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ATO 48RE Transmission Built for Towing

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LUK clutch info?

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Well done. Thanks for sharing it. Not so sure about his temp guidelines. If I had to let up at 180 deg I might as well get another brand truck.
 
If I had to let up at 180 deg I might as well get another brand truck.



Thats pan temp as he recommended sensor in the pan. Probably about right for the location.





Excelllent write up and explanations on how to make a good transmissions even better.
 
Thats pan temp as he recommended sensor in the pan. Probably about right for the location.





Excelllent write up and explanations on how to make a good transmissions even better.



I still think that's a little high. I've IR'd my pan and gotten 190-200 on the outside surface.
 
Dang! When it is 110 outside, my ATF is almost at operating temps when I start the truck! I see it get up to 190 or even 205 when I am towing hard... but only when I get into stop and go traffic. Normally, when I am towing and the lockup switch is on, the fluid doesn't get above 180. The guage is in the pan and its a Hughes Racing double deep aluminum number.
 
Actually my temps in lockup don't go over 180 either at the hottest place. . the cooler line coming out of the TC... . when in lockup. It's when it's not in lockup you gotta watch. I can get 230+ coming out of the TC. Anybody that pulls heavy under 50 mph needs to keep a close eye.

Pan temps are not the greatest indicator of fluid heat exposure but it does dampen the information given to the driver a little so we do not to get too concerned. Technically you want to know how hot the fluid is getting... no matter where that may be. They say that place is the cooler line coming off the TC. Monitoring that spot is downright scary.
 
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I checked on the 180 degree fluid temperature in the pan figure. Jim, from ATO Transmissions, says the 48RE transmissions he builds typically run 15-25 degrees cooler than the stock 48RE, mainly because of the extensive use of Torrington thrust bearings instead of thrust washers. With his transmissions, the primary source of heat generation is the front pump, in addition the planetary gears are always under thrust and producing a minimal amount of heat.



Most of the heat is generated by the torque converter when it isn't locked up. The valve body converter feed circuit supplies pressurized fluid to the converter. As soon as the converter is completely full, the fixed vane impeller starts driving fluid through the turbine, after which it goes through the stator (which acts as a torque multiplier) and then the fluid goes to the cooler(s) and back to the transmission. The heat is created primarily by the friction of the fluid striking the vanes of the turbine. Heat can build up quickly when the truck is accelerating a 25K pound load or pulling a long grade.



Which torque converter is used and where the stall speed is set will have a big effect on fluid temperature. If the torque converter is set up with a higher stall speed, it will generate heat faster than if it is set up with a lower stall speed. The lower stall speed results in improved fluid coupling between the impeller and the stator, which improves efficiency as well as generating less heat.



It is always good to have the temperature sensor in the transmission oil pan. The cooler return line to the transmission carries the fluid after it has circulated through all the internal components of the transmission. After the fluid has returned to the pan, the temperature sensor can now show the lubricating temperature. (The lubricating temperature is the temperature of the fluid being supplied to the transmission components). The temperature sensor on the return line before the transmission will not show lubricating temperature, or if the temperature sensor is on the out line before the cooler it will read very high temperatures. If these temperatures are important, simply use a two way toggle switch for temperature out and temperature in. With everything working correctly, the transmission fluid temperature should run between 150 and 180 degrees. If the transmission is worked hard enough, the fluid temperatures will go higher. Never let the temperature exceed 280 degrees on the return side of the cooler.
 
It is always good to have the temperature sensor in the transmission oil pan.



Its not wrong to put it in the pan, just not the optimal point for the most information. Pan won't show temp spikes or consistent high temps when your in non lockup mode and need to downshift or loack the TC, hot line will. Hot line is a better monitor of current load conditions to be proactive with, the pan is a time delayed mixture that is onlt reactive.



The cooler return line to the transmission carries the fluid after it has circulated through all the internal components of the transmission.



Cooler return line is before the fluid is circulated, or commonly called lubricating temp. As a rule if everything is working correctly in normal conditions it will be 45 to 55 degrees less than pan temp or hot line temp in lockup.



After the fluid has returned to the pan, the temperature sensor can now show the lubricating temperature. (The lubricating temperature is the temperature of the fluid being supplied to the transmission components).



The pan sensor shows temp AFTER the fluid has lubed and cooled the trans, but, its also a mix of hot fluid being dumped from the TC when the lockup clutch is disengaged. You have to be careful judging temps here becuase there are multiple things contributing.



