Amsoil: Positive Feedback!

[Sled Puller]

AMSOIL Limited Warranty
Lubricants and Lubricating Fluids


AMSOIL INC. of Superior, Wisconsin, hereby warrants that its lubricants and lubricating fluids are capable of and suitable for meeting the specifications set forth in the AMSOIL Product Selection Guide, product data bulletins and written recommendations. It is the responsibility of the retailer, installer and/or purchaser to determine if these specifications are adequate and proper for the intended application.

AMSOIL, INC. of Superior, Wisconsin, further guarantees its lubricants and lubricating fluids against defective materials, design and workmanship. These products will not cause mechanical damage when used according to the company's recommendations in mechanically sound equipment. This warranty is subject to the following limitations:

The warranty herein applies only to lubricants and lubricating fluids, which are manufactured and or packaged by AMSOIL INC. and sold through a registered Dealer, retailer or installer of AMSOIL INC. products.

The liability of AMSOIL INC. shall be limited to:


Replacement of the lubricants or lubricating fluid.

The cost of labor, materials and mechanical components required to remedy the damage done to the equipment in which the AMSOIL product was used.



AMSOIL INC. shall not be liable for special or consequential damages such as, but not limited to, damage or loss of other property or equipment, loss of profits or revenue, cost of capital, cost of business interruption, and cost of replacement equipment. The remedies to the purchaser herein are exclusive. The liability of AMSOIL INC. arising out of the manufacture, sale delivery, installation, technical directions or repair of any lubricant or lubricating fluid, whether in contract, tort, warranty or otherwise, shall not exceed the value of the equipment in which said product(s) were used.

Consumer recourse in this matter requires the submission of a sample of the AMSOIL product used and, at the option of AMSOIL INC. , any damaged or related mechanical parts for inspection. All samples and parts must be submitted, freight prepaid, and accompanied by an inspection fee of $15. 00. Should the product be defective, freight costs and inspection fees will be refunded. Any damaged components submitted for inspection will not be returned, unless so requested, in writing, by the submitting party. In the event a dispute arises from the determination of AMSOIL INC. , it is suggested that the claimant retain a sample of the product in order to submit such a sample to an independent oil testing laboratory.

The warranty may not be extended to cover:

AMSOIL products that have become unduly contaminated by improper or irregular servicing or deficiencies within the equipment in which it has been installed.

AMSOIL products which have become unduly contaminated by improper storage and/or handling once they have left AMSOIL INC. 's premises.

AMSOIL products which have been repackaged, regardless of container, by anyone other than AMSOIL INC.

Any allegedly defective AMSOIL product for which a sample in unobtainable.

Any AMSOIL product which is used in applications not found in the AMSOIL Product Selection Guide or without prior written approval.

Any AMSOIL product which is used for longer service intervals than recommended by AMSOIL INC.

Any AMSOIL product which is used to lubricate any mechanical equipment subject to abuse, negligence, or racing.

Any AMSOIL product to which another product not manufactured by AMSOIL INC. , has been added.

AMSOIL INC. further warrants that it is the sole author of this policy and that no other warranties, expressed or implied, are authorized or to be considered valid.

Some states do not allow exclusion or limitation of incidental or consequential damages so the above limitations or exclusions may not apply to you. This warranty gives you specific legal rights and you also have other rights, which vary from state to state.

If difficulties occur, we suggest the following:

Contact your AMSOIL representative and try to resolve the matter

If the matter cannot be resolved, you may write AMSOIL INC.

