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Avoiding Emergency Vehicles

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Let me start this post off saying that I'm no expert on ANYTHING. But that I was previously involved in a county rescue squad in TN. Part of the training was driving the rescue vehicles with lights and sirens going (and the adrenalin pumping).

By far, the things I saw while driving the emergency vehicles, and the things I heard about and was taught, was that the biggest problem for emergency vehicles was erratic drivers. Not traffic. Not those drivers that couldn't tell where the sounds were coming from and pulled out in front of the emergency vehicle. We were taught to expect that, because IT IS IN FACT difficult sometimes to tell where the sound is coming from. And going through intersections (traffic lights or not) we either completely stopped or got close enough to a stop to tell that all the other traffic could visibly see what's going on.

Let me give you an example off erratic driving that emergency vehicles have a problem with and why. This is from my experience driving my own personal vehicles. The other day, on my way home from work, I was traveling down a 2 lane road (speed limit 55) and I was going between 55 & 60. Only 2 cars were visible up ahead, the closest was like 20 car lengths up.

Way ahead was the 1st car (a pickup). He was starting around a turn when I see him go off the edge, start sliding (straight) throwing a big dirt cloud. He's so far ahead of me, I don't even react. And I couldn't see around the turn he was in. Then the car ahead of me starts around the turn, and then (she) slams on her brakes in front of me. She was far enough up there that at first I don't know that she came to a complete stop. Then I see an ambulance coming the other way (in his own lane, noone around for him to be overtaking). When I look back up the road, I had to almost lock my brakes to keep from hitting her, sitting stopped in our lane! This is a wide open country road.

In that example, some other drivers may have had an accident. The stopped lady might have got RAMmed, or a person behind her may have swerved into the path of the ambulance.

PEOPLE, AN AMBULANCE ONLY TAKES UP ONE LANE! #ad
What I learned as a driver of an emergency vehicle is that we prefer drivers to keep on doing what they're doing. They are more consistant that way and are more predictable. Crashing off the road, or stopping on the road is something you shouldn't do because that may cause a domino effect of more accidents.

If an emergency vehicle is coming behind you. Slow up MAYBE 5 OR 10 MPH, try to move over a little (don't run off the road), only when the emergency vehicle is right behind you. Some people are so stupid, they think that if they can see a flashing light anywhere in front of or behind them (even way way off) they think they have to swerve off the road, throw it in a ditch, and stop. NO! Drive predictably, give room where necessary, but don't stop in your lane. You think that 12,000 lb. ambulance can stop as fast as you? Think not!

If you're already stopped at a traffic light, STAY STOPPED! If a cop car, ambulance, or rescue squad vehicle is right behind you at the light, he would rather figure out a way around, than to have you dart out into the path he was going to take to go around. If they're stuck behind you in a lot of traffic at a light and the light turns green, the GO, and get the he11 out of the way after you're through the traffic light.

Sorry for the long post, but the actions of erratic drivers when they see/hear lights/sirens are by far my biggest peeve about other drivers.

- JyRO

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Y2K 2500 Cummins ETC/DEE, SLT+, 4X4, Quad, LB, Intense Blue Sport, 3. 54 LSD, rear aux. springs (camper special), sliding rear window, all options except cab clearance lights including agate leather, totally stock engine, silencer ring removed, "stealth," mod to run fogs with high beam. (20. 8 mpg @ 70 mph) Since everybody else listed their toys, I will too.

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No auto trannies in my home! Just say, "No!" to auto trannies.
 
12,000 lb? You should try throwing around a 30,000 lb tanker. I always expect the errant driver. Or the exited kid who runs out into the street to see the firetruck. ALWAYS! I have only had a few bad experiences driving a firetruck. Most of them minor. But the ones I don't like are the ones who fail to yield. Or the ones who overtake the truck. What are these people thinking? My favorite tanker (Cat powered Freightliner) can put down some serious speed (better than 75 mph. ). I don't know why people must feel the need to pass. Can someone explain this to me?
#ad



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'99 2500 ISB QC SLT (No Leather!), 4x4, 5sp w/McLeod, 4:10, BD-II, PE, PE-EZ, 4"exh. , Pac-Brake, A-Pillar gauge pod w/boost and pyro, Line-X, V-1, lights, siren, lic. plt. frame says "Diesel Fumes Make Me Horny!", and much more goofy stuff.


[This message has been edited by Amianthus (edited 05-01-2001). ]
 
Jyro, first let me say that I agree with what you say. What you say is logical and makes the most sense, safetywise. However, I'm sure most people are just doing what the law says and what they were taught in driver's ed in high school, that you must pull to the right and stop when you encounter an emergency vehicle. I'm sure most people don't think about what's logical, or what the ambulance/fire truck driver would prefer them to do; they're probably just hitting the brakes and pulling off the road out of instinct. I'm not going to bother looking up vehicle code laws, but I bet if you asked the general public "What would you do if you encountered an ambulance with its lights and siren on?", 99. 9% would say, "I'd pull over to the right and stop. "
As for me, personally, if I was driving on a 2-lane road, and there was a police car behind me (just driving along, not on a call), and I saw an ambulance coming toward me, I'd pull over and stop. If I didn't, I'm sure the cop would pull me over for "failing to yield the right of way to an emergency vehicle". I don't think he'd buy this explanation: "I didn't pull over because an ambulance driver that I know told me not to that... "
Not wanting to start an argument, I'm just saying that most people are just doing what they were taught to do.
Andy
 
I always expect the errant driver.

