Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Another 53 block cracked

[GKinney]

53 revenge

Hey guys... . even though I am not unfortunate to have the '53 block, it ticks me off the hear how Dodge/Cummins is weaseling out of this. I think the media would be a good place to hit them below the belt. You would have to check with a lawyer to make sure you didn't say the wrong things, but I bet a nice editorial in the Detroit freepress with lots of signatures at the bottom would wake them up not to mention making new customers think twice!! This is the 5th Dodge/Cummins I have owned since they came out and believe me it makes me wonder about another one. The sad part is all our good quality we once knew is now gone over seas,, Brazil, China, etc... . pretty DAMN sad!!!! You can thank the big corporations and the government for that!!! (aka $$$$ talks, all us poor little guys walk) I feel bad for all those involved in this ugly nightmare... hope you kick some Chrysler butts!!!

 

[JGK]

Ok, here is the response I got from Chrysler.



Dear David,



Thank you for your email to DaimlerChrysler Motors Corporation... blah, blah, blah...

David, unfortunately, you got just what you should have expected - a nice, useless form letter.



It's all a matter of numbers to these guys. They know there will be a few disgruntled customers here and there but for every one there are thousands of happy ones.



It takes a ton of time and just as much money to mount any kind of effective campaign to get their attention if the problem is not a serious safety issue that would cause a recall. They know this and they build it into their prices.



That's not to say you and the other cracked-block owners don't have a valid issue. Its just not a major (i. e. significant number or safety related) problem. Sorta like the KDP.



What we need here is someone who is financially flush and has a lot of time on their hands that gets a kick out of taking on companies over matters like this. Some one who makes a sport of it. I have no problem joining fellow members here to put some dollars into a war chest to fight this. But you need someone to lead the charge. However, unless wives and children are getting stranded along the highway in the middle of winter or trucks are catching fire and buring people, its going to be a real uphill battle.



On the other hand, a member here had his engine fail prematurely a few years ago and DC gave them the same reponse you got. He was not financially able to fix it. I think a number of TDR members pooled their funds to buy this guy a new engine outright. At the same time, they made a big noise to DC. Eventually it got to the right person and I think DC stepped in and put in a new engine. That is rare, but it does happen. But that was a unique situation.



Anyway, hate to rain on the parade. But that's the reality of it. I'd love to see them step up, but I'm not holding my breath. And if they did start taking responsibility, you can bet every new CTD they sell would have another $500 or some such added to the price to cover the cost.



Oh, and by the way, I'd bet the ranch Ford, Chevy and all the others would be/are the same.



OK. I'm done. Next...



-Jay

 

[jwernert]

My brother has a 99 that cracked. We called 2 cummins dealerships and 2 differnt Dodge Dealers. My other brother even works for one of the Dodge dealers. The best deal that we could come up with was $6500 for a new short block they would do the work and just swap the block, using everything off of the cracked block. We got a motor out of wrecked 02, and put it into the 99. it was a pain getting all of the computer gathered up so that all of the electronics would work. We did get the 02 to work and now the truck runs like new. My brother had a local shop the does the cummins work for our dealer, swap out the #53 block with a #55 block. He had new rings put in and had the head checked out. The rebuilt motor is for sale, if anybody is interested. Good luck in getting your truck fixed.

 

[TJany]

ok, i'm not a metal worker or anything, but heres an idea i think i'd try... drill the ends of the drack and grind it out, than heat the block and braze it... seems like a good idea, but i have no idea if it would work or not... any thoughts?

Tim

 

[JeffD]

I did the Lock N Stitch repair to my 53 block a few weeks ago. No problems as of yet. It held 30psi when we tested it, and the repair went smoothly. The guy on the phone at Lock N Stitch was very helpful, and said if we had any questions, just call. It took us about 24 hours total for the repair, as we pulled the motor. Had it out Friday night, and back in and running on Sunday night. The auto takes quite a bit more time to do the R&I.



When you drill into the block, you can see that one area is thinner then the rest, but if you do not stop it early it will keep cracking, even in the thick area.

 

[brianMo]

Good luck Jeff D. My 53 was done almost 4 weeks ago with locknstitch. We manage to get it done in the frame. Was only a 3 inch crack. We seen 3/8 to 1/4 difference in the span of the crack.



My eyes and nose have been working overtime since. I flush the cooling system over the weekend. Was sure nasty looking. Who knows if that contributed or not. Let us know how yours works out.



Brian

Missouri

 

[GBrock]

It is not surprising that "DaiperBenz" or Cummins could care less about 53 block owners. What is surprising is the complete ignorance of the buying public and the dedication and loyalty to one product that so many show. I could care less whether I drive a Ford, Dodge, or GM, it's the company that stands behind their product that I show loyalty to. So far, GM and Dodge have repeatedly missed the mark. This is my first Dodge and will be my last. I axed GM years back for their shoddy workmanship, stuck with FORD and was quite happy. I eventually made the switch to Dodge becuase I sold my F450 CC and was in search of a new rig. Many blindly stood behind the Cummins and Dodge product and I bought into their misinformation. I was ignorant.



