Am I crazy?

[Jeeper37]

I haven't been on here in a very long time. Several years. I have a general question with a lot of back story.

I currently own a 2014 LML Duramax. I bought it new in 2014. Prior to this truck I had a 2004 Ram 2500 CTD 6 speed. The 04 Ram had given me a bad last year of ownership with some very haunting electrical problems. It was one of the trucks that had the APPS under the driver side battery. It developed an intermittent problem in one of three harnesses. I ended up replacing all three harnesses after frying several APPS and a few ECM's. The problem did end up resolved but it was only after a year or two of financial drain and tears and frustration. So, in my frustration when the warranty for the repairs ran out. I sold it. When I sold it I bought the Duramax I currently have. I never deleted it or tuned it or anything. I was planning to delete it. After the latest rounds of the EPA hammering the diesel truck industry as a whole, I feel like deleting it is no longer an option. As ownership of this truck has gone on it has ruined one vacation and almost ruined another. Both times it was emission system faults. Once it was the DEF sending unit that went out and I got it fixed just in time to leave on vacation. The second time it got me the 9th injector stuck open when I was in the middle of nowhere in the U.P. of Michigan. I also smell coolant after driving it quite often and no one can figure out where its coming from. I've had all these experiences all while knowing that the CP4 on these trucks can grenade without warning and huge bucks to repair and the labor on this job is insane. I work at a GM dealer so I'm pretty aware of the Duramax problems overall. The kicker of all this. It's only got 74,000 miles on it. I'm pretty disappointed overall.

Stay with me here.

All the newer trucks are going to have an emissions or have been deleted. I also know that a lot of the newer Dodges and Fords(Not sure of years exactly) also have the dreaded CP4. They will also have either an emissions system or be deleted(illegal). I spend to much time on the interstates on trips to run around illegal. I know everybody knows a bunch of people getting away with it but I really believe it's going to get worse. Also, more and more shops are going to refuse to work on deleted rigs out of fear of being fined for doing so. The dealer I work at will send every deleted truck packing and forget about trading it in or working on it.

So, what I'm thinking I want to do is trade in or sell this Duramax and get an 06 or early 07 6 speed CTD with as low of miles and as clean as possible and just hope the older truck will go the distance for me. No need to delete it since it never had DPF systems. Also easier to work on than the LML Duramax and cheaper too.

AM I CRAZY FOR WANTING TO GO BACKWARDS ALMOST 10 YEARS? My wife thinks so but has given me the green light.

I cant do gen 2 because I need a real back seat. Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't the electrical systems of the 06 and early 07 better than previous gen 3's? Any info on what to look for while truck shopping is appreciated.

Thanks

 

[AH64ID]

Having just gone from a 05 with relatively low miles, well built, good power, and good towing to a 18 that's bone stock... I personally wouldn't go back.

The 18 has better towing characteristics stock than the modded 05. The 18 is also more comfortable on long drives, which you mentioned you do. The highway miles with the family is the main reason we upgraded.

The 3rd gen's are real back seats, at least not after getting a 4th gen. They are better then a extra cab but still smaller than a full size rear seat.

Ram didn't get the CP4 until 2019 and their emissions systems have been very reliable from 15-18.

So for me it would depend on how you use it. There are going to be low mileage 5.9's still available but they won't be cheap and can still have issues.

Are you towing for all those highway miles? Is a diesel your best option?

 

[Jeeper37]

Having just gone from a 05 with relatively low miles, well built, good power, and good towing to a 18 that's bone stock... I personally wouldn't go back.

The 18 has better towing characteristics stock than the modded 05. The 18 is also more comfortable on long drives, which you mentioned you do. The highway miles with the family is the main reason we upgraded.

The 3rd gen's are real back seats, at least not after getting a 4th gen. They are better then a extra cab but still smaller than a full size rear seat.

Ram didn't get the CP4 until 2019 and their emissions systems have been very reliable from 15-18.

So for me it would depend on how you use it. There are going to be low mileage 5.9's still available but they won't be cheap and can still have issues.

