Big three, 2011 tow ratings and GCWR.

[NIsaacs]

Just read the new Truck Trend Magazine.



Chevy 3500 Dually: GVWR=13,000, GCWR=26,000,



Ford F350 Dually: GVWR=13,050, GCWR=29,000



Dodge 3500 Dually: GVWR=12,200, GCWR=24,500



Maximum GCWR requires fifth wheel.



Chevy and Dodge both rate bumper pull trailer at 16,000, Ford at 14,000.



Chevy now has exhaust brake as standard equipment.



Nick

 

[EGroeneveld]

Pretty amazing numbers. Dodge is going to need to do some catching up. They are going to get left behind in braging rights and sales numbers.



The new Dodge HD hype has died off real quick with Ford and GM releasing there 2011 numbers so quickly. Dodge needs some new PR people. All the mags are just covering Ford and GM right now. Common Dodge get out their. Please don't go the way of Hummer, Pontiac, Oldsmobile...

 

[Road Dog]

The GVWR would be more useful if they listed the dry weight too.

 

[AH64ID]

I expect 2011 Dodge numbers to take a BIG jump!

 

[Bug Out]

HOLY CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!! 26K and 29K???? WoW! That would make me legal. . How can they justify that much weight on a 1 ton dually?

 

[HBarlow]

I'm only surprised that anyone reads Truck Trend magazine or pays any attention to advertising claims in factory brochures.

I subscribed to Truck Trend for a brief time after it was introduced. I cancelled my subscription when I soon realized the magazine's reporting, just like its sister publication Motor Trend, was driven by paid advertising and contained no objective reporting of comparisons. Even clear shortcomings of the favored advertiser's truck that are obvious to the rare sharp automotive writer are weasel-worded in flowery terms to cause the casual reader to overlook them.

The light truck manufacturing industry uses no objective engineered standards for measuring weight ratings or towing ratings. Each manufacturer is free to claim any GVWR and GCWR they are comfortable with.

No truck manufacturer can overcome the laws of physics, not even Furd. The young marketing and journalism majors in their marketing departments are free to make up any numbers they like and publish them in any beautiful glossy color brochures or high dollar television ads they feel comfortable paying for.

The real test results won't be in for several years. Lot's of folks thought the Furd 6. 0 was the best light truck diesel engine ever made when the 2003 Furds went on sale. It took awhile for RVers or RV transporters to learn the truth.

I will ignore the amazing claims coming out now and wait for the real results to surface over time.

 

[AH64ID]

The real test results won't be in for several years. Lot's of folks thought the Furd 6. 0 was the best light truck diesel engine ever made when the 2003 Furds went on sale. It took awhile for RVers or RV transporters to learn the truth.

I agree completely. . but try telling a Ford guy that we wont know for years if its any good... . I'll admit it has a TON of potential, well know in 2012 or 2013 if its good, well know very soon if its bad.

 

[HBarlow]

I know what you mean. When I was transporting with an old '01 Dodge with over 300k miles on the odometer I talked with Furd owners who were on their second and even third new Sick. Ohh because the previous ones had cratered just out of warranty. Dodge and GM dealers would not give them the time of day on trade so they went further, and further in debt buying the salesmen's lies that all the problems were fixed. They weren't. Furd guys are loyal (but stupid).

 

[FFeiller]

it doesn't matter whither the trucks by ford and gm will hold up the issure is the law is checking weights more and more and dodge is falling behind. i don't expect dodge to do anything on the 2011, because the engines hp and torgue ratings aren't going anywhere.

 

[HBarlow]

DOT officers don't know and don't care what the manufacturer's ratings are for these trucks. Those ratings mean nothing under the law. In truth they mean nothing to anyone but the gullible who read and believe advertising hype on brochures.

The issues DOT cops concern themselves with are actual axle weights, actual gross weights, registration weights, driver's licenses, and other details.

The only time a DOT officer will pay any attention to manufacturer's weight ratings is when a non-CDL commercial driver is towing a large trailer an occasional DOT or scale house inspector will check GVWR of truck and trailer. If the two GVWR figures add up to more than 26,000 lbs. the driver will be shut down and fined. A commercial driver cannot exceed 26,000 lbs. actual or rated weight without a CDL.

