Amsoil 3000 Diesel Oil

[Oil Man]

Ghillie,
This ones for you.

To every one on the TDR it is sometomes hard for me to not get so wound up in oil matters, and I have sent Ghillie an appology by e-mail and in the future I will try to keep it to just the facts. Sorry once again Ghillie.

Sincerely, Kevin

 

[Oil Man]

Subj: Re your post
Date: 2/27/00 11:54:39 AM Pacific Standard Time
From: KevinDinwiddie
To: ghillie@wildmail.com

Ghillie,
First, I would like to apologize. I should not have posted by attacking your credability as a detective, for this I am sorry.

Second, It's obvious you have not done much research on LE oil. Maybe it's because LE in the past has not been on the market for the general public. It has always been direct to the end user. Like to power plants or large trucking CO's. This is the reason that LE has not been investigated much. It's not your fault that you don't know about it. It's LE's fault that we have not been in the stores for you to ask about.

Third, I am being very honest about the difference between syn and petro oils. When you said the worst syn is better than the best petro then I have to answer that. My example is of two different oils, not talked about in the TDR. Both oils are from Castrol (what you would call a bigger fish than LE or Amsoil). The two oils are Castrol Syntec and Castrol Super Fleet. Castrol Super Fleet is the type of oil that LE markets against, Large fleets etc.

2 independent tests were performed;

#1
Falex Pin & Vee Block wear test (results are in weight lost in mg of test pin)
Castrol Syntec 64. 8
Castrol Super Fleet 17. 2

#2
TFOUT oxidation test (results are better the higher the number)
Castrol Syntec 195 min.
Castrol Super Fleet 243 min.

As you can see the difference between a syn and petro can be different than you stated. You however were right if you use an average petro and a good synthetic.

Yes, LE has the Data that you asked for. Send me your address and I would be glad to sent it to you. The tests is about 2 years oil and LE is in the process of having the newer oils tested also. The tests done on Amsoil 2000 gear oil was just done 2 months ago. I will send you that info also.

Please accept my apologies once again. I'm just trying to defend myself and I sometimes get passionate about it.

If you wish to publish this on the TDR you have my OK.

Sincerely, Kevin

Ghillie, I have posted the e-mail I sent you on the TDR for all to see. Sorry once again.

 

[Pete Peterson]

Henry, I'm not disputing synthetics as a superior oil to petro based oils and I only wish I knew how to pinch a penny, so when I say anything in regards to money its in relationship to it, not to really save a whole lot of it. Having worked with synthetics for 20 odd years in the aviation field, I know their great but at the cost and the long term benefit to me its just not there. I don't think the wear would be measurable in any two engines, one on each type of oil. Thats why this thread is interesting, and the thought of maybe Amsoil 15W40 sounded okay since its alot cheaper than the series 3000 5W30.
And you can pick on me any ol' time, #ad
it makes me feel wanted and loved #ad
#ad

Regards Pete

P. S. And I thought thats why they made trees, to have a place to dump your old oil! #ad
! Just kidding guys!!

------------------
99'3500,quad cab,4X4,a/t
3:54,all the right packages!

 

[Mr Freeze]

Oil Man;

I have never heard of any petroleam lubricating fluid that has a flash point of over 425 deg F. How can LE's petroleam 15W-40 keep its "coefficent of friction" to 570 deg F, well past the point where it will burn?

Rudy

 

[ghillie]

Oil Man,

I thought I should publicly accept your apology, even though we did that via email. We all can get passionate at times and maybe say things we shouldn't. Apology accepted.

I too have been a little pushy with my posts, I too am passionate about this subject. But I am open minded to someone, anyone, to prove to me that another lubricant is superior to Amsoil.

This is a great site, superior to the Ford site in many ways, to include knowledge base, etc. But mostly because Rob doesn't delete posts just because things get hot and heavy.

Big brother is alive and well at the Ford-Diesel site.

Cheers.