Find more details at:http://amsoil.com/warranty.htm

Now Gary, I know you are going say :"It doesn't say 4 times the life"!!!!!
In the early 70's, this company made the first API Synthetic motor oil. Right from the get go, they told people 25,000 miles or one year. Now that number is at 35,000 miles.
Someday, you have got to let go and have a little faith! Follow Amsoil's instructions and join the ranks of thousands of satisfied customers.
Or sit back in chair, be happy with what you got, and keep laughing at us fools who are spending more per quart and enjoying the benefits of the original 100% full synthetic engine oil.
In fact Gary at this point, I think if you used Amsoil, and the dome light burned out, you would be blaming the oil! #ad

Gene




[This message has been edited by MGM (edited 03-20-2001). ]

 

[Extreme1]

O. K. Gary, here you go: 60,000 miles, 120,000 miles & 240,000 miles.
Note: all Amsoil prices are current retail, Rotella is to the best of my memory #ad


Shell Rotella T
Oil & filter change every 3,000 miles:
11 quarts @ 1. 65 = $18. 15
1 filter @ 8. 50
Total per change = $26. 65
Times 20 changes = $533. 00
Now go recycle 55 gallons of drain oil. (Assuming no consumption or leakage)

Amsoil
No oil or bypass filter change, 2 full flow filter changes and 3 oil analysis kits.
11 quarts @ 8. 10 = $89. 10
1 filter @ 8. 50 (Purolator)
2 Amsoil filters Full flow @ 18. 15 = 36. 30
1 bypass filter @ 29. 40
15 quarts make up oil @ $8. 10 = 121. 5
1 bypass kit @ $161
3 oil analysis kits @ $14 = $42
Total: $487. 80

This is the sweet part #ad

Since you agree that the engine will outlast the truck, we will keep going (at today's prices). So for the next 60,000 miles:

Shell Rotella T
$533

Amsoil
15 quarts make up oil = $121. 50
3 full flow filters = $54. 45
1 Bypass filter = $29. 40
4 Oil Analysis kits = $56. 00
(Should be every 15-
18,000miles for me)
Second 60,000 mile total: $261. 35

Total to 120,000 miles:

Shell Rotella T: $1066. 00

Amsoil $749. 15

You may note a trend. It continues.
At 240,000 miles:
(I know, you will probably be on your 3rd new truck by then but... )

Shell Rotella T: $2132. 00

Amsoil $1271. 85

O. K. , here is where I have to make a disclaimer: #ad

This is my truck. The truck you own is your truck. They are different. Your results may vary.

Guess I should fix that leak. #ad


A 120,000 mile summary:
Rotella users have changed their oil 40 times to my NONE. That's alot of time to save. Rotella users have generated 110 gallons of waste oil. That's alot of trips to the waste oil dumping station.
Amsoil users have more time and money to BOMB. #ad


Nothing against Rotella, I used to use it before I switched.

Anybody want to buy some Amsoil?
E-mail me.

Eric Tipler
Extreme Motorsports


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'94 3500 4x4, 209,000 miles, Never had a cat, Auto w/shift kit (thanks Dave G), 3. 54 Gears, TST #5 plate, 235-85-16s, Rancho 9000s w/remote, Isspro Gauges & Amsoil Air, Oil & Bypass Filters & Lubes, AWOL intake boot.
Punchlist: X-Mount Mirrors, 14 cm Turbo Housing & 215 Injectors.
NRA member.
Blue Ribbon Coalition member.
"Warrantee? We don't need no stinking warrantee!"

 

[Extreme1]

One more quick note:

The above scenario utilizes Amsoil Series 3000 5w-30. The 15w-40 retails at 5. 05 bananas.

In all fairness, I think a 3,000 mile drain interval is excessive. Some of you don't. Maybe I have that impression because I haven't drained my oil for about 2 1/2 years. #ad


But you still have to consider:

1) All the benifits of what alot of us have come to realize is the best sythetic we can put in our engines. (Remember, engine life is expected to be shortened by higher output no matter what lubricant you use. )

2) With regular oil analysis we know what is going on and can spot trends that may indicate combustion, gasket, air filtration and other issues before significant damage is done.

These have an added value not realized by using a mineral based oil with short drain intervals and no analysis. You get it for free.

Eric Tipler
Extreme Motorsports


------------------
'94 3500 4x4, 209,000 miles, Never had a cat, Auto w/shift kit (thanks Dave G), 3. 54 Gears, TST #5 plate, 235-85-16s, Rancho 9000s w/remote, Isspro Gauges & Amsoil Air, Oil & Bypass Filters & Lubes, AWOL intake boot.
Punchlist: X-Mount Mirrors, 14 cm Turbo Housing & 215 Injectors.
NRA member.
Blue Ribbon Coalition member.
"Warrantee? We don't need no stinking warrantee!"