When I purchased my '99 2500 Cummins it had only 27,000 miles on it so I expected little problems (still has less than 28,000). It was only after I joined TDR that I began to read about the 53 block issue. I remember asking the dealer why the owner would sell such a clean and low-mileage truck. His response? "He went back to GM and bought a Duramax. " It appears as though this owner learned a thing or two about the 53 block and bailed Dodge before problems could develop. Can't say as I blame him but "f" him for passing on his lemon to me. Fortunately, however, I bought a 4 YR/ 48,000 mile warranty. They say the block will be covered but I know warranty companies so I will prepare for a fight when and if the block does indeed crack. Frankly, it will be amusing to sue all three companies... Dodge, Cummins and the wty company. Even if I win nothing, I will enjoy the experience of being a legal "pain-in-the-***" to them. Then again, maybe the wty company will cover the block failure when and if it happens.



What is extraordinary with this issue is not the behavior of Dodge/ Cummins but rather the behavior of Dodge/Cummins OWNERS. When they see how Daimler and Cummins weasel out of their responsibilities, they just shrug their sholders and go buy a new '05 model... . which only serves to benefit the corporations that caussed the problem in the first place. Now that's shoing them! Funny thing is, I read the 3rd gen boards and those owners have just as many, albeit different, problems as we 2nd gen owners do... . only they have a huge car payment to go with it. New Dodge owners speak of how great their truck is and how "reliable" the motor is. Duh! It's new!!!!! Of course it's great. Talk to me in 5 years after you've towed hard and put 250,000 miles on the rig. THEN tell me how great your truck is.



I will ride out the Dodge storm until my warranty expires, then it's back to FORD. I know Ford has problems as well, and perhaps they would behave much in the same manner as Dodge/ Cummins, but I have yet to see them stoop to the sort of cowardice as Dodge and Cummins have.



BTW gents, before you flame away at me, I know Cummins is a good motor and tries hard to work with 53 block owners. At the end of the day, however, they fall severly short if they are not willing to back their product. I don't care if the wty is expired. They show no ethics when they avoid owning up to a problem that is so clearly their fault. Someone was asleep at the wheel at QC when they built the 53 block, they ought to pay for that irresponsibile disposition by swapping out a new block for all those who experience the crack. I would venture to say they have more than a 100% markup in these blocks and merely see a 53 victim as a way to increase revenue.



I am surprised I wasted so much personal time commenting on this issue but perhaps it's my contribution to the fight against those who clearly perform injustices on others (Dodge/ Cummins to the 53 owners). Many who advise 53 Block owners to "cover up the problem and sell your truck" are suggesting we stoop to the level of Dodge/ Cummins. Just as I was wronged by buying a truck that has potential problems and not being made aware of it, I would never do the same to the next problem. It's the wrong thing to do, the buck stops here.



Good Luck to all the 53 owners. Shame on those who support Dodge/ Cummins in their quest to ignore their responsibilities.

 

[DavidC]

Gbrock,

Good post. Thanks for your time. Sometimes I see the American public leaning towards being sheep. Seems alot of people will get crapped on and say thank you can I have another. The American public caused most of this ignorance by companies and they are the only ones that can stop it. I wish people would stand up for the things they know are wrong but I do not see much of that happening. This 53 block issue should have been taken care of a long time ago by the two companies involved and no expense to the owners. It would have been the right thing to do. As far as I am concerned I recieved a healthy dose of crap and will not ask for another. I did not sell or trade the truck after knowing the problem or when the crack happened. I still have a conscience and knowing that giving some one else this problem would not be the right thing to do. People have different morales. I wish a lot of businesses would remember theirs.



Dave

 

[GBrock]

DavidC,



Thanks for the accolades. I see that you swapped out a 53 for a 56 block. Just curious, what was the final tally on the cost of that engine swap? Are you happy with the 56? Did Cummins cut you some slack on the pricing?



BTW, my cousin is a mechanic at a Dodge dealership. He is one of the top mechanics in the country by measure of certifications and licenses. He is a walking encyclopedia about cars and trucks and tells me things I haven't even heard of on any website forum. I felt I did plenty of research when I repeatedly consulted with him about buying a '99 2500 with 27,000 miles on it. That said, he has never heard of the 53 block issue. He drives a Ford and is more of a Powerstroke man but he does work on the Dodge trucks and has even been invited by Dodge to fly to Detroit see the factory operations there (man, he has told me stories about how they do thing there). The fact that he hadn't heard of the 53 issue is probably due to never having faced a cracked block at work before. One thing he has done though is completely swap out Cummins engines which failed due to other reasons. One recently failure was due to the owner driving through a river and ingesting water into the engine. He told me the final bill for the new motor was... . $14,000!!! When I asked why so much he said markup! The way the dealer, and everyone else involved sees it, anyone buying parts from them is a revenue source. The markup was probably greater than 100%. I have no problem with dealers and manufacturers making money but 100% markup on a big ticket item is painful for some. Yeah, this guy shouldn't have been so ignorant about trying to cross a stream/ river but does everyone have to gouge him for his mistakes? Apparently so. Everyone ought to beware of such financially painful ramifacations when faced with similar circumstances.

