Amsoil??

[DFrank]

So how far are people pushing their synthetic oil? 600K on the same oil, just by changing filters sounds amazing. How often do you change the filters? What extra filters are people runnig on these trucks?

 

[nwcatman]

Originally posted by BillGotthelf

I put the series 3000 synthetic in at 15,000 miles and put the same in trans at 20,000. I have a 96 L-8000 dump with a Cummins 8. 3 275hp motor. It now has 618,000 miles and I have never changed the oil since 15,000. Oil tests indicate the Amsoil is within specs to keep using. It might be the bypass filter works good too.

are you kidding?

 

[RowJ]

Nwcatman & DFrank

Never changed the Oil in 600,000 miles does not mean the original oil is still in there. Every time you change filters, you add new oil.

Bypass Filters are excellent for those who drive lots of miles or keep their CTD for many years. They are a second (denser) filter that filters small % of the oil every hour to capture much smaller particulate and contaminates.

Obviously they allow for some amazing long duration oil changes.

They are expensive but easily justified by many working trucks when weighed against downtime and (in some cases) monthly oil changes.

I drive 50,000 miles a yr and have run the numbers - can't justify a by-pass system for myself; and without one I like the idea of getting all the crap out of my engine every so often. Just my personal feeling!

I would be comfortable running a good quality synthetic oil, like Amsoil, with a good filter (amsoil, Baldwin, Fleetguard) - 10,000 miles between oil & filter changes with out Oil Analysis. That's without heavy towing. With oil analysis, depends on your type driving.

 

[KKlepfer]

I hear ya RowJ,



I agree its good to change your oil to get all the crap out of your engine. But how do you know what and how much crap has gotten into your engine? And whether their is enough to justify an oil change?



My point is get an oil analysis done. It creates a baseline and tracks what, how much, and how effective your oil is? I think you'll be surprised at how much more you can get out of an oil change by periodically changing your oil filter. Oil analysis are cost effective. Over time you will eventually discover (quantitatively) what is the appropriate change interval for your driving conditions and habits.

 

[KKlepfer]

Good point Rowj,



I only meant to sight Amsoil as an example. I also use fleetguard for testing.



Sounds like you and I are on the same page. I'm not suggesting analysis every time unless you just enjoy seeing what's in your oil. But I think it's important to set a baseline and that might take three or four tests. Now I understand your original post better, your interval is at 10k so perhaps 600k is bit of an exaggeration. Don't mean to put words in your mouth but thats what I'm deducing.



I haven't identified my interval yet and I suspect it will be extended with synthetic. You notice I'm not suggesting any particular brand of oil just synthetic.

 

[nwcatman]

Originally posted by RowJ

I did do oil analysis the first 3 changes (tried 5,000; 10,000; and 12,500 miles) That's how I came up with the recommendation for 10,000. I don't tow but haul up to 9,000 lbs regularly.

I still do O. A. every 6 months or so to check for coolant etc. in the oil. Because of clearing out the system @ 10,000 I know there isn't a lot of crap that can accumulate.

Anyone who wants to do Oil Analysis every time is ok with me-but my expirience with customers is - most don't have (or make) the time.

Also, I have a small problem with having oil analysis done by the manufacturer of the oil I'm using. Call me suspicious but it opens the door for a possible conflict of interest.

$17. 00 from Amsoil sounds high! I use Cleveland Tech -a national laboratory. Got 10 prepaid kits last July (incl TBN) for $120. 00.

I have cut open more than my share of "good" oil filters, and know I have miles to spare with my Baldwins at 10,000 miles. That is, unless I hit a dust storm in west Texas!

i was born and raised in west texas (el paso). do they have dust storms out there? hahahahaha

 

[Sled Puller]

Originally posted by nwcatman

let me ask this, has anyone been denied a warranty claim due to the fact they were using amsoil? or any good synthetic.

Not that I know of with Amsoil. If it did happen, it was the owners fault for not alerting Amsoil, that a dealer was trying to get away with it. Amsoil has contacted dealers before and got things straightened away, without going to court.



Somebody was talking about an Auto trannys warranty denied because they used Amsoil, but it was about 4th person, and never got to the bottom of the facts.



Synthetics are here to stay.

 

[ACerf]

oils

I agree with Steve M. Why get into a hassle over a warranty issues because of the type of oil used. The maximum amount of miles you could go would be 15K. And I think the cost of the Amsoil would be twice that of regular oil. You are going to have to have oil analysis done annually in order to prove that the oil is not effecting the engines wear. There are many Diesel engines out there with millions of miles using good old oil. If you use what Cummins and DC recommend, and I am talking about API certified oil non-synthetic, you are going do just as well. I spoke to someone the other day that had 600+k on an engine running regular oil with no problems. I will stick to the Delo, which is what MOPAR uses as there vendor oil. Rotella would be my next choice! But like they say, everyone has there own opinion, and maybe some of us are just set in our ways. I have to admit I do use Dura-Blend in my cars. But that is only 30% Synthetic blend. Which I noticed Amsoil brought out ther 7,500 Mile oil, which I believe is a blend. Enough said on my part about the subject!

 

[Sled Puller]

Re: oils

Originally posted by ACerf

. I have to admit I do use Dura-Blend in my cars. But that is only 30% Synthetic blend.

I just have a few questions.



Are you using Dura Blend because it is 30% synthetic, or 70% Good Old Oil?

It sounds like you are scared of synthetics, and feel "safe" using only a little bit.



If that is the case, why bother with synthetic at all?



If you don't think a full synthetic will give you any better protection then regular oil, a blend is really a waste of time, is it not?

IMHO, don't bother with the blends, either run full synthetic, or not.

We could go one step further, and buy the cheapest oil you can find, and see how it does over a few hundred thousand miles.

