Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) bosch injectors??????

[td343]

I'm looking for advise on bosch injectors for my 1997 12 valve. I have stock injectors now. I'm looking to upgrade for more power. Can people share goods/bads/heat/smoke? What would be a good h. p. injector to buy? I have upgraded intake, banks quick turbo, fuel plate, trans lock up, guages, 4" ex. and I can puy my foot in it all day without high temps.



Thanks.

 

[dieselshadow]

There are a ton of injectors to choose from, mild to wild Oo. I would recommend calling a reputable shop such as Dynomite Diesel or many others out there so they can profile your truck and make the appropriate recommendation. You could always go with a 12v favorite, the 370's. They are very inexpensive and offer a lot of performance for a little dough. They do smoke more than stock, and they tend to "haze" at idle.

 

[HighRanger]

Rip over at sourceautomotive. biz has really helped me in making a educated decision on what turbo/ injectors to add to mine.

 

[Shadrach]

If you have access to good prices on Cummins parts then try p/n 3802625RX. They are from a 230hp Freightliner with a 12v 5. 9 Shadrach

 

[ndurbin]

The problem with 370s and a few others is they are made for marine aplications and the spray pattern is different. That causes the haze @ idle that is so common. Mine only hazes in the winter time and really isn't to bad.



If you stick with the 315hp or so injectors and lower they wont haze as they have the correct spray pattern for our motors. There are a few places around (New Era Diesel for example) that offer some modified 370s and 435s that don't haze and run alil cooler than the standard injectors.



I've been happy with my 370s and don't regret them one bit.

 

[TEasley]

I installed Bosch 330 hp injectors and am very happy with them. P/N 0 432 131 753. They were new and cost just under $400. With medium to heavy throttle, they smoke until boost comes up, but they brought my truck to life. Mileage unloaded is as good as before, loaded is down 1/2 to 1 mpg, running 5 - 10 mph faster and the performance improvement either way is remarkable. With the mods you already have, you could probably get even more out of them than my truck does.



Good luck, Tom

 

[td343]

Thanks Tom- How about egt's? Did you get a high increase when you put your foot in it up hills?

 

[TEasley]

Yes, about 100* unloaded and 250* spikes pulling the travel trailer. GCVW ~ 13,500#. cruising at 70 unloaded it's making ~8 psig boost and 700*. Pulling the trailer at 65 it makes ~ 13 psig boost at 900*. When it comes out of O/D and unlocks the convertor on a hard grade it goes on the governor at 2700 rpm making 32-33 psig boost until it regains speed and locks up everything again, or I let up on it. The highest spike I've seen was 1250* maybe 2-3 minutes, but it was stronger than a wet goat.

I suspect I'm on the threshold of hurting the transmission.



Tom

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

TEasley are those 4 or 5 hole injectors? I think they have the marine spray pattern too. I have marine 300s in my '98 and they are 4-hole but they do fine, no haze and are pretty clean on my otherwise-stock truck.

If you were pulling 1250F for 2-3 minutes straight that's flirting with disaster. . . in my years on this board there's been at least 2 guys melt down holding 1250F up a grade.

ndurbin I believe all injectors over 230hp have the marine spray pattern.

Vaughn

 

[JWashburn]

The 370s produce what has been referred to in the past as "stumble. " For me it happens before the engine is warm. After looking at some past threads, it has been fixed in some cases with 191 DVs or in others . 020 DVs.

Any comment?

The 370s may be cheap, but if new DVs are required then the DDP3s might be the right choice.

 

[ndurbin]

The 315s and lower wether their automotive or marine are 4 hole for the most part as I understand it (probably a few exceptions out there as there are alotta injector combos). The 330s, 370s, and others have 5 holes, which seems to generate the haze from what I've seen/understood. There are alotta injector combos out there so compairing even Joe's 300s to Bob's 300s isn't always the same injector.

 

[TEasley]

Vaughn; the 330's are 5 hole marine injectors. I haven't seen the idle haze I've read about, but they do smoke moderately above 1/2 throttle until boost comes up.



Thanks for the heads-up on the egt. I knew to keep it under 1300* for sure, but I didn't really worry about the short term excursion to 1250*. I will now. I believe that I can back off on the speed on grades that unlock the O/D and convertor and hold the temp to 1100* and 25 # boost max. I'll experiment next chance I get.



Vaughn, might the guys who melted down have had their thermocouple post-turbo?



Thanks again, Tom

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Tom I use 1150 to keep it on the safe side. 1300F might be OK on the 3rd Gen HO and 04. 5+ motors since they have better piston cooling, but the 24v and 12v need to be kept a little cooler. . . some say 1250 but I say 1200 if more than a minute. I go with 1150 to be safe, 1200 for short periods max. This is all towing conditions, drag racing you can go higher in short spurts.

Part of the reasoning is when you push the limits, you leave very little margin for safety especially if the pyro doesn't happen to be real accurate. Both guys that melted down at 1250 were 24 valves and had the pyro pre-turbo.

On the injectors I think 5 holes is better than 4, the 330 injector might be fun cheap injector to try. Not interested in 370s, they're a little too much for me. The 300s are probably the biggest 4-hole injector, and probably smoke more than the 5-hole 330s because of it.

Vaughn

 

[PKirby]

I have the 330 Marine injectors. My truck doesn't smoke under normal driving. They made a huge difference from my 180hp injectors and I can slip my clutch in 5th gear. I have no EGT issues. I am thinking about upgrading to DDP3s for more power.

 

[Cashin]

I am running bosch 300's and have no issues with my timing and #4 palte full forward. At WOT I approach 1300 at the peek. Seems perfect to me. Doug at advanced diesel tech. helped set me up and was great to work with. 304-864-3399. Injectors 400. 00 labor to install 100. 00. Hope this helps. Cashin

 

[TEasley]

td343; Good thread, thanks.



Vaughn, 1150 it is. I can live with it. This is one good truck, gotta take care of it.



PKirby, do you think that your turbo setup is holding egt's down?



Tom

 

[PKirby]

PKirby, do you think that your turbo setup is holding egt's down?

Tom

I think it does a good job but I made so many changes at the same time it is hard to tell. With my original 180hp injectors, #6 plate, and a WH1C turbo without a boost elbow I could hit 1300 deg. I added my 330 marines, #100 plate and the hybrid turbo at the same time. It would hit about 1400 deg with a homemade boost elbow but my boost pressure was unsteady, It would spike above 40psi and then drop below 30. Since I added the boost controller I cant make it get over 1300 deg and my full throttle boost pressure holds 35psi. On the Hybrid I had the wheels balanced and drilled a 9/16" hole in the 12cm exhaust housing divider to vent all the cylinders. I am sure one of the new Switzer based turbos would be better but mine was cheap.

 

[td343]

Seems like people talk highly of the DDP injectors, and talk is mediorcre on the Bosch injectors. DDP are more expensive! It also seems like most people run with Bosch? Has anyone ever went from Bosch to DDP in the same HP range? Or vise versa?

 

[dieselshadow]

I can tell you the DDP injectors are worth the extra money. They are smoother and more powerful, and a lot less smoke. As a matter of fact, I sent in my 370's for mod to stage 4 extrude honed. They'll put a smile on your face! They are very streetable. I'd recommend them to anyone including guys with "little" 160 p pumps that have been modded by Piers, like mine. Oo.