 

[DavidC]

GBrock,

I apparently got off easy. $2700. 00 and yes Cummins cut me some slack. The down part was that this was out of my pocket 5 years 2 months 53k miles. One thing I definately know with a lot of companies is if you make a mistake no matter how trivial you will pay to rectify it. I am old enough that this was not the norm at one time. If the companies make a mistake ie. 53 block, you will still pay. After the block was replaced and Christmas arrived the family sat around the front of the truck as I put the tree on the valve cover. Every one admired their Christmas present they received for at least the next two years.

There are still some companies that treat the customer in a fair manner, but they are slowly fading away. I do not know what vehicle I will own next but any Chrysler vehicle is at the bottom of the list, if they even make the list. Maybe a Kenworth. And yes I am happy with the 56 so far. But it only has 3k miles on it.



Dave

 

[GBrock]

Dave,



Glad to hear things worked out OK for you. While I'm sure $2,700 is hard to swallow for an engine repair, I'd say you got off quite lightly if you're running a whole new block. I'm sure you'll be satisfied. I'm also glad to know Cummins helped out somewhat even if it wasn't enough.



I wholeheatedly agree with you about the Chrysler thing. Hopefully my rig lasts 4 years but when it's time to move on to another truck, I will be going with a Ford unless Toyota releases a one-ton diesel by that time (my local dealer says they have something coming in 2007 or 2008, it will be built in San Antonio). The amusing thing about this whole 53 issue is that some will say, in their infinite support of their beloved Mexican-produced Dodge truck, "well, you're out of the warranty period so why should Dodge/ Cummins be responsible?" I've got three reasons why: 1) Both Dodge and Cummins make the claim in print that the "life expectancy" of the Cummins engine is 350,000 miles. Er, um... . 53 blocks are failing with as little as 30,000 miles on them, a far cry from 350,000 and mileage value and so low that it would probably make these engines go down in history as the most-unreliable motors ever built. Sounds like a manufacturer problem, hence their culpability. 2) Lawyers... if a sharp enough law firm got hold of this issue and turned it into a mammoth class action lawsuit, Cummins/ Dodge would be settling out of court in no time at all. It would be at that moment when everyone would step back and think, "well, yeah, of course Dodge/ Cummins is responsible. " It's just a shame that it takes lawyers getting involved to prove who is responsibile. 3) IT'S THE RIGHT THING TO DO!!! Need I explain this?



Ironically, when there is an airliner crash/ train wreck/ boating mishap, it is very often the airplane/ train/ boat manufactures that are found at fault even though the airplane is 20-30 years old and certainly out of the warranty period by that time. In fact, I remember reading last summer about how Onan and Kohler (maker of boat generators) were found at fault for a number of Co2 accidents in the mid-1980s. 20 years later they are paying the price for bad Quality Control of their gensets. It turns out that someone at both companies chose to go with a cheaper exhaust piping thereby saving $2. 40 per generator. This cheaper pipe cracked and allowed dangerous Co2 to enter the boat cabin resulting in numerous deaths. Kohler/ Onan admitted fault... 20 years later, a full 15 years past the warranty period. Needless to say, I was in the market for a genset for my boat at that time. I paid $2,000 more and bought Westerbeke instead. It's a matter of principal.



Further to this, Ford recently recalled over 2,000 F150s due to a fire that can be caused by a fault cruise control mechanism. ALL of these trucks are out of the warranty period. Not only is Ford recalling them, they are paying damages in the millions for fires that have burned down entire homes as a result of the owner parking in the garage and the truck catching fire 10 minutes after it was turned off. Again, all of these trucks are out of the wty... yet Ford is striving to do the right thing.



When I learned of this 53 Block issue I happened to be in the market for new car for my wife at that time. We had pretty much settled on the PT Cruiser Turbo and we even worked out the final pricing with the local dealer here. As I read more and more about Chrylser's attrocious behavior with 53 owners, I became more disenchanted. Eventually, I decided to no longer contribute to Chrysler and instead bought my wife a Toyota Scion Xb. Hopefully more people like me vote with their wallets and stop supporting companies who go out of their way to screw the public.



Keep us advised on your new 56 block. I'd love to know exactly all that went into replacing the block sometime

 

[canblue]

Lead fix??

I had someone suggest that I solder/lead the area over the crack. Has anyone tried this and does it work? Yes I have one of the "53" blocks that is cracked. The truck has 172,000 klm on it. Not a happy camper. In Ontario Canada, there does not appear to be many reported block problems or there is no local user group to collect the data. Thankfully TDR is around.

 

[Sled Puller]

Good luck Jeff D. My 53 was done almost 4 weeks ago with locknstitch. We manage to get it done in the frame. Was only a 3 inch crack. We seen 3/8 to 1/4 difference in the span of the crack.



My eyes and nose have been working overtime since. I flush the cooling system over the weekend. Was sure nasty looking. Who knows if that contributed or not. Let us know how yours works out.



Brian

Missouri

How is the Locknstitch holding up?