------------------
Reformed Powerjoke owner, 2000 model, 3500, SLT, Quad-cab, 5 speed, 4. 10, 4X4, straight piped.

NRA member

 

[Oil Man]

Amsoilman,
The answers to the 4-ball question is on the Ford sight www.ford-diesel.com
under the Upgrades and Aftermarket then Oil Man is back Mr Watson.

For those of you that don't want to visit the Phord sight the gist of it is that the accuracy of the 4-ball test is poor enough as to sway the test in others favor even using Amsoil's Numbers.

Yes Amsoil and LE are small players when it comes to Exxon-Mobil However LE markets their oils in 60 other countries besides the USA and has been in the Market since 1951 We own the most modern blending plant in the world and are a ISO 9001 manufacturer. Lets not get into a p&&^%ing match and try to find out which one is bigger. I know LE makes some of the finest oils in the world today.

Sincerely, Kevin

 

[Oil Man]

Mr. Freeze,
It's just that good.

Sincerely, Kevin

 

[Mr Freeze]

Hi Guys!

I noticed that AMSOIL ran the 4 Ball Wear Test with the 1800 rpm parameter that OILMAN claims favors a thinner oil on their 10W-40 and 20W-50 motorcycle oils. The result? The 20W-50 had a bit LESS wear than the 10W-40.

I have asked several lube engineers about the 1800 rpm favoring a lighter oil and all of them said that should'nt make much difference one way or another. But they all said that it is a more severe test.

Anyoue have any proof that the rpm change favors a lighter oil/

Rudy

 

[amsoilman]

I spoke on the phone with Byron Selbrede, the Technical Services Chief for Amsoil Inc. .
He informed me that the reason for testing the HDD 5W-30 along with the Delvac 1 5W-40, Delo 400 15W-40, Rotella T 15W-40, and the Cummins Premium Blue 15W-40 oil using a higher 1800 RPM and 150 Deg. C. temperature as apposed to the AME 15W-40 Amsoil, is that the higher temperature and higher RPM's is a more severe test, and they want to show the 5W-30 will protect against wear when compared to heaver oils.

Wayne
amsoilman

He also said the figures for the AME 15W-40 under this same test parameter(40 kg pressure @ 150 C. ,1800 rpm for 1 hour duration)is 0. 40 mm. In case you don't remember, the series 3000 5W-30 wear rate at this same test parameter, is 0. 391 mm.

Wayne
amsoilman

------------------
94'SLT 4X4 AT/White in color. Factory Tow Hooks & Running Boards. Amsoil By-Pass filter, Amsoil Air cleaner,and all fluids are Amsoil. Optima "Red Top" batteries.
BD exhaust Brake, BD Torque Lock, BD Torque Converter, Dr. Performance Stage II Injection Pump. Mag-Hytec Diff Cover,Mag-Hytec Transmission Pan, Isspro Pyro, Boost,Oil temp Gauges mounted in 3 Gauge post mount. One gauge monitors Engine Oil, Trans, Diff. Temps.




[This message has been edited by amsoilman (edited 02-29-2000). ]

 

[DocStressor]

Amsoil man, thanks for the straight answer on the 5W-30 vs 15W-40 4-ball comparison. The differences are probably not statistically significant, if indeed the 4-ball wear test really tells us much about the overall quality of a crankcase lubricant. I assume that Amsoil developed the 5W-30 product for increased fuel milage. Do you folks have any data comparing the fuel economy between the two products? I read an article showing data indicating that the major advantage of synthetic oil vs petro with respect to fuel economy is the result of lower viscosity and the resulting lower frictional coefficient at operating temperatures. The shear resistance of synthetics allows the use of lower viscosities without sacrificing protection. I am not trying to bust your chops or anything. I'm going to switch to Amsoil at my next change and do an oil analysis comparison with my present Delvac 1. I just would like to know if it is worth paying 50% more for the 5W-30.

