Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Blue Chip FMS ROCKS!!!!!!!!!

[Jetpilot]

Ok been watching this and need to comment.



The shudder with the Drag Comp is only on level 5 (and who drives with it in 5 all the time anyway). The Drag Comp shudder occurs under very light throttle nornmally around 1700-1800 rpm, and unless you are looking for it you probably wouldn't notice it. Besides Power Edge has a program mod that fixed this problem. The TST shudder happens when you let off the accelerator at the higher levels and is very pronounced. These are two different types of problems.



Mark this is what I am talking about with good info... . I reviewed your prior posts and no mention was made to a shudder and the Comp, in fact you were recommending it as the best box around just recently. If you had a shudder you should have mentioned it in your posts when recommending it to people.



I am very happy that you are so excited about the FMS setup and its percieved power gains. But I can say that I know of no 24 valve high HP trucks (over 700) running anything but the Power Edge Comp or derivative (DD-UFM). I would think that if this box makes more HP than the Comp you would see it on these guys trucks.



Doug

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Well, Doug has a fast truck and HE runs a Comp. So, a Comp MUST be the best. PLEASE!!! LOL!!!

Originally posted by Mark_Kendrick

I was unable to run on 5/5 for more than short bursts because it caused a miss. the FMS does not have this problem and gained me 6# of boost.

You need to pay a little closer attention Doug. That quote was from an earlier post on this thread.



I don't drive with it that way all the time but when playing and I back off the throttle the miss or 'shudder' is there and pronounced. It was not there before the large injectors.



God forbid that I find a problem with the Comp that does not exist with another box.



Give it a little time. There will be a FMS equipped truck over 700hp soon.

 

[Lsfarm]

Drag Comp

I know I don't have it in my signature yet, but in the text of my comment, I stated that I have the Edge DRAG comp. I have NO shudder, stutter, any drivablilty issues. I love the response and power, just not the smoke.



I usually run the comp in 3/2 to keep smoke under control. My injectors must be pretty big even though they are supposed to be stage 3's, cause look at my ET's on the strip, and the smoke I'm putting out!!



Mark: what grows on you? That Red Headed Stepchild of a box?



My Piers Nasty Nine turbo did real well, pegs and bends the boost gauge needle when I comes on! I don't have a clue what the EGT's were on the strip, who looks at guages when running the 1/4 anyway?



Horsepower: some guys have posted that with a given weight, 1/4 mile ET, altitude that the engine must be XXX horsepower, I don't know where that info is available, I was just hoping for a rough estimate. I doubt that the horsepower that I thought I had [based on other trucks dyno results] of about 370-390 HP can be correct and still push me down the strip in the low 14's!

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

:-laf... . That little red headed bugger sure does run though

 

[Jetpilot]

Mark,



I am not speaking about this post my reference was to prior threads... . You recommended the Comp numerous times to folks without mentioning the shudder. If you had the shudder with any injectors you should have brought that up when recommending the Comp. Another thing is did you give Edge the opportunity to fix your Comp?



I am not saying the Comp is best because I run it. What I am saying is there are no over 700 HP trucks running this box that I am aware of. The Drag Comp is not for everyone, heck there are a lot of good choices out there. What I am saying is that all the info should be given when reporting or recommending a product. A lot of guys base their decisions to purchase certain products on the info gathered on this website so all of it needs to be as accurate as possible.



Mark I do not want a war on the TDR just good info but something is off a bit..... In this thread:



https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=40816&highlight=comp



You said you are hitting 44-46 psi boost, but earlier in this thread you say the most you have seen is 43. As I mentioned above I am glad you are happy with your choice but it seems your findings are contrary to what several other members have found doing the same comparisons on their trucks. I know of nobody that has lost HP by putting in larger injectors. Heck Jim Fuller installed a set that was bigger than anything DD had ever made and he made more HP. Bully Dog made a new set for me that are huge and smoke all the time (even at idle) but I lost no HP... . If you really lost HP by using those big injectors it would seem to me that there is an issue with the quality of the injectors.



Doug

 

[MikeR]

Lsfarm,

The reason you don't experience a shutter is because you have an automatic transmission. We (the guys with the shutter) are experiencing the shutter as we jump on and off the throttle shifting our manual gearboxes. And it is violent!



Bigsaint,

The PM3 is not a full-time timing box. The only moment the timing is advanced is when the extra fuel is actually kicking in (the green light is on). When you let off the throttle (wether to shift or slow down) it returns to stock timing, and advances again when you put the throttle down. It is not a drastic timing change either... we're talking only a couple of degrees, nothing like the EZ. That's the way of doing it through the tapped fuel pump wire.



The EZ is a full-time timing box, completely variable and has more advance. The combo of the TST and EZ works great, I currently have the TST and TTPM and it is perfect.



-Mike

 

[Jetpilot]

MikeR,



With the TST box even some guys with an auto have the problem you mention. From what I know of the problem the Comp had was a different type of shudder. I know I spoke with several guys at Muncie that have the problem you describe... . Hopefully they will get it fixed soon for you guys.



Doug

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Okay. . truce! now for a little more info.



I try not to post my findings or problems on custom parts until I find some sort of solution. I guess I'm trying not to cry wolf.



Since that thread I have changed injectors and exhaust housings. I was making 46psi on DD3's and a 14/16cm housing for the B1. I now have a 12cm housing and injectors originally intended for sledpulling. I guarantee they are as big as most anything you've seen.



I was extremely impressed w/the Comp until I put in the big injectors. Then level 5 became a WOT-only setting. I ran on 4/1 or 1/1 almost all the time with no problems. The injectors are big enough that 1/1 does not keep smoke or EGTs down. There are a lot of companies that are making REALLY big injectors out there. You just have to find them.



