Anatomy of a coolant filtration system

[Gary - K7GLD]

I'm suprised that you of all people would not tout the frantz as the king of all filters, including coolant.

NAHhhh - I value the Frantz for the TYPE of filtering it does - not the specific brand - there are other TP or paper towel filters that undoubtedly will do the same job - Frantz isn't by any means the only player in the game - just one of the more popular ones, and the one I happen to use - the coolant filter setup discussed in this thread is much the same - others are available, or can be assembled from scattered sources - the primary interest is not a "brand name", but what they do, and how effectively.

There has been multiple threads over at Bitog about using a frantz or motorguard as a coolant filter. Below is a link to a recent one that has excellent pics. Although I do agree with you though, and thats why I bought the baldwin unit, as it was designed for coolant filtration.

WELL, I've certainly missed out on the use of a Frantz or Motorguard setup for coolant filtration - wonder what special cartridges, or treatment is involved to keep the element from falling apart in the hot water coolant stream? Believe me, the ordinary TP as used effectively for OIL filtration, WILL fall apart in hot water - and I wouldn't even remotely consider using it on any engine I thought much of, regardless of whether it was a Frantz setup, or something similar.



Guess I'll take a stroll over to the BITOG site, and get educated... :-laf

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

WELL, checked out the coolant filter/Motorguard thread on BITOG - looks like only 1 guy has tried it, has 2 threads, 1 on the install, the other after running it a while and showing accumulated crud. The pic of the used TP cartridge looked scary to me - like a lump of jelly... Still don't think I'd want to try it - also noticed the accumulated crud in the filter housing cavity, where it would be hard to clean out - I think I prefer the throw-away canister in this application, where ALL the crud gets tossed! :-laf

 

[05mxdiesel]

WELL, I've certainly missed out on the use of a Frantz or Motorguard setup for coolant filtration - wonder what special cartridges, or treatment is involved to keep the element from falling apart in the hot water coolant stream? Believe me, the ordinary TP as used effectively for OIL filtration, WILL fall apart in hot water - and I wouldn't even remotely consider using it on any engine I thought much of, regardless of whether it was a Frantz setup, or something similar.



Guess I'll take a stroll over to the BITOG site, and get educated... :-laf

I'm not sure but I think they are using normal tp, Gary. Ralph Wood has discussed before that he has sold numerous motorgurds for people to use as water filtration devises, since TP can filter smaller than fecoli bacteria. Here is another link to another tp coolant filter user. Looks like normal tp to me.



You'll be changing that baldwin unit soon for a upgraded frantz coolant filter.





Changed the TP in my MG coolant bypass filter - Bob Is The Oil Guy



Will a Bypass Coolant filter overheat my brake lin - Bob Is The Oil Guy

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I'm not sure but I think they are using normal tp, Gary. Ralph Wood has discussed before that he has sold numerous motorgurds for people to use as water filtration devises, since TP can filter smaller than fecoli bacteria. Here is another link to another tp coolant filter user. Looks like normal tp to me.



You'll be changing that baldwin unit soon for a upgraded frantz coolant filter.





Changed the TP in my MG coolant bypass filter - Bob Is The Oil Guy



Will a Bypass Coolant filter overheat my brake lin - Bob Is The Oil Guy

NAHhhhh - I suppose I'm being as "unreasonably critical" as the guys who doubt use of TP for oil filter elements - but those pics show substantial distortion and possible deterioration of the TP element, as compared to same stuff removed from an oil filtration system - I'll chicken out, and keep what I have... :-laf:-laf

 

[05mxdiesel]

NAHhhhh - I suppose I'm being as "unreasonably critical" as the guys who doubt use of TP for oil filter elements -

Thats the first thought I had to your reply. It reminded me of the first few pages of the oil filter thread you created. I almost couldn't believe it when I first read it. I guess us guys who got converted to tp users have to keep our leader in line too.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Thats the first thought I had to your reply. It reminded me of the first few pages of the oil filter thread you created. I almost couldn't believe it when I first read it. I guess us guys who got converted to tp users have to keep our leader in line too.