 

[yogibear]

Something else to think about, what would it do to the big oil co. 's if "everyone" would use synthetics?!?! I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't behind some of this BS about synthetics not being used, and voiding warrantees. These big oil co. s have their fingers in everything!



Larry

 

[ACerf]

oil

To answer Sled Pullers question. Yes, I think that the Blend is little better than regular oil, and far less expensive than full synthetic. For me I change the oil in my cars at 4,000 miles and it is more cost effective to use the Blend or regular oil. Do they make a blend for diesels? I have not seen any on the market. But why does Amsoil make a blend if there is no reason to use it? And frankly I am not conveniced that a full synthetic is any better than using a blend or just regular oil. If I were to buy the cheapest oil and I changed it regularly, and used a quality oil filter. I bet I would still get good results. It is a known fact that the dirt that gets into the oil is the reason that makes it necessary to change the oil, not the oil itself. That is why oil filters are important to help keep the crap out of the engine.

 

[RowJ]

ACERF

"It is a known fact that the dirt that gets into the oil is the reason that makes it necessary to change the oil, not the oil itself. "

________________________

This statement is not completely accurate. Base Oil does not wear out. Additives do. These include (in Engine Oil) Detergents, Dispersants, TBN Enhancers (acid fighters) and the long list of Anti-Wear components listed on an Oil Analysis. All of these are depleted as they are exposed to heat, friction and pressure.

 

[ACerf]

My statement is accurate, in the fact that under normal driving conditions most of these additives will last for many thousands of miles before they breakdown. And the point of this was that the amsoil would still have to be changed due to dirt and soot in the engine. In the past have run oil analysis on aircraft engines, both jet and conventional. In the case of Jet engines which run at much hotter temps and higher RPM than a diesel engine. Most of oil will have deposits in it that cause harm to the engine, with very little breakdown of the additives. To that end, results in changing the oil due to dirt and other deposits. In some cases changing out the engine. As long as conventional engines have air intakes they will get dirt in the engines... . that is as simple as it gets! Which makes the technical aspects of additives meaningless, other than it makes the oil last longer, and perform better under high heat. And hopefully make the engine last longer! Years ago engine oil had no additives in them, but they did have high amounts of ash and other foreign matters. But the oil was still changed due to dirt!

 

[KKlepfer]

RowJ your technically right, about additives in oil that can wear out or become ineffective, but statistically damage/failure to internal engine components are a result of either dirt or coolant. These are the two most common reasons for internal engine failure.



That's why I agree with one of the previous posts that state you can probably use the cheapest oil out there with recommended intervals and achieve high mileage/hours on an engine.

 

[ACerf]

Thank you KKlepfer!

 

[JJW_ND]

Not sure I agree..

I don't think soot will even reach 50% of the point were it would be flagged by a lab in 100K miles on the same oil. These engines create little or no soot (stock or slightly modified).



As far as "dirt", that is something filteration will take care. Stock full flow filters will keep things in check out past 24K, bypass will keep "dirt" in check indefinetely. This assumes one is running a good air filter. I have sampled my oil every 6K and not have over 240K on the engine with a variety of hard pulling years, uprated power and arctic operation.



My advice with synthetics is everyone who operates in temps below -15 (especially cold starts without being plugged in) should defineatly run them regardless of how little miles they run annualluy. Synthetic to me is defined as 5W## oil not 15W synthetic. Need the 5W with arctic conditions. Otherwise I think somewhere around 24K+ annual miles will start to benifit from the cost and time save with less oil changes. This would have to be increase if one starts running Dino oil out to 15K. I still read most change it every 3 -5K which makes the Synthetics much more economical.



I also agree that 90% of Dodge diesel users will either sell their truck or not put enough miles on it to every notice either the detrimental effects or positive gains from either type of oil.



Run what makes you sleep well at night!



JHMO... .





jjw

ND

 

[amsoilman]

RowJ,

Also, I have a small problem with having oil analysis done by the manufacturer of the oil I'm using. Call me suspicious but it opens the door for a possible conflict of interest.

FYI

Amsoil Inc. does not do the oil analysis. It is done by (CTC) Cleveland Technical Center, the same one you use!



Corporate headquarters are located at:



192-194 Internationale Blvd



Glendale Heights, IL 60139



Amsoil does infact sell the kits, and they do receive each report from CTC if the user has Amsoil that was analyzed.



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[amsoilman]

ACerf,

Which I noticed Amsoil brought out ther 7,500 Mile oil, which I believe is a blend.

The 7500 XL Amsoil is a FULL SYNTHETIC!



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[ACerf]

If the 7500 XL is a full synthethic, than what is the difference between the other Amsoils?

 

[Edward]

One of the major reasons I use synthetic oil is the turbo. This hasn’t been discussed yet but any synthetic will lubricate better at higher temperatures than any conventional dead dinosaur extract. The major reason for turbo failures is lubrication or I should say the lack there of. The cold hard facts are conventional oil will cook to asphalt inside a turbo well before any synthetic. This is not the only reason I use synthetic oil but it is one of the major reasons.

The issue of warranty and the use of Amsoil is not really an issue at all. Amsoil meets and or exceeds all of the specifications that DC or Cummins has established for oil used in their engines. The following quote was taken from the Amsoil website.

NEW VEHICLE UNDER WARRANTY

The use of AMSOIL Synthetic Synthetic Heavy-Duty Diesel and Marine Motor Oil will not void new vehicle warranties. New vehicle warranties are based on the use of oils meeting specific API service classifications and SAE viscosity grades. AMSOIL Synthetic Heavy-Duty Diesel and Marine Motor Oil meets the current API and SAE requirements and is perfectly suited for use in any new vehicle stipulating those requirements in its owner's manual.

Edward