As for the Hp=boost thing. It's pretty linear until you get over 52-55psi. Kurt and I both ran 46psi w/a 12cm housing and DD3s. He dyno'd at 461hp. My gtech read between 455 and 470 when calibrated with an accurate weight. I put in the new fire hoses and dropped to 43psi of boost. I dyno'd at 435hp. again confimed with the gtech.



Now I see 48-49# of boost and feel I can safely estimate power to 480hp on #2 only. I have enough fuel to be over 650 on N2O and #2 alone. Right now the clutch won't hold on for the N2O shot long enough to get a measurement. Peter is working on that as we speak.



I gotta go catch a plane. I'll try to get back later in the day.



Later,

Mark

 

[Briar Hopper]

I don't have the shudder in high levels with my TST PM3 Comp, but it's an altered program. Keep in mind, level 6 on the PM3 Comp is the same as level 9 on a regular PM3. So you are not really losing anything ! Any box taken into those extremes will cause that kind of a defueling shudder. The top 3 levels on my Comp throw so much fuel at the engine that my EGT hits Saturn V booster temps. But I'm able to use level 7 for drag racing, and have tried level 8. Neither one noticeably improved my ET, just lots more smoke, so it's evident I have way more fuel than the Hx40 can keep up with.

I'll be working with TST as soon as time permits, on my own program to see what we can find out. Once I get the right program for my setup, I hope to be able to offer it for sale, and to offer re-programming. Can't promise anything at this point.

 

[Rob Thomas]

Mike (777mechanic) ,



I'm sorry if I gave you the wrong impression, I do get a wicked shutter on any level above 6, but I don't drive around in those levels, those are fer racing purpose's, and when in a racing senerio(sp?) I'm shiftin', and therefore no shutter. Around town drivin' levels 5-6 are plenty to stay outta most trouble.



Again, sorry fer the confusion



Later, Rob

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

MikeR,

To the best of my knowledge both the Comp and the Edge run about 5* of timing advance. The Blue Chip timing box I have runs about 4*.



These timing numbers are in addition to the fueling level enhancements so when in this context the PM3 and FMS do no timing.



Gotta go,

Mark

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Rob,

Since when could you get out of trouble? much less stay out of it???:-laf

 

[Bigsaint]

MikeR, good info, thanks .



We are all in this together guys, don't be afraid to point out the negative aspects as well as the positive with any mod, that's how we all learn. When I first tried the TST, especially with the big injectors, I thought that I had a problem unto myself, never really heard of any defueling shutter complaints from most when they described their boxes. I PM'd a few members and found out I was not alone. While I'm quick to say I do have a shutter, it's more of a comment than a complaint. It's only harsh in the upper levels and I seldom go there, no need for me, the combo of the 5's and the EZ are more than enough to keep me smiling as a daily driver. Level 2 on the TST makes me go every time I use it.



Talk about fugly, take a look at the TST box, it's a pig for sure. While the TST remote is pretty trick, the box is large and really does not give the appearance of high tech. The Blue Chip FMS and the new Edge Comp. look like they are right from NASA, mine looks like something the Soviets are using for their space program . But it's all mine and I AM HAPPY, that is all that matters. Pick your favorite flavor and enjoy the ride.



Scott W.

 

[Diesel Freak]

Re: MikeR,

Originally posted by Mark_Kendrick

To the best of my knowledge both the Comp and the Edge run about 5* of timing advance. The Blue Chip timing box I have runs about 4*.

Are you sure about that... ... . what data do you have to prove that? How is timing advanced in the VP44?



I am calling you out on this one!

 

[Chipstien]

Re: Re: MikeR,

Originally posted by Diesel Freak









Are you sure about that... ... . what data do you have to prove that? How is timing advanced in the VP44?



I am calling you out on this one!

I believe that Mark has a separate box for timing since the FMS doesn't have advance.

 

[Diesel Freak]

Re: Re: Re: MikeR,

Originally posted by Chipstien

I believe that Mark has a separate box for timing since the FMS doesn't have advance.

That is not what I am getting at, and Mark knows it... ... VP44 timing advance is not static, and changes with RPM and injection volume, so what he posted is basicly BS, unless he gives a specific RPM and injection volume that the advance occurs at.

 

[777 MECHANIC]

Originally posted by JFulmer

777, How is that B-1 doing? What kinda temp drops did you get, I know you ran around with the DD3's for a while without it!



Jim

Jim,

I dropped 250-300 degrees. i can still hit 1300 on a hard long run.

Before I could peg the gauge at 1600.

Mike

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Re: Re: MikeR,

Originally posted by Diesel Freak









Are you sure about that... ... . what data do you have to prove that? How is timing advanced in the VP44?



I am calling you out on this one!

the timing is done by tricking the VP44 into thinking the crank/cam is where it is not. The alter the signal coming from the cam position sensor.



The advance is varaible but generally ends up being 5* (comp) most of the time. The Blue Chip timing box(external to the FMS) maxes at about 4*.

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Re: Re: Re: Re: MikeR,

Originally posted by Diesel Freak





That is not what I am getting at, and Mark knows it... ... VP44 timing advance is not static, and changes with RPM and injection volume, so what he posted is basicly BS, unless he gives a specific RPM and injection volume that the advance occurs at.

The timing module basically shifts the timing curve wider in the direction of advance by X number of degrees.



Later,

Mark

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

I got to playing today and discovered that I could make a significant 'cloud' in neutral by goosing the trottle.



As large as my injectors are I have to keep revs up to keep smoke down.



I think the comp on 1/1 did a better job of controling smoke. I still think the FMS is cooler