Are you towing for all those highway miles? Is a diesel your best option?

Typically yes. I tow my Jeep or sometime other equipment. My wife is from another state and her father and me haul stuff back and forth to each other fairly often. I did give a gasser some thought but I really love diesels at heart. Thanks for you thoughts.

 

[AH64ID]

It's hard to not like these diesels... empty or towing.

There are some tuning options that keep the emissions equipment installed but disable the parts that are the hardest on the system, like the EGR. If you're out of warranty that might be an option. AFIK EFI Live is the way to go for a dirtymax, maybe talk to a tuner and tell them what you're looking for.

At this point I have no intentions of deleting my 18, but when my warranty is up I may do some selective tuning. I won't be uninstalling anything and I won't be increasing any power.

 

[Prairie Dog]

Sadly, I think the determining factor might come when you actually go out and look for a clean 3rd gen. I know someone who is doing that right now and everytime they think they've found something, it has issues - often hidden or at least undiscolosed.
I know where you're coming from though. I would like to have a new truck but from what I see around me, they just aren't reliable.

Scott

 

[promisedland]

I feel your pain, I will keep my 5.9 3rd gen till one of us dies.
I don't do long distance towing though.
Keep us in the loop!

 

[Ozymandias]

I wouldn't worry about a 2019 at all, but its a first year.
And it has the old transmission in it.

Better 2018 or then 2021.

Thats my opinion - but the 2019 is a real nice truck, have driven it, phantastic.

 

[Jeeper37]

Thanks for all your input. The opinions and experience help.

 

[pdxkid]

Well, since I'm in the market for a low miles, stock, clean 5.9 3rd gen I don't think you're crazy at all! Welcome to the club.

 

[jgillott]

As long as you keep in mind that the newest 5.9L is now 13 model years old, then you should be fine. I have one of the last of the '07 5.9L's, built 10/06 and purchased 5/07. Mechanically, except for the clutch, the drivetrain has been fine. Of course, there are the common ball joint and front u-joint replacements. The electrical system on the other hand has been quite a challenge from time to time. Just keep those potential trouble areas in mind when you are making your decision.

 

[pdxkid]

The electrical system on the other hand has been quite a challenge from time to time. Just keep those potential trouble areas in mind when you are making your decision.

I'm sure that this has been covered somewhere, but what are these "potential trouble areas"? I remember reading something about inspecting the wire harness going between the doors, at the B pillar. What else?

 

[DonFitzwater]

There are always those who have poor memory. Fondness of the past is a sure sign of a failing memory!

I still own a 12 valve. Every time I get in it for a road trip I’m all giddy and think it’s the best truck on the planet......then I spend 400-600 miles in the drivers seat and by the time it’s over I have gained a new appreciation for the 6.7 and the 4th gen truck it’s in.

I owned a 6.7 Powerstroke and after 3 turbos and 2 engines in 10,756 miles and a loss of around 20k dollars I found out what Ford’s were made of.

My recommendation is to pick up a nearly new used rig that’s still under bumper to bumper warranty. With an older 3rd gen you’ll be getting into broken wiring in the doors, broken hvac components, failing pcm’s due to age, injectors and lift pumps that need changing not to mention the transmissions that will certainly need attention at the mileage levels you’ll be dealing with.

 

[jgillott]

I'm sure that this has been covered somewhere, but what are these "potential trouble areas"? I remember reading something about inspecting the wire harness going between the doors, at the B pillar. What else?

Door wiring is definitely one of them. Just fixed the passenger side rear door last week in fact. I have had TIPM issues with this '07 for several years. Headlights failing, interior lights not working, dash lights out, etc. They began as random until the TIPM completely failed and couldn't be reset. I have also had ground issues. Though not expensive to fix, they are time consuming.

 

[promisedland]

The Early 06 models had a finicky electrical system. 03 to 04 had the best piston design. Regardless which year, these trucks need aux fuel filters to protect the injectors. And " I" definitely would tune the eng as factory tuning had very delayed timing, =EPA

 

[KParsons]

very interesting, my 13 year old 5.9 is fine normal maint.. if you can fine a garage queen from the south. might be worth it.