The hot line will function pretty close to a pan temp sensor when the lockup clutch is engaged. Generally its within 10 degrees of pan temp, then, when in fluid coupling its measuring max and sustained temps due to load. As I said, much more current load info is obtained by monitoring hot line temp.
 
Got to try out the ATO transmission

We took the truck out this weekend with the new transmission. It shifts very crisply and you can feel each shift distinctly. We are running just a little over 150 degrees when cruising along locked up and around 180 degrees when the tranmission is working. Ambient temperature was high 80s.



One item to note: removing the torque converter drainback valve is not easy. Jim chucked the hose end in a lathe and drilled through the valve and pushed everything through the hose and out the fitting from the back side. I don't know if the check valve could be removed with hand tools.



Next step is to get the Toyhauler out and see what it tows like!



I appreciate those who responded to this post, it is nice to have expert information and help only an E-Mail away. Thank you.
 
We took the truck out this weekend with the new transmission. It shifts very crisply and you can feel each shift distinctly. We are running just a little over 150 degrees when cruising along locked up and around 180 degrees when the tranmission is working. Ambient temperature was high 80s.



One item to note: removing the torque converter drainback valve is not easy. Jim chucked the hose end in a lathe and drilled through the valve and pushed everything through the hose and out the fitting from the back side. I don't know if the check valve could be removed with hand tools.



Next step is to get the Toyhauler out and see what it tows like!



I appreciate those who responded to this post, it is nice to have expert information and help only an E-Mail away. Thank you.



I'm interested in your towing results. How much does your toy hauler weigh? How much did you spend for everything with the trans swap?
 
We will take the Toyhauler out next week. It weights 9500# dry and usually around 12K # with water and all our "stuff". We purchased a core and already had the Mag-Hytek pan, so including $500 for removing our old transmission and installing the new one, it was around $6000. Not cheap, but we wanted a quality transmission.



I want to thank Yo Hoot for doing the write-ups on the mods he has done on his truck. That is one of the reasons we decided to do our article. Removing the check valve Yo Hoot's way would definitely be easier than the way we did it, but I couldn't figure out how to hold the fitting so it wouldn't wobble and let the drill bit catch.
 
Wait time varies. I'm not sure why. Usually I don't even notice while once in a while it's 15-20 seconds. Not a problem considering. If I get some spare time I want to add a sensor to the pan (currently one on the TC out line). Also want to add the switch to lock it at will. Joe, thank you for taking the time. The pictures and info are great.

Mike
 
We took the truck out for its first tow, up to Lake Tahoe for a couple of days. It shifts a lot firmer than stock, so much so I asked Jim if he could soften the shift a little bit. I'm taking the truck in next Wednesday for him to lower the line pressure a bit. Jim drove the truck after the transmission was installed and he likes the shift just like it is, but with the Toyhauler on behind, its giving a pretty good jerk on 2-3 and he said he could soften it a bit. The shift logic still isn't perfect, but the new transmission makes it easier to live with. I really like the added power from the Smarty Junior and I'm thinking when we get everything adjusted to optimum, it will tow just like we want it.



We did the 2008 steering upgrade and really like it. It feels very solid.



Next step is a 1 piece driveline to take care of the startup shudder. We will be using 52123161AB. Thank you to those who did the part number research.
 
Nice write-up Joe. . thank you. You may want to clarify a point on the last two questions of the FAQ. At first you say recommended fluid change at 15k, and then the next section says to change fluid every 20-25k if worked hard? Not being picky, just thought you would want to clarify that in such an excellent article. Thanks for sharing!
 
I spoke at length with Jim about the fluid change interval. He stated some people feel there is value in changing the transmission fluid every other oil change or approximately every 15K miles. He also stated changing the fluid every 20-25K miles is a valid option. I didn't know how to resolve the apparent contradiction, so I left both recommendations in the article. My plan is to change the fluid every 20-25K miles unless the appearance or smell of the fluid in the transmission dictates an early change. The fluid change costs around $60 (assuming 12 quarts of fluid are replaced), so I don't want to go overboard, but I still want to protect my investment in the transmission.



I would really like to hear what some of the members of the forum with a lot more experience with the 48RE have to say about the optimum fluid change interval.
 
I had my neighbor test drive my truck and he showed me how nice the transmission shifts if you are a little easier on the throttle, so I decided not to have Jim lower the line pressure. I towed a 92 Dodge dually home on a trailer today and noticed the shift seemed to be fine as long as I wasn't really into the throttle. I'm not sure whether the shift logic for the transmission is learning or whether I'm adapting to the new way it shifts.



I hope to have my 1 piece driveshaft installed next week. I hope it helps with start up shudder.
 
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