I'm betting a person could literally pull off soggy chunks of that used TP cartridge - not quite the same stability and strength as the equivalent TP cartridge after use in an oil bypass setup - or even a fuel filter, such as mine at 10K miles or so:



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Or the oil filter at 3K miles:



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OR, would ya prefer to see THIS when you service yer coolant filter:



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Severe distortion of the TP pack - inner core GONE, or so deteriorated as to be unrecognizable, and clear evidence of the soft sogginess on the side, where it was apparently gripped to remove it from the canister.



NOT for ME!



My first rule of mods as installed on my truck, is "Do NO harm!" - after all, my own modification path is intended to IMPROVE the truck, extend it's lifespan while improving it's efficiency - not damage it!



The above Frantz or Motorguard (doesn't matter which, they'd both do the same thing! ) coolant TP pic was reportedly taken after relatively few miles and short time-span - wonder what it would look like after the 12 month period the Baldwin is suggested to remain in use?



Truly, I appreciate the adventurous efforts some guys like to pursue, and their willingness to post their results in photos and text - in THIS case, it fully reveals a path *I* have no intention of taking! :-laf

 

[05mxdiesel]

I totally agree with you. I just wanted to prove to you that a roll a tp could withstand water filtration. Coolant filters like the baldwin are a dime a dozen when it comes to the trucking and heavy equipment industry and thats why I chose it.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

A TDR member noticed my reference to a cooling system "Anode" I made earlier in this thread - it's probably not worth a special thread, so I'll focus on it here.



"Sacrificial Anodes" are used commonly on metal objects subjected to water immersion, either occasionally, or full-time - outboard motors, and other fresh or saltwater items are quite common. The fact that dissimilar metals submerged in fresh, or saltwater, will generate electrolysis - an electrical current flow, carries with it the usually damaging effects of metallic erosion, creates the need for a method to counter that phenomena - thus, anodes.



The function of the Anode - Zinc Anodes seem most common - is to introduce into the system a softer and more easily attacked (Sacrificed!) object for electrolysis to be drawn to - leaving other system metals relatively protected and undamaged.



The device I have is much like the coolant filter this thread is about - they are available from several sources - or a guy could fabricate his own. I don't remember the brand or source for mine, but it had been pointed to in an older thread on this or another board, so I bought the one seen here - they are not expensive, and LOTS cheaper than a radiator core!



Here's mine:



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Here's what it looks like after about a year in my radiator:



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Sorta cruddy - but what's UNDERNEATH all that accumulated crud?



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Notice all the obvious pitting and erosion of the Zinc Anode material - THEN imagine that erosion inside your radiator or heater core - or other scattered parts inside the cooling system!



Check some of the threads here on the TDR, about guys needing to replace a leaking radiator or heater core, and the work and expense involved - then ask yourself if the $10 or so for a Sacrificial Anode is worth the cost to YOU!



Here's a pointer to more info, including a method to check out how vulnerable YOUR cooling system is to electrolysis damage:



aluminum radiator technical information



OK, so again, this is usually a longer term protection item - guys trading trucks every few years can probably avoid the eventual expense caused by electrolysis - and pass that on to the NEXT owner - but to guys like me, who plan on long-term truck ownership, the expense and maintenance are easily worth the cost!

 

[PRout]

OR, would ya prefer to see THIS when you service yer coolant filter:

#ad



My first rule of mods as installed on my truck, is "Do NO harm!"

Yikes! Case closed on this issue. . One of my co-workers brought up the point of TP being water soluble. This pic confirms it enough for this user to go with a filter media designed for the purpose.

The Anode is interesting as well. Gonna have to find one of those "Magic Goodies" too.

 

[AKAMAC]

Gary,

Great anatomy series continuation.

I'm just wondering if you are feeling OK. ):

You didn't go Terminator on the knuckle head who suggested use of "water soluble" media for a water based system. Then actually went PC and showed the fallacy with pictures from reported success stories w/o using metaphores.

What is the world coming to?

Good job, Mike

 

[Mad Bomber]

I ran a RPS van for 8 years and it had the International 7. 3 non turbo it had a coolant fiter and the filter has DCA additive in the filter.