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"O. K. Gary, here you go: 60,000 miles, 120,000 miles & 240,000 miles.
Note: all Amsoil prices are current retail, Rotella is to the best of my memory"

AHHh - you just don't get it do you! Your example quite DETERMINEDLY ignores/denys the FACT that you CAN easily extend the service life of current petroleum-base oils AS WELL as with the synthetics!

Here. I'll underscore it for you:

IT IS ENTIRELY POSSIBlE, WITH MODERN DINO OILS AND OIL ANALYSIS, TO *EXTEND* OIL SERVICE INTERVALS WELL BEYOND "NORMAL" INTERVALS!

Synthetics MAY go longer, but they ARE NOT the ONLY oils capable of extended service intervals, PERIOD! Feel free to label ME a "hard case" when it comes to synthetics in the crankcase - but ALSO recognize that when YOU so clearly, deliberately suggest or imply that SYNTHETICS are capable of extended intervals, but dino oils are NOT, you fall into that same "hard case" Amsoil sales hype that turns off so many in groups like this!

YOU know MANY over-the-road big rigs employ greatly extended service intervals with dino oils - and so do many of US - so why pretend it isn't happening? Many of us ALSO know european auto manufacturers are already substantially extending their recommended service intervals in their cars using conventional oils, and our own domestic makers are right behind them in doing the same.

I have NO problem with fair and equitable comparisons of performance - but get disgusted and turned off with clearly slanted and deliberately misleading info - as the posts immediately above are! YEAH, this subject keeps resurfacing, and few dispute the benefits of synthetics - but I refuse to stand meekly by as distorted OPINIONS are presented as FACT!

If you Amsoil salesment wanna claim the OPINION that you feel comfortable and safe with extended oil change intervals, that's fine and dandy - but to assert or insinuate that it's NOT possible to do the same with conventional oils - in an obvious effort to slant things in your favor - is just plain WRONG! Nor does it win you many friends or supporters!

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http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

[This message has been edited by Gary - KJ6Q (edited 03-20-2001). ]

 

[DocStressor]

Question: How many old diesel guys does it take to change a light bulb?

Answer: They can't do it. (Change? What do you mean, Change?)

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1999 Quad cab 2500, SB, SLT, 4X4, 5-speed, 3. 54, tow and camper package, Lance 820 camper, Lance cabover stabilizers, Rancho 9000s, Airlift airbags

 

[Bob Riley]

Gary, simple fact. Regular petro may be extended yes, but under your buck, not the oil co's. It is not warranted for this type use. If it fails, you pay for the damage.

Amsoil is warranted for extended use. If it fails, they will pay for the damage. That's why he used the example.

Bob

 

[Big K]

Hey guys, you're getting off track again. Lighten up.

 

[DocStressor]

Now that sounds like a nicely controlled test, Wayne. It gets around the problem of different driving habits. You would have to conclude that the Amsoil and bypass filtration will very significantly extend the life of an engine. Too bad they didn't do a comparison without bypass filtration. A good experiment only uses a single variable.

BTW, do you have the reference for that issue of Yachting?

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1999 Quad cab 2500, SB, SLT, 4X4, 5-speed, 3. 54, tow and camper package, Lance 820 camper, Lance cabover stabilizers, Rancho 9000s, Airlift airbags

 

[Sled Puller]

Gary will freak out on this.
He will say:" PUT THE BY-PASS ON BOTH!"
Better keep diggin to satisfy this guy Wayne!
gene

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

C'mon MGM - be nice now! #ad
#ad


All I've done here is attempt to separate the FACTS from the rank opiniated BS! IF, in the process *I* have been unfair, just point it out!