Like Kentucky Fried Movie:
(news reporter wispering)
"... As everyone expected ... the surprise witness" ROFL - kills me everytime!

I too would pull off to the right and stop with my right blinker on. I always give the emergency driver plenty of lead time to what I'm doing tho. I'm glad you posted tips here. #ad


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2001. 8 White Sport RAM 2500HD QC SLT 4X4 LB 3. 54 LSD Cummins Auto
My Ram Page

1999 21' Terry Lite Towable 5400# GVW
1990 Kawasaki KLR 250 Enduro
 
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I think EMS vehicles are cool. I usually can't hear one until it's right on top of me and they'll suddenly whip out from behind a line of cars and try to pass me. MY *** ! I gas it and make him stay in the left lane.

Sometimes I'll be sitting in a parking lot and see an EMS truck racing down the road. I'll pull up by the road and wait for him to get real close then lurch out into the lane a little to see if his reaction is appropriate.

What's really cool is when you get a buddy to turn in an emergency call and set the stage for the above events.

Jyro, what do you think of the new Michigan law requiring us to move to the next lane when passing a cop who's stopped on the side of the road? How come that law isn't for all vehicles? Maybe the cops don't give a rats *** about the rest of us poor souls who might get run over? Next time I see a cop on the side of the road, I'll do just what the law says. I'll swerve into the next lane and run someone off the road. Or maybe I'll slam on my brakes and stop in the lane. Better watch out, you might be the guy behind me. #ad



Doc

[This message has been edited by Doc Tinker (edited 04-23-2001). ]
 
Sorry Jyro

I met an ambulance the other day that should have been on his side of the road - there was no reason for him to be on my side.

Didn't make me very happy. He must've been tending to the patient at the same time.
 
Surely they don't pass you on a 2 lane road, do they? At least not with the lights/sirens going, surely.

- JyRO
 
Doc Tinker, I hope that last post was just a joke, if not, you need to do some re-thinking. Making a EMS vehicle stay in the left lane ? Swerving to the left, maybe causing an accident, to make a statement that you can't be bothered with giving the boys in blue alittle extra room while on a M. V. stop ? Are you kidding me ?

Scott W.
 
Where I live there is a bit of a problem with ambulance drivers. There are many little retirement villages here, and the senior citizenry feel it's their duty to pilot these things. That isnt so bad, but the problem is a lot of them have no business driving at all!! Let alone an 5 ton projectile.
Whenever I see lights in the rear view, I put the 4 ways on, and pull over to the side of the road. I dont go off the road, or stop, just slow down. If I'm in an intersection, I'll signal the vehicle with the sirens on that "I know theyre there, and they could turn, or otherwise do whatever they got to do".
I give MV stops all the room I could, and stop if need be.
Eric
 
All right... Just kidding... That's not really what I do...

I've always given all emergency vehicles plenty of room as well as all vehicles that are stopped at the side of the road. I personally don't think that law in Michigan goes far enough though. It only protects police officers and not the general public.

On the flip side... Years ago, before Mrs Doc and I married, she was riding in a car that was hit head-on by an overzealous volunteer fireman. Fortunately no one was seriously hurt and she survived to become Mrs Doc for the past 27 years. As fate has it, there was a state police cruiser stopped at the traffic light and saw the whole thing. The volunteer fireman got a ticket for reckless driving.

So far, the only problem I have with emergency vehicles are the volunteers who think the tiny lights and sirens installed on their personal cars make them invincible. I give those guys plenty of room, if I see them in time, even if it means driving off the road.

Doc
 
I agree with most of you that these things are what you've learned to do in these circumstances. Personally I try to give them all the leeway I can without making any circumstance more risky. As far as an ambulance riding out of his lane for no apparent reason, that's just not smart on the part of the ambulance driver and I'd have a problem with that too. I'm sure there are some people driving E. V. 's that think God Almighty should get out of their way regardless of where they are driving. It just isn't so.

And I'm not stating what laws say you should do, I'm stating what I've personally learned from the driving instruction and experienced rescue squad personell. I too rode with a guy who I considered was going way way way too fast for a rescue squad vehicle. Even though we were on the way to a scene of a bad accident, he was going too fast because if another driver would've made even a small mistake, he wouldn't have been able to react to it at the speed and the size of the vehicle we were in.

For most part, I'm saying, do the things that make you most predictable to E. V. drivers so that the risk factors under these circumstances are not increased.

