Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) broken ARP stud

[59Turbo]

Here's a good one for you guys... Have any of you ever had an arp head stud break off and dent the inside of the hood? I don't know when it happened but I happened to be walking by the truck and noticed a dent in the hood, from the inside. I installed the studs last nov. or dec and they were retorqued 3 times to 130 ft/lbs. How much luck am I going to have drilling the stud out of the block without taking the head off? At least it's a stud that is close to the front of the engine and I can see down into the hole. HELP!

 

[Tiger Rag]

Every one I've heard of, the head had to come off. I hope someone else will have a better option for you though. I hate to hear that for you. Good luck and keep us posted.



BTW, 130 ft lbs may have been the culprit. Most I know go max of 120-125. I'm chicken "bleep" so I went 120..... even then I was nervous.

 

[SGrasmick]

Well if the Studs were installed according to specs, the stud should not be tight and should back out fairly easy

 

[RonA]

One of my studs twisted and broke (not ARP). I made a bushing to slide down into the hole and center the drill. Then I used a left hand spiral drill and went down just a little ways. The stud came right out. Chase the thread with a long tap and insert a new stud. I used ARP moly lube and torqued mine to 96 originally. I have since retorqued to 110 with the moly lube. I have had no problems at an occasional 65 psi. If you have difficulty finding the drill and tap let me know and I can send mine to you. I can make a bushing for you also if you don't have access to a lathe. Use a shop-vac with a small piece of plastic tubing to clean out the hole before inserting the stud.



Ron

 

[Jim Fulmer]

One thing you can try and I've seen this done. Take a small pipe, I mean small that will fit in the hole of the head, the pipe has to have a 1/4" hole inside of it! Put the pipe in the hole, then put a arc welding rod inside of it and bottom it out on the stud piece that is in the block, then with it all bottomed out. ground the pipe like your going to weld on the pipe. Once this is complete touch the lead to the welding rod that is bottomed out and it will weld the stud piece and pipe together and you can unscrew the stud out of the block.



Told this idea to another TDR member a few months back and it worked great for him.



Jim

 

[59Turbo]

I'll try to find a left handed drill bit but if I can't that welding rod idea sounds pretty slick. I think the 130 ft/lbs was the culprit too and I'm not looking forward to buying another set of arps. I'm thinking of using the stock headbolts again. Whaddaya think? Thanks for the help guys, I'll keep you posted.

 

[Tiger Rag]

I'll try to find a left handed drill bit but if I can't that welding rod idea sounds pretty slick. I think the 130 ft/lbs was the culprit too and I'm not looking forward to buying another set of arps. I'm thinking of using the stock headbolts again. Whaddaya think? Thanks for the help guys, I'll keep you posted.

Nah, don't buy a new set. You can buy just one. Just call ARP. I lost a nut and had to buy one... ... course it was about $4-$5 for a nut! Make sure the stud isn't bottomed out at the bottom of the block before you tq it. I'm not sure if I'd back them all out and re-torque to 120 or take a chance on that one and go back to 130. Be less work doing just that one, but you still run the risk of breaking it at that tq..... :--) Just make sure they are all the same tq though. Good luck to you.

 

[59Turbo]

Thanks for all the advice so far, this forum is the best. I didn't realize I could buy just one stud. Well, I got it out today. Tried drilling it but that was futile so I stuck a large flat screwdriver in the hole and luckily the stud broke at an angle so I was able to back it out. I stuck a headbolt in there for now. I think I have to pull the head again tho cuz there's some oil in the coolant (small droplets and an oily film on rad. cap). This is getting old. Any good headgaskets available like an MLS or something or is it time to o-ring or fire ring? All opinions welcome. Also who does that oringing or fire ringing in the Northeast?

 

[Tiger Rag]

Ah, that's too bad on the headgasket. Well, if you're going to have to pull the head for a new headgasket, you may as well oring it while you are at it. The machining will be probably around $300 and in my opinion you'd rather do it while you have the chance than to not do it and wish you had later. Good luck on finding a NE shop to help you out on that. Hopefully someone will chime in that can help on that.

 

[Signal73]

O-ringing can be done at



massdiesel.com In walpole, Mass



or



tricountymachine.com in Lebanon, CT



Both great shops.



Good luck, Jim

 

[JoshPeters]

All I gotta say is... .



Thank god I have good "feel" when it comes to tightening things!



#ad




JP

 

[CumminsAholic]

Just an FYI. I torqued, and retorqued, mine to 140ft lbs with the moly lube. Went to 135 and then 140 on the retorques. I know it's pushing it, but that's what I was told to do with my o-ringed head. None broke yet, hopefully I didn't jinx myself by telling you guys.

Corey

 

[59Turbo]

Just an FYI. I torqued, and retorqued, mine to 140ft lbs with the moly lube. Went to 135 and then 140 on the retorques. I know it's pushing it, but that's what I was told to do with my o-ringed head. None broke yet, hopefully I didn't jinx myself by telling you guys.

Corey

Damn dude, 140 ftlbs!! Did you do the retorque hot or cold? I did mine cold and I think that made it worse due to the metal expanding when hot and putting added strain on the studs. I'm definately oringing this time. Not sure if I should reuse those studs again or if they're stretched beyond thier limits. How would the stock headbolts do with orings?

 

[JoshPeters]

I was told you can not use stock head bolts and O-rings or Fire rings. If you are pushing the truck far enough to need either O-rings or Fire rings you are beyond the limits of the factory head bolts. The head bolts are torque to yeld type that will streach or break when stressed like that.



Aside from that, you can't put the proper clamping force on a O-ring or Fire ring for it to be effective with the head bolts.



JP

 

[Timbeaux38]

I was told you can not use stock head bolts and O-rings or Fire rings. If you are pushing the truck far enough to need either O-rings or Fire rings you are beyond the limits of the factory head bolts. The head bolts are torque to yeld type that will streach or break when stressed like that.

Aside from that, you can't put the proper clamping force on a O-ring or Fire ring for it to be effective with the head bolts.

JP

I know of a race truck that uses some beat up hillbilly technology running factory headbolts. They seem to hold fine at 158 MPH :--)

 

[JoshPeters]

I know of a race truck that uses some beat up hillbilly technology running factory headbolts. They seem to hold fine at 158 MPH :--)

Well, I not only stand corrected... . I'm impressed!



The question is... . is it recommended?



JP

 

[CumminsAholic]

I retorqued hot. I thought that the factory head bolts would stretch with say over 50 lbs of boost? Studs will probably break instead of stretch. I just wanted to get as much clamping force on it as I could... I don't want it to lift again like it did with the stock bolts and no o-rings.

Corey

 

[59Turbo]

Does Cometic make an MLS gasket?

 

[Jetpilot]

Does Cometic make an MLS gasket?

No... .



Doug Smith

 

[59Turbo]

damn... . Looks like the head is coming off again. Doug, I'll be calling you for another marine gasket, probably a thicker one to try and lower the cylinder pressure a little. Can those marine head gaskets be used with orings?