------------------
1999 Quad cab 2500, SB, SLT, 4X4, 5-speed, 3. 54, tow and camper package, Lance 820 camper, Lance cabover stabilizers, Rancho 9000s, Airlift airbags

 

[ghillie]

Lee,

You are right on. That is the primary reason for Amsoil to market the 5w-30 oil.

And no, in my opinion it is not worth the added cost. By Amsoil's own admission the 5w-30 is not 50% better, so why pay the 50% more.

Also I am curious what your results with Amsoil vs Delvac might be as well.

Just a suggestion, you may want to do two oil changes with Amsoil and test the second, as a quantity of Delvac will be left in the motor after the first change, and may or may not be significant enough to change the results.


cheers.

------------------
Reformed Powerjoke owner, 2000 model, 3500, SLT, Quad-cab, 5 speed, 4. 10, 4X4, straight piped.

NRA member

 

[Pete Peterson]

Lee, you got it!! Synthetics are really the way to go but the price(there I go again) doen't add up. So if the 15W40 Amsoil is as good of protection as the 5W30 and half the cost!! Wayne!!!! Thats what you were suppose to have told us 6 months ago when in the other 5 million threads arguing over the oil benifits. Cummins says 15W40 but you were telling us dumbies out here about the 5W30. Now let me try to remember where in the hell my local Amsoil man is located:d #ad
:0 Slippery Regards Pete

------------------
99'3500,quad cab,4X4,a/t
3:54,all the right packages!

 

[DocStressor]

ghillie – I’m going to alternate Delvac I and Amsoil every 7500 miles for at least 2 cycles. The idea is to average the two oils over a variety of conditions (age of engine, towing, not towing, cold vs warm weather). Haven’t decided whether to use an Amsoil or Statapore filter, but the filter will always be the same. I will change the air filter every other oil change. I can only put on about 15,000 per year, so the test will take some time. The null hypothesis (that which the data will try to disprove) is that there will be no significant difference between the two oils. If I use the same oil twice in a row, I would be comparing wear metal accumulating in an engine 15,000 miles older with the second oil. It would then take 4 years to get in two test cycles. I do overnight drains, so I don’t think the amount of oil carried over would be significant.

Of course the results of one vehicle with one driver won’t allow any serious conclusions unless there are large differences between the oils. But if a couple other guys were to try this, we might be able to get enough statistics to uncover a significant difference, if there is one. Since these are both top of the line PAO based oils, there is no risk in doing the test. Once I decide on one oil, I’m going to go the bypass filter/extended drain route, which is the only cost effective way to use synthetics.

I’ve given the matter lubricant performance a bit of though and have decided that there is no way we are going to get meaningful product comparisons from the lubrication industry. There are two types of information out there: 1) laboratory tests that have been explained in great detail in the various threads relating to crankcase and differential lubes and; 2) test data from over the road truck fleets. The limitations of extrapolating lab tests, most of which were designed for gear lubes, have been debated in detail by the lube techs both here and at the F**d site. The fleet tests would seem to be more meaningful. However, most of us don’t drive out pickups the way over the road truckers drive their rigs. We have smaller crankcases, more cold starts, and more short trip. So I think the only way to learn if there is a “best” lubricant for our purpose is to do our own testing.

Before I get flamed, this really has nothing to do with cost effectiveness. I’m just an enthusiast who wants to use the best oil possible because of an obsessive compulsive disorder. But Pete, if there are no differences, I'd pinch a penny the same as you and go with the least expensive product.