 

[SBashaw]

not all 06 5.9 have problems. I have 81,000 miles on mine and have towed about 50% of that. the only issue was a leaking rear seal that i replaced myself.

 

[Tuesdak]

Typically yes. I tow my Jeep or sometime other equipment. My wife is from another state and her father and me haul stuff back and forth to each other fairly often. I did give a gasser some thought but I really love diesels at heart. Thanks for you thoughts.

It's a love-hate relationship with diesels. It's becoming a better idea to get rid of them before the 100K warranty drops dead. Does the statement "If it wasn't for bad luck you wouldn't have any luck at all!" apply to you? If so own it and protect your pocketbook best you can with it.

Before you panic too badly about your current pickup you ought to price the CP4 time bomb went off "kit" that GM offers. I read the kit is about $2k for the CP4, 8 injectors, and other included parts that get trashed. Plus labor...

Found a 2WD 03 HO with 100K and a NV5600 back in 2013. Turns out the 1st owner blew the engine via a dropped valve seat or stuck injector. The repair was Krap using a dented up head and a repair sleeve that turned out to be moving in the block. When the engine lost oil pressure enough to rattle the pressure control valves in the oil filter/cooler assembly I rebuilt it. It lasted 500 miles and lost oil pressure again - this time the shop used a different block under their warranty. Rebuilt the NV-5600 while I was there. I have 6 months of driving a 'retired' GM 6.5 turbo diesel the 5.9 was supposed to replace because the 5.9 Cumapart was in the shop 2x with the engine scattered all over it waiting on the machine shop etc.

I have the value of the Dodge Ram truck in the engine and transmission at this point. Later The turbo shows it's worn bearings and 2 injectors fail. I put new BBi's in it. Years later it needs a dash and some other work. Looking at the value of the truck and what an insurance co would pay me for it I decided to go buy a new one that no one else managed to FUBAR, has a warranty, and without the 2019+ CP4 cheap proven ticking time bomb. Yeah the 5.9's never fail either - just ask around here. I tripped on a pile of blown 5.9's and 6.7's at the shop(s) where my engine was rebuilt/replaced, injector work, etc.

Regardless IMO the 6.7 is a better engine for brand new pickups aside of the injection system and emission controls. Don't even get me started about the Power Check GM's diesels write that their krap cooling systems can't cash unless you want to hear about washer fluid boiling in the tank under the hood and other survival situations in extreme heat with a GM diesel.

I am, in fact, dealing with this exact total loss vehicle value issue after putting a front end under another vehicle and other repairs that equal it's value. It was rear ended several months after the repairs and all we are getting for it is the vehicle value. Sunk Cost...

So again ask yourself do you really need a diesel or will a bulletproof 8.1 or 6.0 GM gasser do the job for the towing you do without interrupting your trip? You don't buy a 2500 or a 3500 for the MPG... But TCO for a diesel eats the MPG savings. If I were to buy a new diesel truck today I'd actually buy a GMC just to stay away from the CP4 AND I would plan on getting rid of it before the 100K emissions warranties expire. Replace emissions equipment on a high mile pickup or take the hit on a new pickup driving off the lot is about the same cost.

YMMV.

 

[mfurrh55]

I think I'll just stick with my 07, not completely trouble free...but close, no hvac problems, i do have a wire i think in one rear door that needs replaced, got rid of dual mass flywheel at 125k, replaced exhaust this past year, i do need a new drivers cushion, got rearend replaced at 80k, I'm at 198,300 right now, i also run auxiliary tank with filter and water separator prior to reg tank, oh and i upgraded front end to 09 style, put new ujoints all the way around and front hubs, but old hubs were still goodjust replaced because i was in the front doing u joints, i think I'll hang onto this truck, the ride may be better on the newer ones, but they have waaay too many problems for me, my .02. Monte

 

[Mschuman88]

I had any ‘02 that I sold because of the back seat (I have small children with car seats). Miss that truck.