In that somewhat rare case the Dodge's lesser rating is an advantage to the driver. That is what GAmes is talking about in another thread. He hauls commercially and the GVWR of his '97 Ram dually is only 10,500. That means he can legally haul a fifth wheel with a GVWR of 15,500 (but not 15,600). When I had an '06 before I got a CDL A I could only haul a fifth wheel with a GVWR of 14,500.

 

[AH64ID]

I just recently found out that Idaho offers GVW tags for trucks. . I had been rolling on a 8K tag for years... now I am registered to 26K... they don't care what the GCWR is, they care what I pay the state to run...

 

[NIsaacs]

I expect 2011 Dodge numbers to take a BIG jump!

Opps, sorry! The Dodge numbers are for the 2010 models, 2011 for the Ford and Chevy. I was so excited to get my new Truck Trend.....



Nick

 

[wcjp]

Not sure how Ford can go above 26k. Unless the driver has a special endorsement, in Washington St. he'll get a ticket regardless what the door tag says.

 

[HBarlow]

Not sure how Ford can go above 26k. Unless the driver has a special endorsement, in Washington St. he'll get a ticket regardless what the door tag says.

Sorry, that's not true. The 26,000 lb. figure you are writing about is the Furd factory gross combined weight rating. It appears nowhere except in Furd brochures and perhaps sales manuals if they are still published.

That number is of no concern whatsoever to Washington state DOT officers. What will matter to them is the GVWR tag on the door of the truck and the GVWR tag on the left front of a trailer ONLY IF the two total greater than 26,000 lbs. and ONLY IF the truck and trailer are commercial.

There is one possible exception though: if Washington state now has a class A operator license like Texas and a few other states do a Washington state driver with his truck and trailer registered in Washington with GVWR tags exceeding 26,000 lbs. will have to obtain a class A operator license or he could get a ticket.

 

[domehead]

HBarlow,



I am in the process of getting my Class A CDL here in SC. Like you stated is what you are taged for and what are the axle are rated for. DOT is coming down on most one ton units that are pulling any type of trailers around here.

 

[wcjp]

Sorry, that's not true. The 26,000 lb. figure you are writing about is the Furd factory gross combined weight rating. It appears nowhere except in Furd brochures and perhaps sales manuals if they are still published.



That number is of no concern whatsoever to Washington state DOT officers. What will matter to them is the GVWR tag on the door of the truck and the GVWR tag on the left front of a trailer ONLY IF the two total greater than 26,000 lbs. and ONLY IF the truck and trailer are commercial.



There is one possible exception though: if Washington state now has a class A operator license like Texas and a few other states do a Washington state driver with his truck and trailer registered in Washington with GVWR tags exceeding 26,000 lbs. will have to obtain a class A operator license or he could get a ticket.

Relative is a commercial inspector. A special license is required for above 26k. I'm not sure what the license is called.

 

[HBarlow]

An ordinary driver's license handbook available from your nearest driver's license or DMV office should contain the answer.

Many states are recognizing that many of us are pulling very heavy work trailers such as gooseneck flatbeds, living quarter horse trailers, or large fifth wheel RVs with our heavy duty light trucks and are now requiring an ordinary driver's license rated for higher combined weights. Texas calls it a Class A Operator's License. Other states name it the same or something similar.

I stated the above the polite way. I could have said that states are recognizing the opportunity for increased tax revenues by creating an additional extra cost driver license.

 

[GAmes]

Relative is a commercial inspector. A special license is required for above 26k. I'm not sure what the license is called.

Since 99% of the membership do no use their pickups for commercial purposes they would have no reason to meet your relative. He and every other weigh scale operator/inspector/LEO could care less what the GCWR of any pickup is.



The special license would be called a CDL. It applies to GVWRs, not GCWRs of individual vehicles. GCWR would only come to play when totaling the GVWRs of the tow vehicle and trailer(s) and has nothing to do with manufacturers GCWR.

WA State Licensing: Vehicles requiring a CDL



Washington exempts RVs from the CDL requirement, but it appears that they do not have a non-commercial class A for heavy vehicles used for personnal reasons. That info can be found at this link if you click on Who doesn't need a CDL? WA State Licensing: Who needs a CDL?







The long and the short of it is no special license would be required just because the brochure GCWR is over 26,000.

