Bad, Bad, Bad, News

[zues]

I was just up at the dealer and there is a 2004. 5 HO with 21000 miles on it. The truck has a 5th wheel hitch, so the truck must tow. The truck has a K&N fresh air system on it, but have no idea of any other upgrades.



Here is the BAD news. The # 4 exhaust valve has a hole in it and the piston has a chunk out of the side. Dodge will not cover the warranty because of the fresh air intake system.



I was talking to the tech who is working on the truck and HE told me if I do any modifications keep the original parts to put back on the truck. It seems like to me that the new 325/600 run real hot and maybe they will burn up even when stock. This is just the easy way out for Dodge.



The cost for the new engine and to install is around 15000.



How can we find out what is really a safe temp to run even stock.

 

[DGFoster]

That is BAD NEWS

 

[IdaH.O.Train]

Is the good news you just saved a bundle on car insurance by switching to Geico? :{

 

[DGFoster]

:-laf :-laf :-laf

 

[lmills]

Well, I hate to say it, but a lot falls on the dealer also. I have had mine in plenty of times with intake, exhaust and gauges. A few times with a fuel box. They have been pretty decent and never said anything. I don't know how they would react if I showed up with a burnt piston and the TST box, but even if they did deny it, would you blame them?

 

[DLeno]

for $15K, you can go find a lawyer and fight this using magnusson-moss warranty act, which dictates that the mfg has to prove that the after market part caused the failure. A K&N may introduce dirt and cause additional bearing/cylinder wear, but it sure isn't gonna cause high temps. if anything it will lower temps.



sounds to me this is an excuse for a bad design, and DC is trying a little CYA. too bad

 

[GEM]

I think TDR and Friends should follow up on this one. Stock only trucks offer no way to check temps so knowing "how hot is hot" is... . useless. I traded my F250 7. 3 for the cummins because of the reputation of the engine and the warranty. If DC thinks every CTD has been tampered with, causing them to look for ways out of warranty, I made a big mistake. Say it ain't so!

 

[lmills]

If you think D/C is the only one, don't stop by TDS. Most of the Ford guys don't even want to think about doing anything to there trucks cause Ford is doing the same thing.

 

[y-knot]

I think you and your lawyer ideal is exactly what is wrong with America today. You encounter one problems and compound it with another. Why does it always have to result to a lawyer and a court of law? Can not you stand up for yourself, and take responsibility for your own actions? Has the backbone itself been removed ? Dodge is not responsible for any modification you, me or anyone else makes, and why should they be? Because you are to week to stand behind what you have done? Every issue I have ever read from the TDR clearly states that "You are your own warranty station". It has been stated for as long as there has been a TDR, what makes you or anyone else different now?

I am sorry that the guy's truck broke, but that is all part of the game, if you can not play with those rules then GET OUT. I think most on this site understand that what they do to modify their trucks, can and may be held against them in the case of a future warranty problem, and I assume they are fine with that. The rest of the people on this site, like you that feel they did a lawyer to bail them out are just plain wrong. Sure it is fine to add all the goodies and run around bragging about what you did, and how much power you can now make. But then you turn to mush when something happens and Dodge don't cover it, what a wuss. No one forced you to modify your truck, and any problems steaming from your modification should be repaired by you.

Also, it is only "Common Sense" that any product in it's first major run, like the 600, might experience some teething problems. I always expect a few snags and never buy anything in it's first year of production, you should have know better. I also do not condone the practice of LYING to the people at Dodge, what a low life it must take to modify ones truck then turn around and replace the added parts with the old ones and lye to the service manager at the Dodge dealer. Trucks were always suppose to be a MANS vehicle, and in the beginning they were. But now every yuppie, geek,freak, and wuss (Girly mann) that can muster the down payment is driving these things, having someone modify them and then complaining when it hits the fan. Be a MAN, if you want to play with the big boys, don't run home to momma or your lawyer when you get hurt. Every time this subject comes up it makes me sick.

 

[Snow man]

if the only mod was a K&N,then i would get a lawyer too,sorry no way a k&N would melt an engine,the 600's just run too darn hot bone stock. This is a matter of whats right is right. K&N should be able to supply flow data to indicate there filter flows enough air for the engines needs,to help you in court. As long as the installer didnt drop something in the intake when he installed it,that truck should be covered uinder warranty,no ifs and's or butts. IF he added a fueling box,then they have a right to deny coverage. If no one ever fought them in court,they would walk over over us,the magnusson-moss warrant act was the result of someone using the law to get justice. Go ahead let them steam roll us "little guys" when ever they want,without the courts we'd have no way to fight them,the onlt thing they understand is legal action,and something costing them $$$.

 

[jeff95]

I hope your just having a bad day and don't really believe all of the nonsense that you posted, y-knot. If I read the original post correctly, they are trying to blame a broken valve and piston on an aftermarket air filter. Why not say because he has a 5th wheel hitch he was towing too much weight. There has to be a direct cause and effect to void the warranty. If a contaminent were introduced because of the air filter and that caused the engine failure, then don't cover it under warranty. Otherwise, they are looking for an easy way out. I don't condone dishonesty on anyones behalf, dealer or customer.