But YES, you are correct, placing a bypass filter on only ONE engine WOULD most likely tilt the readings (otherwise, why do any of us bother to install one?) - and if the test had been the OTHER way around in final results and engine setup, the Amsoil guys would UNDOUBTEDLY cry foul... #ad


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http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

 

[TowPro]

I am not against this product, but this test shows ME that the bypass filter filters out stuff the standard filter don't, thus the lower amounts of what they show as "wear". Now if they tore down the motors and SHOWED the different amounts of wear, that would be something to show.

Originally posted by amsoilman:
The BIGGEST return in the test was the fact that the engine with the Amsoil equiped lube had produced significant reduction of wear in all wear metals, and the percentage of Total Solids showed a reduction of 66 percent!

Wayne

 

[mikepvg]

1) There should be no doubt from anyone that Grp IV & V based synthetics will perform better than any dino oil or even traditional PAO synthetics.
2)It you want to see the real advantage: DEFINATELY PUT THE BYPASS SYSTEM BOTH MOTORS. You can only test 1 variable @ a time to get OBJECTIVE results.
3)Whether or not going to synthetics or a by-pass system is cost effective is dependant on each individual situation. Lets say I triple my ave Cummins life from 300,000 to 900,000 miles. I put on about 15K/yr. It would take me 60 years to reach overhaul. I love my truck but I hope I'm not still driving it 20 years from now let alone 60 years from now! I don't think I would be even be allowed on the Hwy with my truck @ that point! #ad


Gene
Down to how many microns can the by-pass filter effectively filter?

I think you guys will like this article #ad


WHY IS PARTICLE CONTAMINATION CONTROL IMPORTANT IN DEISEL ENGINES?
"There is a saying common in business today that states 'You cannot control what you cannot measure. '" Historically, traditional oil analysis has been the tool our industry has used to measure and control engine contamination with one main exception - diesel engine oil particle counting. Why is this problem a critical issue?
* Particle counting provides you with the earliest detection and warning of critical engine wear analysis of critical engine wear symptoms.
* Smaller particles (less than 10 microns) cause the greatest engine wear.
* Existing spectroscopy technology (FTIR) is unable to provide accurate and reliable information at these critical low levels.
* OEM filters are designed to trap particles down to only the 30 to 40 micron level.
"Recognizing that we have problems in both measuring and control let us first step back ask the question of how does wear particle contamination finds its way into the crankcase? We have found that we can categorize these sources into five major entry points:
1. Manufacturing Contamination: wear metal debris remaining after OEM or rebuilding machining and assembly.
2. Operation Contamination: wear metal contamination particles generated under normal running conditions.
3. Lubrication Contamination: particles exists in both new, as well as, make-up lubrication fluids.
4. Ingestion Contamination: particles ingested through oil breather caps, seals and blow by past piston rings.
5. Combustion Generated Contamination: soot contamination is formed as a byproduct of the combustion process. It starts as a sub-micron sized particle which then conglomerate together with others to form a major wear component. "As it turns out, it is this last item, combustion generated soot, that is the primary source of the problem. Traditionally, soot in diesel engine oil has presented our industry with the difficult challenge of successfully and economically measuring particle contamination. We will discuss overcoming this barrier later in this article.
WHAT LIFE EXTENSION OPPORTUNITIES ARE THERE FROM CONTROLLING DIESEL OIL CONTAMINATION?
"Over the years, it has been our experience that with an aggressive four point contamination control program your ability to double or triple diesel engine life is an attainable goal.
"How is this possible? First some background on the subject. Oil contamination particles are present in diesel engines from the sub-micron size to particles exceeding 40 microns. Today, most engine manufactures continue to install and specify filters that are designed to be effective in controlling wear particles at only to the higher 30 to 40 micron levels. "It is critical to know that extensive laboratory analysis and field studies confirm the fact that 0 to 10 micron sized particles cause 3. 5 times more wear than particles larger than 10 microns! This fact may sound backwards until you consider oil film thickness. Major wear is caused by these smaller micron particles because they can enter and compromise the critical oil film thickness layer that separate the moving parts in your engine such as rings, rods and bearing clearances typically designed and engineered to these very same 0 to 10 micron ranges.
The Cost Vs. Benefit Ratio:
"It is everyone's experience both on a personal and business level, that tells us that there is a direct correlation between Cost vs. Benefit. It is the evaluation of that ratio that determines whether our decision is a "go" or "no-go. " The comparatively low cost of implementing a contamination control vs. the dramatic cumulative effect of extended service life and lower maintenance costs that make this ratio an extremely positive financial one.
"These benefits are all based on the laws of physics and good basic engineering practices with the savings and added productivity going directly to your bottom line. "

