Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Altenator/Battery/Starter/MAP Problem????

[MAYoung]

Truck: 98. 5 2500 Quad Cab 5. 9L Turbo Stock--No Modifications, 184,000 Miles



My truck will only start on an intermittent basis. When I turn the key to the start position, I will usually first get a "click. " If I cycle the key, it will sometimes start on the 3rd of 4th try. There is no absolute consistency.



Here are the items that I am encountering:



1) Several months ago, the voltage gauge started indicating only 12v upon starting. The voltage will slowly rises to about 14v after about 30 seconds. It then will hold a constant voltage. This slow voltage rise was never noticed until a few months ago.



2) The batteries are both less than 1 year old but I have not load tested them recently. However, the truck appears to be more willing to start if I have placed a battery charger on the batteries for less than an 1/2 hour. (I have also carefully removed and cleaned the terminals. )



3) The altenator is less than 2 years old and appears to hold a consistent charge indication after the initial start-up.



4) I do not have a "Check Engine" light at this time. However, when I scan the engine, I have a P1693 and P0237 code. I believe that the 1693 code is a general fault indicator and the 237 code indicates low voltage to the MAP.



5) The starter works once it is past the clicking indicator. It does not seem to hang up



Questions:



A) Does anyone have a quick, cheap solution?



B) How do I progressively troubleshoot the problem?



C) Could the MAP be the main fault?



I have read some of the earlier posts and they seem to indicate a variety of failure modes involving all of the items listed above. Where should I start?HELP!



Thank you in advance,



Mark Young

 

[DAAguiar]

I had a problem like yours, turned out the ignition switch was at fault, Dealer back ordered. I could not wait and removed the plastic covering the ignition switch... used brake cleaner and sprayed dirt and grease out of switch. Truck works fine over last 80,000. Still have new switch as spare. Did not change it out, because removal and replacement requires special; torks screwdriver bit.

 

[Loren]

Mark,



I'll bet your problem is the starter contacts. Bad contacts can cause all kinds of problems that don't seem to be related to starting.



Call LarryB's and order a set of contacts. Here's where:

LarryB's Dodge starting problems solved here.



These contacts are easy to change yourself if you are handy. If you don't want to do that, give them to a mechanic and have him install them.



Don't put this off. With some failures the contacts will cause the starter to continue to run, or cause problems with the fuel solenoid. This can cause expensive collateral damage.



Getting the starter off the truck requires a 10 mm 12-POINT socket and also a long (10" or so) extension.



Good luck.

Loren

 

[BWagnaar]

My starter was going out and I would have to "Bump" the starter key a few times to get it to start, after a couple weeks of that I was driving and heard this weird grinding and whirling noies. Turn the key off and the starter was still going just trying to turn the motor!! Had pull batt cables off to get it to stop... .



I would get a starter bypass tool/button, its a hand held tool that has a button on it with two long leads. You clamp one to batt HOT and the other to the start seloniod wire. Hit the button and see if it works every time, if so that would confirm the starter switch, if not than there is somehting up with your starter. I think you can get them for $12-$20 bucks at an auto parts store, or you could try your local shop and see if you could borrow it and do it out in the parking lot.



Good luck

 

[MAYoung]

Gentlemen:



Thank you for your assistance. All suggestions are possible failure modes. I will replace the contacts in the starter first based on some of the other comments that I have reviewed. I am thinking that if the contacts are worn, then the extra "juice" held in the batteries may be enough to make the starter engage, which seems to be a pattern.



Also, I failed to mention that this truck is a 5-speed manual transmission and I have verified that the clutch switch is not the problem. If the clutch is not depressed, I do not get even a "click" from the starter.



As additional information for further diagnosis, the starter only clicks once upon turning the key, not the chatter that one gets from a low battery condition.



I will keep you posted as to progress.



Regards,



Mark Young

 

[MAYoung]

Gentlemen:



Just an update. I just pulled the starter from the truck. Not impossible but the three bolt holding the starter have a fair amount of torque. The top bolt was the most difficult to remove. As they advise, you need a 10mm wrench with 12 point socket---a 10-12" long wrench is best. I have decided to take it to an auto electric store near my home. We still have a good shop in Sacramento (Lehr Auto Electric) and will rebuild the unit for about $125. 00 and they have a two day turn-around.



Regards,



Mark Young

 

[CSnyder]

Mark, your electric shop is aweful high priced. If you were able to remove the starter then putting in contacts is MUCH easier and that is the part you need. Once the starter is out installing contacts takes less than 15 minutes to do. The Larry B contact kit is everything you need for around 30 bucks. Im doubtful your eletric shop will install larger than stock contacts so you will be back to this point again in not so many miles.

 

[DSeamans]

I agree, get the Larry b kit and put it in yourself. His website gives instructions and shows the difference. Ithink there are 3 screws and then the contacts themselves.

 

[Allnew2Me]

Yesterday another member of our local TDR chapter called me with a similar problem and it turned out to be the starting relay in the PDC. I had him switch it with the fuel heater relay and it started right up. You may want to check that also. That was a really inexpensive fix.

 

[Loren]

Mark,



These guys are right. If you can get the starter off by yourself, then changing the contacts will be child's play.



Save that money and install the LarryB's contacts yourself. I very much doubt that your starter needs any more of a rebuild than just the contacts. And, as CSnyder said, that shop probably won't install the larger, better contacts. If they don't, this problem will come back sooner.



If you insist on spending $125 and a two-day turnaround, then have LarryB ship the contacts overnight.



I hope you read these posts before you take that starter down to the shop.



Good luck,

Loren

 

[MAYoung]

Gentlemen:



Thanks for all the information. Since the truck has over 183,000 miles on the vehicle, I decided to go for a complete rebuild. It turns out that it needed more than just the contacts--bearings, brushes, field coil, contacts, plunger. The cost was $183. 32.



As to pricing, I agree with the contact solution at about $40. 00. Dodge wanted nearly $700. 00 for a new replacement starter--this dealer says they sell quite a few to repair shops. Napa had a new one for about $210. 00. I even found a new import from Asia for about $180. 00. Quite a range in pricing. I have no idea about the quality.



In any event the starter is back in the truck. I am charging the battery right now.



Regards,



Mark Young

 

[MAYoung]

Gentlemen:



The truck is back up and running! The starter was the problem. Now on to running errands.



Regards,



Mark Young