Jeff

 

[DPelletier]

Y-knot,

So how do you really feel?

If there was a box on the truck, then I agree with you wholeheartedly. If they are denying the warranty because it has a different air filter, then they deserve to go to court. I have purposely kept my engine stock to keep the warranty (that I paid for) intact. If I ever got denied warranty for my gauges, for instance, I would definitely have my overpriced corporate lawyer send them a nice letter.



Dave

 

[mattymac]

It aint bad news unless it happens to you!



Theres two sides to every story,

I can bet that there was a chip of some sort in that truck it just got pulled before the dealership seen it. Hence the K&N intake.



I have pulled with my 600 hard enough, heavy enough, and steep enough, with gauges since day one when it was stock and till now with mods, and I bet stock that there is no way even under heavy towing that he could have burned it down, unless there was something else going on under the hood. Cummins designed and tested this 600 motor to withstand temps of 1400+ deg for long periods of time. Durring testing the motor stood at full RPM, full load, and 1450 degree EGT's for hours or days on end.

with a perfectly straigt road I could pull grades steep enough to slow my truck down to 35 MPH with a 50 MPH run while pulling around 10K and stock I could see inbetween 1350 and maybe 1400. Im colder now then I was stock with the Mods and the TST on the low settings.

I bet he had a chip on it.

 

[JHardwick]

I definately don't want to get into a pissin contest here, but y-not has some very good points indeed ... ... ... ... I just don't think they apply here based on the original post.



1. I agree that there are too many lawyers and too many frivalous lawsuits



2. I don't agree that a K&N drop in could be the culprit in a dropped valve and chewed up piston.



my 2 tarnished pennies

 

[aggieLR]

On my 305/555 motor with 2 jeeps on a gooseneck pullin through the passes just outside of Denver on my bone stock engine I could hit 1400 with no problem and more than half the pedal left. But on the other end pulling a trailer loaded with rice down around the southern part of Texas, I could get to about 1250 and that was it. I know the rice trailer weighed much more than the 2 jeeps, its just a matter of how dense the air was. So depending on where he was, I could see a stock engine running too hot. If I would have kept my foot in it (like some unknowing people do) then I could have easily destroyed that engine in Denver, but having a gauge on it I knew to back off.

I agree, if it had a chip, your fawked, but if it was truely stock w/ only an aftermarket air filter, I believe you are entitled to getting it all replaced under the warranty because that would be a "Manufactures Defect".

 

[y-knot]

Come on, do you really think the only thing not stock on the truck was the air filter?? You are also only hearing the one side to this story. I have been around long enough to know that Dodge service managers are not out too get any and everyone that comes into their service bay. Most I have worked with are extremely nice, and give the customer way more then they should. I too would like to hear the REAL story on this unfortunate incidence, but that will not happen, it is counter productive to the claim.

I also agree about the guy's at Ford, you would have to be an idiot to modify any engine that is experiencing problems. And if I was Ford or Dodge, the warranty would be held to the limits of it's responsibility. I do not think Dodge or Ford would renege on their end of the warranty, but why should they go beyond that and take responsibility for someone Else's actions? They should not, nor would anyone else. I believe in Cummins, they have a great product and have been a leader in the diesel engine category for many years, that is well documented. But anytime any manufacturer releases a new version of a old product or an entirely new product, there is a great chance they might experience some problems. The new 3rd generation trucks have a few well documented problems, lift pump failure (nothing new), driveling vibration problems and failures associated with American axles,noises or vibrations from under the hood, and low mileage figures. Today their are just to many federal restrictions imposed on the engine makers to play around with your warranty. Most of the these problems stem from having to implement the changes before adequate testing has been completed, that and the excessive use of electronics make todays engines less reliable and more susceptible to warranty claims.

 

[ARedetzke]

I agree with y-knot as well. Fraudulent warranty claims are part of what makes a new truck cost $40k. Someone might get warranty coverage that they don't deserve by taking off their box before taking it in for service, but it doesn't come out of DC's pocket in the end, everyone who buys a new one foots part of that bill. That is a big reason why a guy like me just drives the 12 year old version. Just my . 02 cents, now I'll head back to 1st gen land, where we don't have any warranties to worry about.

AJ

 

[zues]

I know the tech who is working on the truck and he is getting the owners phone number. I want to call him and find out if there was a box or some mods. I want to find out where he was and what he was doing. I am going to tell him I have the same truck and dont want it to happen to me. I will keep everybody up to date. I wonder if the owner of the truck has a bad track record with the dealerdhip. I feel like I do not want to do any mods to my truck.



When I pulled my 5er to Bass Lake all stock, I hit over 1400 degrees. I never backed out of it because it is all stock. If the engine is going to blow up I want it covered under warranty.

 

[JMcDowell]

Not to smart

Thats a real good way to get the tech fired. I guess if hes dumb enough to give out customers private information then he should get fired! You also think the customers just going to welcome your call AND tell you the truth? I dont think so.

 

[zues]

The tech is going to give the owner of the truck my name and see if he will call me. If he calls me then I will ask some questions. The tech knows that he is not to give out any customer info.