow]

Gary,



Could I politely suggest that you seek out a college near your home and ask if you could simply sit in and "audit" the two basic economics classes normally labeled ECO 101 and ECO 102? It's never too late to learn they say. I think you would be surprised and pleased with what you would learn.



Harvey

 

[RGardner]

Harvey, what are you trying to tell us?