Ball Joint replacement standards

[hmickelson]

Help,This is one I sure would like some comment about. Upon returning from Alaska this summer I had a leaking rear wheel cylinder. While it was being repaired the mechancic suggested I get a wheel alignment check as the front tires were wearing a bit. Went to a local shop in Sequim, WA and made an appointment. They said they had to do what they called a "shakedown "of the from end before they would align. I said OK. Boy did they shakedown!They said I needed new ball joints and I said let's have an estimate. ( They did show me some movement in the joint,the crowbar inder the tire routine. ) The estimate came to $1,065. 38 including 2 new tires, I choked and said I would get a second opinion. I went to Schwab's, the technician who had about 2000 alignments a year under his belt drove our 93 D250 TCD pretty well stock , and declared it was OK and checked the alignment and it was perfect. I checked the Dodge manual whcih states the the ball joints should be checked by installing an indicator and clamp assembly to th lower suspension arm. Raise and lower the wheel with a pry bar and measure the movement and if it is 0. 020 or more replace the joint. The estimate maker did not use an indicator. At home my mechanic say any movement should indicate replacement as opposed to 0. 020 in the book.

How many different opinions out there?Please Help.....

 

[DPKetchum]

Don't forget to lube it first also. It takes up space also. I've seen a dry joint move 020 and lubed be tight with no movement. Just my two cent's worth. Some slight movement is normal. That's why specs allow up to 020.

 

[hmickelson]

Thank You for your two cents worth, Never thought of thatand should have. Impressive spec on you W350. Only had the D250 since last February and getting educated. Our car is a Diesel but much easier to maintain but will not tow much. Thanks again.

 

[DPKetchum]

Your Welcome. I've had truck 6 years so did'nt do mod's all at once. Swore I won't put anymore into it other then maintance. Really want a 2003 h. o. club cab But can't,don't want 600 a month note at this time. We breed and sale Walking and Qtr horses as a hoppy and need to pull a gooseneck trailer etc. It just turned 110,000 miles.

 

[BCaldwell]

DPKetchum, second the grease it before you check the play theory. 110,000 miles just getting broke in bill

 

[hmickelson]

DPKetchum and B Caldwell Thanks again for your response. Had the oportunity to ask my mechanic if he lubed the ball joints prior to the gauge test. He said no becuase the ball is called "gusher lubed" which he says the ball is grooved to accept the grease and the grease from the grooves keep the ball lubed. He also said we should be in no hurry to replace them unless I take another long trip like Alaska or they get to 0. 020.

 

[BushWakr - RIP]

Could you post what kind of tire wear you have. I mean can you describe it, as in, outside edge feathering, inside edge, inside/outside, etc.

Is there any "cupping" on the tire? Have you got any wierd vibration in the steering wheel, or does the truck "wander" if you apply brakes, release the steering wheel or whatever?

That will also help.



Assuming your tire pressures are correct, and you have not been doing any "rally driving" then the only reason for abnormal tire wear is camber, caster, general alignment, balljoint wear/slop or related issues. So, if all is generally good and you have abnormal tire wear then you do have some sort of "play" or component wear causing it.

If it were mine I'd lube it up good and investigate further just to be safe, not to mention piece of mind.

I'll have a boo in the manual for you and see if there is any other tips to post.

edit: even bad or mis-adjusted wheel bearings can cause wierd tire wear. .

bob.

 

[BushWakr - RIP]

hmickelson,



Ok, here it is right out of the 93 manual for D250:



UPPER BALL STUD INSECTION



1) Position a floor jack under the lower suspension arm. Raise the wheel and allow the tire to LIGHTLY contact the floor (vehicle weight relieved from the tire)



2) Grasp the top of the tire and apply force in and out. Look for ANY movement at the ball joints between the upper suspension arm and the steering knuckle.



3) If any lateral movement is evident, replace the ball joint.







LOWER BALL STUD INSPECTION



1) Raise the front of the vehicle. Install safety floor stands under both lower suspension arms as far outboard as possible. The upper suspension arms must NOT contact the rebound bumpers.



2) Install a dial indicator and clamp assembly to the lower suspension arm.



3) Position indicator plunger against knuckle arm and zero indicator.



4) Raise and lower the wheel with a pry bar under the center of the tire. Measure the axial movement of the knuckle with respect to the suspension arm.



5) If the travel of the suspension arm is 0. 20 inch (0. 51 mm) or more, replace the ball joint.





You should confirm your tire pressure(s), lube the components and make sure that you have proper bearing pre-load, and wheel nuts are torqued properly so that you can eliminate any slop in those areas and have proper transfer to pushing/pulling/prying force.