I was dead set on buying a newer duramax. My father has owned them since ‘01 and has had great luck. However, this latest truck he has bought has had the same emissions issues you hear about often. So I looked for a 3rd gen dodge.

I Bought an 07 with 40k Last year. Had to pay but it was what I wanted. So far no issues and no regrets. And coming from an ‘02, it feels like a luxury haha. Only thing that does worry me is ‘07 is longer ago than it feels and things wear with age.

Good luck with the search.

I haven't been on here in a very long time. Several years. I have a general question with a lot of back story.

I currently own a 2014 LML Duramax. I bought it new in 2014. Prior to this truck I had a 2004 Ram 2500 CTD 6 speed. The 04 Ram had given me a bad last year of ownership with some very haunting electrical problems. It was one of the trucks that had the APPS under the driver side battery. It developed an intermittent problem in one of three harnesses. I ended up replacing all three harnesses after frying several APPS and a few ECM's. The problem did end up resolved but it was only after a year or two of financial drain and tears and frustration. So, in my frustration when the warranty for the repairs ran out. I sold it. When I sold it I bought the Duramax I currently have. I never deleted it or tuned it or anything. I was planning to delete it. After the latest rounds of the EPA hammering the diesel truck industry as a whole, I feel like deleting it is no longer an option. As ownership of this truck has gone on it has ruined one vacation and almost ruined another. Both times it was emission system faults. Once it was the DEF sending unit that went out and I got it fixed just in time to leave on vacation. The second time it got me the 9th injector stuck open when I was in the middle of nowhere in the U.P. of Michigan. I also smell coolant after driving it quite often and no one can figure out where its coming from. I've had all these experiences all while knowing that the CP4 on these trucks can grenade without warning and huge bucks to repair and the labor on this job is insane. I work at a GM dealer so I'm pretty aware of the Duramax problems overall. The kicker of all this. It's only got 74,000 miles on it. I'm pretty disappointed overall.

Stay with me here.

All the newer trucks are going to have an emissions or have been deleted. I also know that a lot of the newer Dodges and Fords(Not sure of years exactly) also have the dreaded CP4. They will also have either an emissions system or be deleted(illegal). I spend to much time on the interstates on trips to run around illegal. I know everybody knows a bunch of people getting away with it but I really believe it's going to get worse. Also, more and more shops are going to refuse to work on deleted rigs out of fear of being fined for doing so. The dealer I work at will send every deleted truck packing and forget about trading it in or working on it.

So, what I'm thinking I want to do is trade in or sell this Duramax and get an 06 or early 07 6 speed CTD with as low of miles and as clean as possible and just hope the older truck will go the distance for me. No need to delete it since it never had DPF systems. Also easier to work on than the LML Duramax and cheaper too.

AM I CRAZY FOR WANTING TO GO BACKWARDS ALMOST 10 YEARS? My wife thinks so but has given me the green light.

I cant do gen 2 because I need a real back seat. Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't the electrical systems of the 06 and early 07 better than previous gen 3's? Any info on what to look for while truck shopping is appreciated.

Thanks

 

[robmints]

IMO, you are crazy for wanting to go back 10 years. The older trucks tend to be project type ownership experiences. IOW, it's almost always something. Not that everything is a total breakdown, matter of fact, rarely a total breakdown. But the headlight doesn't work, back door window doesn't go up, front window breaks loose from regulator, another steering box, u joints, front seat foam, the exhaust fell off again, delaminating rotors, fuel tank strap broke, batteries again, bed rust..... I think you get my point. You are not going to find a new 06. I agree with others upthread, gas looks better and better everyday. Oh and if you don't go back before 06 yard still going to have a cat. So you are looking for 05 and older for something that can be tuned and be as legal as you want to stay. I guess you could technically keep a full exhaust with cat and tune it to run like you would expect a cummins to run. But I don't think that is very common. And I'm not sure you would be within the letter of law with that. At work we buy a lot of trucks. All the one ton and down are now gas.