Better RV Brands?

[Grizzly]

All Denali trailers by Dutchman are rated 2 stars. The following is a staff review by RVCG;



"We've received few comments on this mid-priced Dutchmen brand, and the few we do have are mixed. Here are some examples:

"Layout of slideouts gives excellent LIVING ROOM space. "

"I now am almost totally rebuilding this trailer. It has broken welds, delamination, and serious design flaws, causing leaking roof and side leaks. Correspondence with Dutchmen has only brought total denial of any responsibility. They say it should be recaulked every six months. "

The impression we get when looking at Dutchmen's middle-of-the-road brands is that production numbers take precedence over quality. Proceed with caution when considering this brand. "



I couldn't find a Jayco Super-lite in the RVCG, but any trailer by Jayco has always been good.



george

 

[HBarlow]

Hey Harvey,
What brands do not have a Lipperd frame? Everything I have looked at in the last 3 weeks have Lipperd frames. That includes Keystone, Forest River, Jayco, Coachman and Sunnybrook and K-Z.
Thanks
Danny

Off the top of my head Artic Fox/Nash, Jayco, and HitchHiker do not use Lippert frames but NuWa (HitchHiker) did use Lippert frames on all HitchHiker II/HitchHiker LS and "three digit" models of Discover America in some model years such as '06 and '07. Top of the line models like Travel Supreme, Teton, Alfa, Carriage, Newmar, etc. did not use Lippert.

 

[Newt]

Except for 2010 and 2011, color is the best way to determine frame manufacturer for NuWa trailers. My SnowBird LS has a Youngs frame. The SnowBird LS is the same as a HH II LS, just different decals. Youngs couldn't produce the number of frames NuWa required. So, starting some year (I don't know which one. ) all HH II's had Lippert frames, Discover America's were a mix of Lippert and Youngs frames depending on the model. All champagne's had Youngs frames. Lippert frames are black. Youngs frames are white, except 2010 & 2011.

Newt

 

[gerry]

grizzly: your opinion on our K2

about 2 months back we traded our 07 17 ft Vortex for a 06 K2 21 ft toy hauler made by Komfort. It was equiped with most options like 36 gl fuel station, 5k axles and 2540 tires and electric bed lift. We had a few issues like jammed fuel pump and low water pressure but have now got it fixed pretty much to our liking. It doesn't seem to leak and all cabinets and doors work properly. My question is where do K2s and other Komforts seem to fit for quality? I've looked on the internet and only find sources the want $30-$40 for their opinion. What have you heard? Thanks gerry

 

[Silver_Ram]

Grizzly,



How do the Heartland RV Sundance 5th wheels rate for model year 2010 or 2011 - the 2900MK or 3100ES. I want to trade out of my 04 Wildcat. I have been looking at a lot of trailers and the Heartlands, Sunnybrooks are running on Lippert frames & axles. I looked at the Arctic Fox, but the wife doesn't like the stairway & bathroom layout on the 29-5E, 27-5l or 29-5T.

 

[Grizzly]

about 2 months back we traded our 07 17 ft Vortex for a 06 K2 21 ft toy hauler made by Komfort. It was equiped with most options like 36 gl fuel station, 5k axles and 2540 tires and electric bed lift. We had a few issues like jammed fuel pump and low water pressure but have now got it fixed pretty much to our liking. It doesn't seem to leak and all cabinets and doors work properly. My question is where do K2s and other Komforts seem to fit for quality? I've looked on the internet and only find sources the want $30-$40 for their opinion. What have you heard? Thanks gerry

Gerry, I didn't find a 21' K2 Toy Hauler by Comfort Thor, however all K2 SUT (Sports Utility Trailer) or Toy Hauler are rated 2. 5 stars. The smallest K2 is a 26' and has a Reliability rating of 2. 5 stars, Value, 2. 5 stars and Highway Control, 3. 5 stars. The overall rating is still 2. 5 stars. RVCG does not give a write up on RV's until 09 and newer models.



george

 

[Grizzly]

Grizzly,



How do the Heartland RV Sundance 5th wheels rate for model year 2010 or 2011 - the 2900MK or 3100ES. I want to trade out of my 04 Wildcat. I have been looking at a lot of trailers and the Heartlands, Sunnybrooks are running on Lippert frames & axles. I looked at the Arctic Fox, but the wife doesn't like the stairway & bathroom layout on the 29-5E, 27-5l or 29-5T.

