Archived Bosch ve rotary died on the way home

[skuntz01]

So I was on the way home from work last night and I was cruisin down the road at 45 or so when all the sudden the truck shut off and then wouldn't start. I replaced the fuel filter and primed the pump but still nothing. It was registering on my fuel pressure gauge after the fuel filter somewhere around 5 or 6 psi. I cracked multiple injectors one at a time and no fuel at the injectors. I then took out the shut off solenoid and pushed the lift pump primer and fuel was coming out so I'm assuming that means that the lift pump is fine and there is a problem with my injection pump. Only problem is that it was rebuilt about 40 or 50k ago. The truck is a non ic 1991. To give a little more info I have been experiencing some pulsing/surging on cold start up but goes away when warm and also intermittent rough and low somewhat violent shaking idle.

Just to muddy up the waters and let everyone know what I'm working with.... the truck has a 2nd gen lift pump and bigger line from the draw in the tank to the injection pump. It has a fuel regulator and a 2nd gen fuel filter and housing kit from all from genos. Injection pump has had timing jumped a tooth at the gear and has a fuel pin gov spring and fuel scew adjusted. Truck also has stock injectors and a 60mm compressor ugrade. Also as far as the pump goes I removed the plunger from the shut off solenoid (the only other time this truck has left me on the road) and the ksb is unplugged (not sure why but it is). If that hasn't confused everyone enough the pump was also rebuilt about 2 years ago but did not have a new head and rotor put in it and the odo is only reading 228k (seems like this should not be happening). Lastly I should probably mention I have run this truck on wvo for the past 40k.

I work out of this truck and really need it up and going asap. I realize this could probably many different things especially with all the monkeying I've done with everything. I'm really just looking for ways to test and check and narrow it down a little because I still haven't ruled out the possibility of it being something stupid and simple. Any advice would be greatly appreciated... I've been calling around and searching the Internet but it's hard to find people who know anything about these trucks.

 

[1320Fastback]

Check for 12V at Fuel Solenoid with key on.

 

[crabman]

Please go to the following link.
http://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/94-98-engine/58777-joe-gs-fuel-system-writeup.html

 

[skuntz01]

Thanks for the link that helped a lot and prompted me to check the lift pump again because as I learned in that write up... the hand primer and the plunger that rides on the cam are two separate pumps. I found on another forum post also that the pump should push 0.7 qts in 30 seconds of cranking. 30 seconds seemed like a really long time so I only turned it over for 15 to 20 seconds. From doing this I concluded that the motor was not pushing nearly enough and not nearly as much as the hand primer so now the lift pump is suspect again. Only problem is that the pump is only about a year old and is a cummins brand pump so its hard for me to believe its bad but then I noticed something under the cummins stamp MADE IN CHINA.... yeah that's right pay the extra money for the cummins brand and get autozone quality... gotta love it. So now maybe go get another pump? Brand doesn't matter just hopefully I can find one that isn't made in china.

I however still am not convinced that the pump is bad because when I took the pump off and pushed the metal plunger with my hand it seemed to pump just as well at the hand primer. Keep in mind this is a second gen pump on a first gen truck with the spacer to make it work right. I am wondering if there isn't something with all of that that is causing it to not pump right. I also checked the condition of the metal plunger and the lobe on the cam and both look great.

 

[jhenderson]

Cummins is a world wide co and manufactures parts all around the globe. USA, China, India, Brazil, Turkey, England and Japan to name a few. Just because it doesn't say USA on it doesn't mean it's not Cummins.

 

[mwilson]

What he says ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

If it has the 7 digit Cummins part number on it the country of manufacture is irrelevant, they make stuff all over the world. And they do it well (unlike some others)...

 

[NIsaacs]

they make stuff all over the world. And they do it well ..

Like the 53 block and V series engines of yesteryear?

Nick

 

[mwilson]

Like the 53 block and V series engines of yesteryear?

Nick

For the majority of the time.......Now Rapidserve (the warranty part) is a whole 'nother story...

Detroit Diesel is global now as well. The DD platform is used almost everywhere that emissions controls are required.

 

[skuntz01]

It does have a cummins number on it and it does say cummins on it. You say cummins is international but I wonder what percentage of there parts are made in china and what precentage were made in america or anywhere else for that matter . Cummins was not always international and publicly traded. I wonder if the original pump from 91 said made in China? You can worship the corporate gods if you want but just because it has cummins stamped on it doesn't mean it's good quality. .... at least not in today's world


BTW thanks for the advice on how to confirm the pump is bad or still good and helping me solve my issue

 

[mwilson]

I sell Genuine Cummins parts every day and country of manufacture means nothing as far as their parts are concerned. If it was an issue I would know about it. Cummins customers would not stand for bad parts and it would affect engine sales. To an engine OEM it's all about customers choosing their brand to power trucks, boats, gensets, etc...The last thing they want to be known for is a shoddy parts supply chain.
They have had a multi country supply chain since before I started at my place of work 20 years ago.


Now Chinese sub-standard crap that Autozone and others peddle to the unsuspecting public is a different story.

 

[Missouri Mule]

If you have a return line on that injection pump you should have an overflow valve. If the overflow valve is stuck open you won't get fuel to the injectors, for that matter it wouldn't get fuel if it was stuck closed.

 

[cerberusiam]

Detroit Diesel is global now as well. The DD platform is used almost everywhere that emissions controls are required.

Yeah, all MB designed equipment though, Detroit as it was originally is long dead.

Op, if you have fuel at the shutoff solenoid and you know the solenoid is good it is probably the pump IP. 50k may just be the lifetime of the rebuild you got, ULSD raises havoc with everything and the VE pumps are far from immune. If you have no fuel at the injectors it could be a simple as a piece of fuzz in the case PR valve to a bad distribution head. Running WVO and not replacing the head and rotor just makes the pump that much more suspect. The truck will start and run with just gravity feed from a fuel can so any amount of fuel being delivered should get it to pop given shutoff vlave is good and pump is good.