------------------
1999 Quad cab 2500, SB, SLT, 4X4, 5-speed, 3. 54, tow and camper package, Lance 820 camper, Lance cabover stabilizers, Rancho 9000s, Airlift airbags

 

[Oil Man]

I saw this on the Ford sight and thought you guys might like to see it. contractor
Member
Posts: 2
From:brea,ca,usa
Registered: Mar 2000
posted 03-01-2000 01:45 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am a former representative for all the majors and have tried just about every lubricant including the Amsoil products in my search for the best lubes. You people are all crazy, After going to Chevron, Shell, Texaco, Mobil, Technical schools all across the country I feel I should tell you what I have concluded with. Chevron Delo 400 and Shell Rotella T have proven themselves in more engines in the world then any other products on the market. I for one don’t care what your oil does on a four ball wear test I care how oil works in my engine. Texaco and Unocal make better grease than the other majors do. Chevron borate gear oils have the edge for major brand products. When none of the products we normally sold worked we told our customers to call LUBRICATION ENGINEERS. Lubrication Engineers is the only product I have seen work where nothing else would, including Amsoil,
I do like Amsoil by-pass filters though. After retiring I have chosen to use what I believe is the very best which is LUBRICATION ENGINEERS products. Ten years ago it was an Amsoil rep that worked for the City of Palm Springs that initially convinced me L. E. was better. He ended up like me selling other products than the ones he used in his own vehicles.

Sincerely,
Mark
contractor
Member
Posts: 2
From:brea,ca,usa
Registered: Mar 2000
posted 03-02-2000 12:12 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin, I don't normally come by this sight, when I did I got a little worked up by all the mumbo jumbo. The amount of money that the majors spend on testing in real engines that are hooked up to computers, Inspected for wear, carbon deposits, etc… is incredible. I was not trying to insinuate that testing was unnecessary; I was trying to give certain individuals the clue that what something does on paper is not always what it will do in the real world. Tests are merely an indication and some tests have no basis in translating to reality. I was in the pits at a boat race in AZ and saw some wear in an engine that was being torn down for the finals. When I commented about it, The pit mechanic said "no you don’t understand: if there were no wear we would put more fuel into the engine until there was. That’s how we make more power and that’s how we win races. " The oil was allowing them to put more fuel in the engine with the same amount of wear they had before. The difference was now they were winning the race. At the time I was a bit annoyed by how well the L. E. oil did! I would not hesitate to buy any of the products I mentioned yesterday, I use L. E. because it earned my respect over a long period of time. I don’t think it is necessary all the time but it gives me piece of mind when my $6000 engine is trucking along.
I am from AZ, when I run out of oil E-mail me on whom to contact in Orange County.
Thanks,

Mark


Sincerely, Kevin

 

[Oil Man]

I saw this on the Ford sight and thought you guys might like to see it. contractor
Member
Posts: 2
From:brea,ca,usa
Registered: Mar 2000
posted 03-01-2000 01:45 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am a former representative for all the majors and have tried just about every lubricant including the Amsoil products in my search for the best lubes. You people are all crazy, After going to Chevron, Shell, Texaco, Mobil, Technical schools all across the country I feel I should tell you what I have concluded with. Chevron Delo 400 and Shell Rotella T have proven themselves in more engines in the world then any other products on the market. I for one don’t care what your oil does on a four ball wear test I care how oil works in my engine. Texaco and Unocal make better grease than the other majors do. Chevron borate gear oils have the edge for major brand products. When none of the products we normally sold worked we told our customers to call LUBRICATION ENGINEERS. Lubrication Engineers is the only product I have seen work where nothing else would, including Amsoil,
I do like Amsoil by-pass filters though. After retiring I have chosen to use what I believe is the very best which is LUBRICATION ENGINEERS products. Ten years ago it was an Amsoil rep that worked for the City of Palm Springs that initially convinced me L. E. was better. He ended up like me selling other products than the ones he used in his own vehicles.