Silver Ram, I only found one of the three requested, which is the Sundance 2900MK. It's 2. 5 star rated as are all Sundance 5th Wheels and TT.



Here's a commentary by RVCG staff; The quintet of RV veterans who founded Heartland RV in 2003 in Elkhart, Indiana wanted more control over production numbers than they had seen at other companies. A major part of their company philosophy was that by limiting production they could build a better product, establish dealer confidence, and give the customers what they wanted.

Starting out at the high end with the Landmark fifth wheel, aimed at fulltimers, may have seemed a risky proposition, but it paid off for Heartland. Next came the Bighorn, then the entry-level Sundance and the Cyclone toyhauler. Since then, Heartland's growth has been phenomenal, going from a startup to become an important player in the RV arena in just a few years. By 2009, they offered 14 brands from luxury fifth wheels to entry-level lightweights -- and even a park model. If Heartland's goal was to cater to most types of towable needs and most pocketbooks, it looks like they succeeded.



This is what JD Gallant of RVCG has to say about Heartland RV Manufacture; I've seen Heartland brands here and there but have never been enthusiastic enough to climb under and over like I do with many brands. They seem to take pride that they use techniques that other manufacturers don't use. But many manufacturers also build using good construction techniques like laminated sidewalls with aluminum framing and fiberglass skin. (Heartland uses wood framing on some of its lower lines. ) I like Heartland's ideas about building a solid floor and they probably try to put together a good roof. (It's all there in the glossy brochures. ) Still, I haven't been to the factory, and with consumer complaints outnumbering praises, I'm just going to have to wait for a trip to see them being built before I wag my tongue too much. For now, if the price satisfies you and you can live with the gamble, jump in and let me know how you make out.



An Arctic Fox may be your best bet, if your wife can live with the stairway and bath layout.



Hope this helps, george

 

[Silver_Ram]

George,



Thanks for the information, it seemed like it was kind of general on their part. The wife unfortunately is adamant about the Arctic Fox.

 

[Grizzly]

George,



Thanks for the information, it seemed like it was kind of general on their part. The wife unfortunately is adamant about the Arctic Fox.

Well we all got to do what we got to do. My wife was all excided about a Cougar, by Keystone. It did have a better layout and decor. Upon my inspections of the fit and finish and noting the light weight Lippert frame and axles, I said flat no to Cougar and any Keystone trailers. That's when I purchased the RV Consumer Group guide and based the purchase of our Arctic Fox by their recommendations. We are both very happy with what we purchased.



As a final note, if you intend on having this trailer for a long time, as we do, you might consider quality above fancy decor.



george

 

[Silver_Ram]

If I say no, I will end up keeping an 2004 Wildcat, that is becoming morre maintenance. We are gonna go with the 2011 Sundance 3100ES... . The Arctic Fox is also out of the budget right know. I wished they would update some of the floorplans to include the neo angle shower.



It seems like there were more problems with 2007-2009 Sundances from what I can find on other forums. It seems the more I look, the more you find Lippert frames & axles.



The Sundance has a 10" frame main beam and the axles are 6,000 lbs with 8 lug 16" wheels. It comes with equa-flex suspension equalizer. I am also considering the morryde pin box. Heartland uses a pin box cover & I don't know if the Trailair roto flex will work.

 

[RVTRKN]

You might want to consider used. I looked at a lot of new expensive "cheap builds" RV's and just couldn't reach for the check book. Glad I waited, we found a nice arctic fox in like new condition (look at sig) for less than half of what a new one cost.



There are a lot of good deals, if you take the time and do your research. The depreciation on RV's are extremely high, let someone else take that hit. With the economy the way it is, you can find a fairly new "quality" RV used.