 

[PRout]

Hmmm. . Wonder if the guy in the brown suit brought my package from Dieselsite yet today. . That is, the device that is made to filter "coolant" systems. .

Only one problem, running outta sig space. :{

Moderators, Can we please have more room in our sigs?? How about anyone with less than 10k posts on the TDR can have 50 extra characters. .

 

[Mad Bomber]

Hmmm. . Wonder if the guy in the brown suit brought my package from Dieselsite yet today. . That is, the device that is made to filter "coolant" systems. .



Only one problem, running outta sig space. :{



Moderators, Can we please have more room in our sigs?? How about anyone with less than 10k posts on the TDR can have 50 extra characters. .

Now the company is called Fed-Ex ground for bussiness any of them still have the same one expect they have turbo on them.

 

[FLynes]

So Gary, now that you installed the coolant filter, do you find you have more power, especially since you took the Smarty off? :-laf:-laf:-laf



Sorry buddy, I couldn't resist.



In all seriousness, though, I need to order one for my Powerjoke... I don't know what IH was thinking, but their casting methods just plain suck... casting sand is the leading cause of EGR cooler and oil cooler failure on these 6. 0's.

 

[PRout]

Just finished up the installation of this kit today. Its good to know you are cleaning the coolant while you're driving. .

Obviously the filter gets pretty hot when flowing coolant. Mounted it to the top of the right frame rail at about under the passenger seat, just in front of it rests the Giant Gulf Coast oil bypass filter. This is the first "Coolant" filter I've owned, so its kind of interesting how it will perform. When I screwed the filter up in place, I had filled it with water pump lube first to mix into the system

Question: Does anyone know what the micron rating of the Baldwin 5134 coolant filter is?? I looked all around and didnt come across it. Or if it was a snake maybe it could have bitten me.

Nice unit all around. I used the 90* fitting on the engine pick up point and pointed the barb straight back. Ran the hose that way along the side of the valve cover and tied it up across & down to blend it in to the return line and the 2 other 3/8 lines that go down the frame rails to the Gulf Coast Oil filter. Sure am running out of available locations to install much. .

Things aughtta be staying pretty clean inside these engines for the owners that have installed multiple bypass filters. . The oil sure is, about to take a sample for Grins & gigles. The coolant looked great at about 40k miles. Was surprised since that was before adding the coolant filter.

Gary has found another winner here.

 

[SHobbs]

Thought I would revisit this with a question being that I have one on order. Can you tie into BOTH lines coming out of the firewall? I see Gary tied into one line then connected another to the head so how bout using both lines instead of the head? Not that I am saying anything is wrong with what Gary did just another alternative. If you can utilize both lines which is leaving the head and which one is returning?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Thought I would revisit this with a question being that I have one on order. Can you tie into BOTH lines coming out of the firewall? I see Gary tied into one line then connected another to the head so how bout using both lines instead of the head? Not that I am saying anything is wrong with what Gary did just another alternative. If you can utilize both lines which is leaving the head and which one is returning?

I believe the vendor-suggested method of installation provides a decent and relatively constant pressure differential for proper coolant flow thru the added filter - trying to instead place the filter element in parallel with the heater core would likely NOT provide a constant, or sufficient coolant flow, and compromise filtration efficiency.

 

[SHobbs]

Gary,



Thank ya sir. I am planning on the same mounting location where you placed yours. The reason I asked was that I was thinking I could run the hoses down low along the frame where the filter head will be located instead of across the top. Where can I locate the fitting you used to connect it to the head?



Thanks

Scott

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

The fitting at the head is a common combination of 3 brass fittings from the local ACE hardware - an elbow fitting/adapter, into which is threaded the 3/8 inch hose barb - you need to do it that way to allow the head fitting to turn, and thread inro the head without interference with the valve cover - unless you prefer to remove the cover, and use different adapters...

 

[steved]

Question: Does anyone know what the micron rating of the Baldwin 5134 coolant filter is?? I looked all around and didnt come across it. Or if it was a snake maybe it could have bitten me.

The Wix equivalent is 27u nominal (50%??)...