You can download "Diesel Engine Particle Counting - Best Practices" and other articles from: http://www.noria.com/pnp/efiles.html

Mikey


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94 2500HD 5sp 4. 10LSD 4X4 RWAL w/GearVendor OD, K&N Oval w/ Pre-Filter, Straight Exhaust, Geno's Fumotovalve, AW-Direct Idle Controller, Mag-Hytec Rear, 126K miles. NRA Member. V1.

 

[Sled Puller]

I believe it functions at 97% at 3 microns or above. I may be off, I have CRS with all these numbers. I'm sure I will be caught if it is off!

Gary,
You are right! The By-Pass gives ANY oil an unfair advantage. I actually have a little non-scientific test going on inadvertly right now!
Steve St Laurant is running an expensive Petro based 15W-40 oil and an Amsoil By-pass unit.
I am running Amsoil 5W-30 and an Amsoil SDF 80 full flow only.
Now, Steve has a heavier weight oil, and better filtration. His tests should be almost perfect, like new oil.
The last we checked, his tests were about even with mine with half the miles.
Now of course we know all the different variables, so this is more something to discuss, rather than proof positive. But I find it interesting.
Next year they be completely opposite, depending on BOMBing and loads put on the truck.
Gene

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

WELL, I keep hearing conflicting opinions from various "experts" on the subject of bypass filtering and its effect on accuracy of oil analysis - and I pretty easily decided that I would FAR rather have cleaner oil and less accurate analysis than DIRTY oil and an accurate wear count!

And when I win the lottery, derned if *I* don't switch to Amsoil too... #ad


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http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

 

[amsoilman]

Gary,
A few years back, "Yachting" Magazine did a comparison test on a twin engined Tiara 2700 Pursuit boat. They used the rational that this would give a very excellent way to test the protective strengths of a motor oil against another, where the two engines were running in the exact same enviroment under the same exact conditions.
Both engines were 265 HP Volvo gasolene engines. They first did oil analysis on the two engines to determine the engines condition and establish a baseline. they ran both engines on petrolium for a total of 100 hours to determine this. Then one engine was filled with petrolium oil and standard filtration, the other was filled with the 15W-40 Diesel/Marine oil and a by-pass oil filtration system from Amsoil Inc.

The test went on for some 17 Months/215 hours of operation. At the end of 118 hours of operation, oil analysis concluded the oil in the petrolium lubed engine was in need of changeing as the (Fe)Iron count was out of specs at 596 ppm. The engine with the Amsoil lube installed was only 96 ppm (Fe)Iron with the same amount of time, 118 hours.
At the end of the 215 hours the Amsoil equiped engine had only been changed one time, and the petrolium equiped engine had been changed two times. The Amsoil equiped engine still showed the oil to be servicable at that time.
The BIGGEST return in the test was the fact that the engine with the Amsoil equiped lube had produced significant reduction of wear in all wear metals, and the percentage of Total Solids showed a reduction of 66 percent!

Wayne

------------------
94'SLT 4X4 AT/White in color. Factory Tow Hooks & Running Boards. Amsoil By-Pass filter, Amsoil Air cleaner,and all fluids are Amsoil. Optima "Red Top" batteries.
BD exhaust Brake, BD Torque Lock, BD Torque Converter, Dr. Performance Stage II Injection Pump. Mag-Hytec Diff Cover,Mag-Hytec Transmission Pan, Isspro Pyro, Boost,Oil temp Gauges mounted in 3 Gauge post mount. One gauge monitors Engine Oil, Trans, Diff. Temps.
Wayne Owen

 

[Deezal Man]

Gary, I love you man!!! #ad


Please don't change... My day started off crappy... Then I logged in here. . Read a few posts and... well... . I found my smile again.