As far as Doc goes, he's just messing with me personally. I don't think he's as dumb as his first post indicated. You all should just realize that Doc has a personal grievance with me that he just can't let go of, for some (editted) reason. Of course since I didn't react to his original post since I knew he was posting it for my benefit, his 2nd post is to try to cover his true intention (of trying to get a reaction from me) and is a CYA move. At least that's my take on it.

I hope all you guys, your family, and myself never get into an accident with an E. V. (and I'm glad Doc's woman came out of her accident OK), because (like the one I rode in with the guy driving too fast), it could be tragic.

- JyRO
 
JyRO, Yes they do overtake us with lights and sirens. Not very often, but it has happened. THAT is an instant ticket. I don't mind the individual that doesn't have anywhere to go to get out of the way. I also understand that some people are just inattentive. But if after a reasonable time... I've only submitted two reports for traffic citations. One was a failure to yield on a four lane road (it was merging into a two lane road shortly ahead of us). The other was for overtaking an emergency vehicle (basically failure to yield).
As far as going too fast, I try to not exceed 10 mph. over the posted speed limit. That's the guideline I use. When getting to the station, I use the same guideline, except that I stop at all stop signs. That seems to keep me out of trouble.
 
Amianthus - I can't believe the nerve of some people.

Joe G - I don't know about all the other E. V. training, but we were taught to expect people to not hear you or not to know where you're coming from. And we were taught not to blow through red lights. We were taught when coming up on busy intersections, lots of traffic, or an intersection with a few buildings around, not to expect everyone to know where the E. V. is coming from. Cause the sound waves get deflected off of cars, buildings, etc.

And man, were the instructors ever right. Just down the road from the rescue squad location was a little intersection that was usually busy, had a light, and a bunch of 2 story buildings. Everytime we'd get into that intersection, people would pull right out in front of us (and sometimes stop #ad
). We knew to expect it, and those people we never got mad at really because we understood that they just either couldn't hear us or couldn't tell where we were. And we didn't mind waiting behind cars in the intersection for the light to turn green, but we would get a little purturbed when the driver would stay stopped when the light was green.

- JyRO

[This message has been edited by JyRO (edited 04-24-2001). ]
 
One of the reasons some people don't pull over right away is how they make the cars these days. They are much more sound-proof than they used to be. That's why checking mirrors is important. It's more likely you'll see the emergency vehicle before you'll hear it.

Of course, having the airhorns mounted in the bumper (about at the driver's head level for most cars) on our #1 engine is a big help. I'm sure we could blow the back window out of a car with those puppies if we got close enough. #ad


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2001 2500; SLT; 4x4; QC; LWB; Auto; 3. 54 LS; 265s; Camper; Tow; Sliding Rear Window; Travel Convenience Group; Cab Clearance Lamps; BedRug; Forest Green; Isspro Pyro, Boost, and Trans Temp Gauges; 27' TT
 
I agree mostly with you guys, but my experience is a little different. I was taught that when you put the lights AND siren on (in ME, that was the law for you to TAKE the right of way, without both, you were only requesting it), you went into "offensive driving" mode. As my instructor said, put your left wheels on the yellow line, watch a mile ahead of you, half mile behind and a quarter mile to either side. No, I didn't go into the other lane when I was the only vehicle on the road (drove several fire engines and the rescue squad), but I did sort of crowd their side so that someone coming the other way had to pull off to the side. This gave me maneuvering room for the unexpected.

Worst case of idiocy I ever saw was a jack*** who pulled over to let me pass (carrying a code, the EMTs in the back emphasized the need to get to the hospital ASAP), then pulled in RIGHT behind me and tailgated me at about 75-80 mph!! I got on the statewide police freq on the radio, called the cops in the town we going through and all of a sudden... he wasn't there anymore!
 
Just a couple of comments here. Some people aren't inattentive. They just don't hear the sirens. I can't hear sounds in the frequency that sirens use. Sometimes the first notion I have of an emergency vehicle is that my hearing aid shuts down because of the loud noise. By that time the vehicle is pretty close. I usually see them coming, but sometimes I don't. Especially if they are on a side street. If an EV runs a stop sign or red light at a pretty good speed it has a real chance of knocking off one of us deaf guys.

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Joe George
Eureka, CA

'95 2500 CC auto 4X4,3. 54,Combo EGT/boost guage,custom switch panel,PacBrake,TST #5,DTT TC/VB,Automatic motorhome steps on both sides,Foldacover hard bed cover,Cummins chrome kit,Black steel grill guard,Front hitch receiver
 
Whew, Doc T. , you had me worried there !!! I agree with the problem with SOME volunteers. I have seen alot of crashs due to their "over zealous" driving habits. Fortunately, most around here drive with caution when the blue lights are on. Guess that same could be said for some LE's. They don't realize that at a certain speed, they are out driving the reach of the siren and no one hears/see's them until it's too late. I work as a FTO (Field Training Officer) in our P. D. and one of the first things that I have to break the new guy's of is the the urge to drive like a idiot when the siren and lights are on. Some guys just don't learn until THEY cause an accident while responding to one.

Scott W.
 
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