 

[AClayton]

You might want to consider used. I looked at a lot of new expensive "cheap builds" RV's and just couldn't reach for the check book. Glad I waited, we found a nice arctic fox in like new condition (look at sig) for less than half of what a new one cost.



There are a lot of good deals, if you take the time and do your research. The depreciation on RV's are extremely high, let someone else take that hit. With the economy the way it is, you can find a fairly new "quality" RV used.

I totally agree with you on this, however, if you don't have that kind of money in savings it would be very difficult to secure a loan.



Alan

 

[RVTRKN]

That is correct, just look at my savings account today after paying cash.

 

[CUMMINZ]

I looked at 2 new Lance truck campers on pickups this weekend at Piedmont Dragway and liked the 11. 5 very much. I don't see how you could get any better.

 

[Grizzly]

I looked at 2 new Lance truck campers on pickups this weekend at Piedmont Dragway and liked the 11. 5 very much. I don't see how you could get any better.

I agree with you on Lance, which are a 4 star rated slide-in truck camper. also look at other 4 star rated campers, such as HOST and Arctic Fox Truck Campers.

 

[Gonzo 1066]

The top line truck campers scare me more than a little bit on PRICE$$$$ woofda $40,000 for a slide in truck camper? No engine or wheels. Does this seem a bit expensive to anyone else?

 

[HBarlow]

I've never understood that either. No frame, no suspension, brakes, wheels, tires, no heavy steel tongue or fifth wheel hitch assembly, and only a fraction of the size and construction materials required to build a large fifth wheel or even travel trailer.

Lances are great products, no doubt, but I couldn't rationalize the price.

 

[mwilson]

Everybody has a different view about these things, but do agree the Lance campers are a pretty impressive unit.



But I still think that the walls would close in on me about the second rainy day. . :{:{





I still prefer to unhook and be done with it once I land at the campsite. Same reason I will NEVER own a Class A, plus too many things to go wrong and expensive to repair when they do. Besides, I would have to have a pretty big one to tow my Megacab around... ...



For now I can completely destroy several Keystone products and still have a smaller expenditure in the long run... . :-laf:-laf



When I go full time I will purchase a quality unit and use the great advice that has been offered on this thread to help me choose!!!

 

[Grizzly]

I also had a problem with a large slide-in truck camper as did mwilson. I had a 11' 3" Lance camper, which we used for weekend camping trips and for two and three week long trips, however in 2006 we took a two month trip to Alaska. We did experience claustrophobia and the problem of having to take the camper with us everywhere we went. Those are the reasons why we sold the Lance and purchased our Arctic Fox 5th wheel. With the 5th wheel, which is not large, 27', we can unhitch it and have the truck to venture out from a home base, such as Anchorage and Fairbanks.



My mileage with the 5th wheel is not as good as with the truck camper, but the convenience and space is so much better. I strongly feel that a 5th wheel is the best all around means of RV'ing.



george

 

[PeterW]

AS a TDR newbie who has read every page of this very informative thread, I'm beginning to change my thinking on buying a used 5th wheel built by a company that has gone out of business. At first, I thought I would never do that... . based on the future need for parts and/or support... but some made the point that most of the mechanicals/appliances etc are from 3rd-party suppliers anyway.

My wife and I are looking for a larger (36' +) 5th wheel or park trailer to use in a campground up in the mountains of New Mexico (they don't allow traditional non- self contained "park models". ) It gets down into the teens on winter nights, maybe single-digits, so insulation and heated tanks/underbelly are important.

We will tow it there, and I doubt we'd move it more than once every couple of years.

How is the King of the Road reputation? I know they're out of business. We are looking at a 2006 King Of The Road Royalite 36 IKQS resale. Can someone help with the RVCG report? I see a couple of models, like the Royal Villa, Grand Marquis, Royalite, etc. Any idea of the pecking order of the model lines?

Any other suggestions? We have an open mind, and like to keep the budget no more than $25,000.

It's a big decision for us, as eventually we plan on living in this RV for 6 months out of the year, and we don't have the finances to make a costly mistake and fix it ($$$$) at a later date.

Thanks for you help!!