 

[jgillott]

Just for the fun of it, I copied this from the PA DOT site. I find it interesting that it specifically uses RV's as an example in the language. Of course, this has nothing to do with the vehicle/trailer registration code, which is an entirely different animal.



Classes of Driver's Licenses

Non-commercial Driver's Licenses

CLASS A (minimum age 18): Required to operate any combination of vehicles with a gross weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, where the vehicle(s) being towed is/are in excess of 10,000 pounds. Example: Recreational Vehicle, when the towing vehicle is rated at 11,000 pounds and the vehicle towed is rated at 15,500 pounds (total combination weight of 26,500 pounds).

CLASS B (minimum age 18): Required to operate any single vehicle rated in excess of 26,000 pounds. Example: Motor homes rated at 26,001 pounds or more.

CLASS C (minimum age 16): A Class C driver’s license will be issued to persons 16 years of age or older, who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any vehicles, except those requiring a Class M qualification, and who do not meet the definitions of Class A or Class B. Any firefighter or member of a rescue or emergency squad who is the holder of a Class C driver’s license and who has a certificate of authorization from a fire chief or head of the rescue or emergency squad will be authorized to operate any fire or emergency vehicle registered to that fire department, rescue or emergency squad or municipality. The holder of a Class C driver’s license is also authorized to drive a motorized pedalcycle (a motor-driven cycle) or a three-wheeled motorcycle equipped with an enclosed cab, but not a motorcycle.

CLASS M (minimum age 16): A Class M driver’s license will be issued to those persons 16 years of age or older who have demonstrated their ability to operate a motorcycle or motor-driven cycle. If a person is qualified to operate only a motorcycle or motor-driven cycle, he/she will be issued a Class M driver’s license. If your motorcycle is less than 50 CCs, an “8” restriction will appear on your driver’s license. This restriction prohibits you from operating a motorcycle 50 CCs or larger.





Commercial Driver's Licenses - Classes A, B or CCLASS A (minimum age 18): A Class A license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross vehicle weight rating of the vehicle or vehicles being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds. The holder of a Class A license is qualified to operate vehicles for which a Class B or Class C license is issued. Where required, appropriate endorsements must be obtained.

CLASS B (minimum age 18): A Class B license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of 26,001 pounds or more or any such vehicle towing a vehicle having a gross vehicle weight rating of not more than 10,000 pounds. The holder of a Class B license is qualified to operate vehicles for which a Class C license is issued. Where required, appropriate endorsements must be obtained.

CLASS C (minimum age 18): A Class C license is issued to those persons 18 years of age or older who have demonstrated their qualifications to operate any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating of not more than 26,000 pounds or any combination of vehicles, except combination vehicles involving motorcycles, that does not meet the definition of a Class A or Class B vehicle. Where required, appropriate endorsements must be obtained.

NOTE: You must be 21 years of age or older to operate a Commercial Motor Vehicle on an interstate (traveling between two or more states). This applies to ALL classes.



In addition to the CDL classes, there are also special endorsements and restrictions that you must have to drive certain types of commercial vehicles. They are:



Endorsements/Restrictions

Endorsements– The following authorizations are required when operating vehicles of the type listed:



H - Required to drive a vehicle with hazardous materials placards (you must be 21 years of age).

N - Required to drive a tank vehicle.

T - Required to drive double and triple trailers.

P - Required to drive a vehicle designed to carry 16 passengers or more including the driver (buses).

S - Required to drive a school bus. Designed to carry 11 passengers or more, including the driver.

X - Represents a combination of the hazardous materials and tank vehicle endorsements (you must be 21 years of age).

 

[Road Dog]

Since 99% of the membership do no use their pickups for commercial purposes they would have no reason to meet your relative. He and every other weigh scale operator/inspector/LEO could care less what the GCWR of any pickup is.

In BC every pickup has a commercial plate regardless of use and a commercial vehicle inspector is free to inspect any vehicle they choose. Required stops at weigh scales is determined by licensed weight, not use and certain types of trailers (like travel trailers) are generally exempt.



But you're right -- the vehicle inspector doesn't care about the GCVWR in the brochure.



Driver's licenses are determined by the equipment (axles and weight), not commercial or personal use unless you're a driver for hire hauling people (i. e. a taxi or limo driver).