Sincerely,
Mark
contractor
Member
Posts: 2
From:brea,ca,usa
Registered: Mar 2000
posted 03-02-2000 12:12 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin, I don't normally come by this sight, when I did I got a little worked up by all the mumbo jumbo. The amount of money that the majors spend on testing in real engines that are hooked up to computers, Inspected for wear, carbon deposits, etc… is incredible. I was not trying to insinuate that testing was unnecessary; I was trying to give certain individuals the clue that what something does on paper is not always what it will do in the real world. Tests are merely an indication and some tests have no basis in translating to reality. I was in the pits at a boat race in AZ and saw some wear in an engine that was being torn down for the finals. When I commented about it, The pit mechanic said "no you don’t understand: if there were no wear we would put more fuel into the engine until there was. That’s how we make more power and that’s how we win races. " The oil was allowing them to put more fuel in the engine with the same amount of wear they had before. The difference was now they were winning the race. At the time I was a bit annoyed by how well the L. E. oil did! I would not hesitate to buy any of the products I mentioned yesterday, I use L. E. because it earned my respect over a long period of time. I don’t think it is necessary all the time but it gives me piece of mind when my $6000 engine is trucking along.
I am from AZ, when I run out of oil E-mail me on whom to contact in Orange County.
Thanks,

Mark


Sincerely, Kevin

 

[Oil Man]

contractor
Member
Posts: 2
From:brea,ca,usa
Registered: Mar 2000
posted 03-02-2000 12:12 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin, I don't normally come by this sight, when I did I got a little worked up by all the mumbo jumbo. The amount of money that the majors spend on testing in real engines that are hooked up to computers, Inspected for wear, carbon deposits, etc… is incredible. I was not trying to insinuate that testing was unnecessary; I was trying to give certain individuals the clue that what something does on paper is not always what it will do in the real world. Tests are merely an indication and some tests have no basis in translating to reality. I was in the pits at a boat race in AZ and saw some wear in an engine that was being torn down for the finals. When I commented about it, The pit mechanic said "no you don’t understand: if there were no wear we would put more fuel into the engine until there was. That’s how we make more power and that’s how we win races. " The oil was allowing them to put more fuel in the engine with the same amount of wear they had before. The difference was now they were winning the race. At the time I was a bit annoyed by how well the L. E. oil did! I would not hesitate to buy any of the products I mentioned yesterday, I use L. E. because it earned my respect over a long period of time. I don’t think it is necessary all the time but it gives me piece of mind when my $6000 engine is trucking along.
I am from AZ, when I run out of oil E-mail me on whom to contact in Orange County.
Thanks,
contractor
Member
Posts: 2
From:brea,ca,usa
Registered: Mar 2000
posted 03-01-2000 01:45 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I am a former representative for all the majors and have tried just about every lubricant including the Amsoil products in my search for the best lubes. You people are all crazy, After going to Chevron, Shell, Texaco, Mobil, Technical schools all across the country I feel I should tell you what I have concluded with. Chevron Delo 400 and Shell Rotella T have proven themselves in more engines in the world then any other products on the market. I for one don’t care what your oil does on a four ball wear test I care how oil works in my engine. Texaco and Unocal make better grease than the other majors do. Chevron borate gear oils have the edge for major brand products. When none of the products we normally sold worked we told our customers to call LUBRICATION ENGINEERS. Lubrication Engineers is the only product I have seen work where nothing else would, including Amsoil,
I do like Amsoil by-pass filters though. After retiring I have chosen to use what I believe is the very best which is LUBRICATION ENGINEERS products. Ten years ago it was an Amsoil rep that worked for the City of Palm Springs that initially convinced me L. E. was better. He ended up like me selling other products than the ones he used in his own vehicles.

Sincerely,
Mark

These are posts that I found on the Ford sight.

Sincerely, Kevin



Mark

 

[Oil Man]

Sorry, I must have copied it over by mistake.
Kevin

 

[Sled Puller]

Merry Christmas! Back to the top for old times sake!
Gene

 

[Mike Vonada]

MGM, boy you like to stir it now and again dont'ya #ad
#ad

Good topic and I don't know why it is still in this Forum but she belongs in the Products and Accessories Forum so we will slide her over the wall to the Products and Accessories Forum.
Gene you can go to your room now! #ad

Merry Christmas,
Mike