Hope that helps bud.

Let us know how you make out. If you end up needing work done and want the "how to" let me know and I'll type it all out for you and email it or post it. If you pay to have it done, shop around and make sure that you have a qualified axle/frame/suspension shop do the work, but I guess you already know that.

Progressive damage is definitely going to happen the longer you postpone any needed repairs.



Bob.

 

[hmickelson]

Bushwacker, Thanks for your post very informative and well written. First, where is Maple Ridge, B. C. ? We love B. C. Spent a goodly amount of time in B. C. while on our Alaska Trip This summer and connected with A fly fishing guide for August fishing out of Chilliwack on the Fraser river. It's a must for me every August for the rest of my Life Sock Eye on a seven wt fly rod WOW!. Now that the important stuff if over on to the 3rd import stuff. The tire wear seems even on both sides on both front tires to me . Kind of like under inflation in the past. I carry door post psi suggestion over 45 psi in the front and about 70psi ,although the rear max is 80 psi, int the rear. may reduce the rear to about 50 when not towing. No cupping,scuffing, wandering, it brakes evenly when I let go of the steering wheel. I really have a good mechanic here in the Sacramento Area he just tries to sell me when I need something, I know it and he know I know it. . The ball joint movement is now 0. 015 so lubing will happen with each service which is every 3,000. miles with out fail. I'm a believer in preventive mainenance and will just be mindfulI just tow a 7,000 lb Alpenlite 25 +2 5th wheel since 1987. I weill ask him about the lateral movement and movement between the suspension arm and the steering knuckle/.



AI also know that anything mechanical eventually wears out ,the preventive maintenance just gives it a longer useful life. Thnak for getting me on the right track.



By the way, my e mail address is <hkmick@rcip.com>. If you would like talk about B. C. either email or Post. WE are really interested in BC, even been to Port Hardy. / I grew up in Port Angeles WA and at one time knew Victoria very well.



Best regards Hugh

 

[Braveair78]

I replaced my upper ball joints about a month ago ... . I used the improved MOOG units. I had a little bit of movement on the passenger side and decided to replace both which is the advise that you will get from a shop as well as MOOG and I believe the manual. Close inspection of the units when removed was that they were serviceable... in other words I could have run them for quite awhile but, that's just me... some guys have home improvement projects and I have truck improvement projects. I believe that both upper ball joints were under$150. 00 (I did the whole front end uppers, lowers, and control arm bushings). This is not a project for the faint of heart... . I used big hammers, a burner torch, had to make a special ball joint remover tool out of a 2-1/8" socket coupled to a 3/4" drive and a four foot pipe to add a "little bit of torque". I believe that your ball joints are okay... . believe me you will feel the slop when they go bad.

 

[BCaldwell]

I swear Buhwa'r you type just to see the words you can put in cyber space Oo. bill. On to serious stuff hmickelson next year give me a call when you come up for sockeye's will try and hook up with you and drag Bush out with us bill

 

[hmickelson]

Oo. Thanks to all of you for the great responses. ou all have been a great help. I called my mechanic and asked him how srious he thought this was after dicussing severla of our thoughts and he suggested it would wait for some time wih out any consequences.



So I'll get a couple of new tires in stead. Since I do no offroading or nothing more drastic than washboard gravel roadsl will stay with the replacement tires only of better quality like michelin or toyo and I still like bridgestone.



willtalk about fishing as the time gets closer. See if you can get bush out Caldwell.

 

[BushWakr - RIP]

"... . I swear Buhwa'r you type just to see the words you can put in cyber space... "



Ya, what can I say, (or not say as the case may be), when something gets in my 'craw' I can't stand it till I find out or look it up... . Bugs Mrs. BushWakr too... ... ... .

So as they say ... . bite me, and spend the rest of your life kissin it better... JK'ing.



hmickelson,

If you're going fishing with a guide out in Chilliwack, you gotta almost go right by me, sorta/kinda.

Maple Ridge is just outside of Vancouver (east of Van. and well before you reach Chilliwack. Bill is just a short distance closer to Van. than me as well.

Keep your eyes peeled for Bill or 'Wildman mark (aka: . Ole Porta-Pottie .

Most of my fishing is on water totally surrounded by land, eg: lakes...

My youngest brother brought home a 40+ pound salmon from the Fraser this year... darn thing was taller'n him. .

Also if you're comin up here to fish you absolutely have to go right past Piers' place too, literally.

Drop a note when you figure you're heading up and maybe we can round up a few of the demon dodge boys and have coffee break with ya. .



Bob.