Your absolutely right about the extended intervals with petroleum oils. . Most times it just isn't cost effective to do so.

------------------
98. 5' 24v 2500 Auto/3. 54 4x4 SB QC 285-75-16's on Alcoa's. Everything but leather. PIAA 1200's, AMSOIL dual filter relocation system, Smittybuilt Stainless Steel Nerfs, Rhino Liner(Junk), K&N air filter(For Sale)15 year AMSOIL dealer. Time permitting, Soon to include Ultra-lite Pyro,0-50lbs boost, Trans temp in the pillar. Rancho 9000's with in cab adjustment.

 

[amsoilman]

Lee Webber,
The issue of the "Yaughting" magazine is July 1996.

Wayne

------------------
94'SLT 4X4 AT/White in color. Factory Tow Hooks & Running Boards. Amsoil By-Pass filter, Amsoil Air cleaner,and all fluids are Amsoil. Optima "Red Top" batteries.
BD exhaust Brake, BD Torque Lock, BD Torque Converter, Dr. Performance Stage II Injection Pump. Mag-Hytec Diff Cover,Mag-Hytec Transmission Pan, Isspro Pyro, Boost,Oil temp Gauges mounted in 3 Gauge post mount. One gauge monitors Engine Oil, Trans, Diff. Temps.
Wayne Owen

 

[DocStressor]

Thanks Wayne!

------------------
1999 Quad cab 2500, SB, SLT, 4X4, 5-speed, 3. 54, tow and camper package, Lance 820 camper, Lance cabover stabilizers, Rancho 9000s, Airlift airbags,Reese Titan V hitch, Mag-Hytec differential cover with Amsoil 2000 75W-90 lube, Amsoil air filter

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"Your absolutely right about the extended intervals with petroleum oils. . Most times it just isn't cost effective to do so. "

YEAH, that's the way I see it too, so far. After all, why absorb the added expense of regular oil analysis in order to be assured you're not exceeding your oil's capability, when with conventional oils, it pretty cheap to merely CHANGE the oil - and not MUCH more expensive than the cost of analysis! #ad


Yeah, OCCASIONAL oil analysis is still a good way to monitor for unusual wear situations - but hardly needed at every oil change interval.

I buy 6 gallons of Rotella T for $28 at Sam's Club - enough for 2 oil changes = $14 per change plus the filter - not a bad deal! #ad


------------------
http://community. webshots.com/user/davison71 Early '91 250, 727 AT, 307 rear... Banks Stinger exhaust, intercooler... US Gear OD... MORE than a match for every new PS Ford encountered so far...

[This message has been edited by Gary - KJ6Q (edited 03-22-2001). ]

 

[ted kidd]

Changing your oil is inconvenient. I change the oil on my motorcycle - not my idea of fun.

Even if I had a 3 gallon pan, I wouldn't do it on my truck. So that means I'm going to a shop. Also not fun. My trip to Alaska was over 9k. Carrying a truck camper means a 3000 mile change interval. That's NOT FUN x 3, plus a multiple for NOT FUN while on vacation.

I made a siphon out of a rubber stopper with a long and a short hose through it - makes sampling at 10k real easy. I sample my atf too. The guys at Blackstone are great. They will call my cell if I'm traveling and should change my oil (or just to find out how my trip to Nova Scotia was going).

My next test interval is 30k.
Could I use regular oil with my bypass? sure.
Would regular oil last this long? probably.
Would I get the same mileage, heat protection and cold weather starting lubricity? doubtful.
After 30,000 miles do I care if I spent $15 or $60 on the oil? no.

I am totally psyched that I haven't been to jiffy lube once, much less ten times. And I like having a historical oil "blueprint. "

------------------
tedstruck 2500qc, no leather or abs
bigfoot & other travel pics 1500 bigfoot, no auto waterheater or microwave.
Cool Summit Pass Pics, & Alaska Journal
AMSOIL Battery Mounted Dual Remote


[This message has been edited by ted kidd (edited 05-04-2001). ]