Building new CAD system - AMD or P4?

[TPCDrafting]

I'm looking at both platforms now and am not sure about the AMD's. I've never had one before. I'm looking at building a custom system rather than doing a package deal. I have $1000 to $1200 or less budjeted, so it can't be a real hot rod machine, but it's gotta have the following:

XP Pro

1 gig min ram

80 gig min. HD

good video card, but not top o' the line. I'm thinking along a nVidia w/ 64 meg

Either one 19" CRD or 2-17" CRD screens (LCD is still to pricey for me. )

CD-RW DVD combo drive

10/100 ethernet card

optical mouse



anything else I should look into?

Places online besides PC Club/Dell/?? to shop?

 

[MKoth]

Tim,



I have had AMD processors in my last 2 machines, and absolutely love them. But, only thing my desktop gets used for is internet access and games, so my applications are a lot differnet.



If you want to try building your own machine, newegg.com has very good prices on hardware. I think you should be able to get a 3000+ processor, 120 gig hard drive, and good 128 meg graphics card with dual monitor out for way less then your planned budget. You can even get one of the ose cool cases with all the LEDs and stuff.



I can't remember any decent computer stores in the cheyenne area, but it has been a few years since i was out there for school , so i am sure a lot has changed. Try shopping around at local places, see what kind of prices they give you. I know you can get everything you specified from the local DIT computer store for less then 700 bucks, not including monitors.





Matt

 

[R-N-R]

I hear that AMD has come a long way in compatability, and they currently have some very interesting technology. Just about any respectable CAD application will choke with only 64MG of video ram. What are you drawing and what software are you using?

 

[AKAMAC]

A neat site is http://www.pricewatch.com



My son does 3D rendering and swears by AMD. For 1k you can build an AMD 64 3500, 1 gig mem, 256 meg video card, 10/100 E-net, floppy, dvd burner and 550 watt 7 bay case. The software might add a little over that mark. Hope this helps. Mike

 

[PC12Driver]

AMD's rock for gaming, but a comparably priced P4 with more MHz will smoke the AMD when it comes to brute force number crunching like video/photo editing, CAD, or video encoding. Intel's Hyperthreading feature makes multitasking a lot smoother, too.



Of all the machines I've built, my AMD has been the least reliable. It's great for games, but that's not very critical work. I can expect the occasional Blue Screen of Death for no apparent reason every so often. On the other hand, I've got two other PC's in the house running Pentiums that literally have been running untouched for weeks.



AMD for games, Intel for serious stuff IMO.

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

I tell all my clients to buy PIV's and that's all I buy. AMD's are far more sensitive to heat (& heat damage) than Intels. Check out http://www.delloutlet.com - they have some great deals on PC's there (refurb's). I bought one for my wife and daughter there a couple of months ago - a PIV 2. 8Ghz PC with 512mb RAM, 60gb 7200 RPM IDE, DVD Rom, Network card, keyboard, mouse, Win XP Pro, and a 17" LCD monitor for $750 shipped. It looked like it was a brand new machine - I don't think it had ever been shipped out. They have a search engine there that you can put in your specs that you are looking for and it will give you the machines that match your request.

 

[R-N-R]

If they open the box to configure the unit and the sale gets cancelled prior to shipment or otherwise, they have to sell in the refurb market

 

[robiR]

Check out Newegg.com

 

[TPCDrafting]

Thanks for the advise and sources. I'll up the vid card and likely stick with the p4 as that's all I've ever known. I'm using Autocad Arch'l Desktop now and it runs pretty good on this p4 1. 8ghz. Hey it was top o the line 3 yrs ago! The 3D orbiting will throw me out if I'm not careful. Other than that it runs for weeks at a time without restart.

 

[wicked6]

The current line of P4 processors are phenomenal performers, but even the "older" HT P4's can still handle more than the average CAD program can throw at them... If you spend more money on anything - make it memory & build your machine with a motherboard that will accept a wide range of P4 CPUs. . This way, you can get in fairly cheap, and upgrade your processor as the prices drop... (in the future, of course)... Keep the FSB specs in mind, too - get the most your money can buy...



I saw a video on the web where they took the heatsinks and fans off AMD and P4 CPUs, cranked up a pretty intense video app & watched the fun begin. . The P4 slowed down, quite a bit, but kept running. . The AMD self-destructed. . It's cheaper to buy one P4 than 2 or 3 AMD "replacements"...



(note: I am not a computer expert, nor do I play one on TV... )

 

[Bob Wagner]

Dell







Shipping Notification:

Note that your order may be shipped in separate boxes.

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Order detail - order placed 2005-03-20 14:45:58



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Dimension 3000 Desktop: Intel Celeron D Processor 320 (2. 40GHz, 533 FSB)

Microsoft Windows XP Home

512MB DDR NON-ECC SDRAM 400MHz (2 DIMMs)

No Floppy Drive

80 GB EIDE Hard Drive (7200 RPM)

56Kbps Data/Fax Modem

Sound Blaster Live! 24-bit ADVANCED HD Audio with 100dB Perform

48X CD RW Drive

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MOD,KIT,CDSK,AOL9. 0,BUDROM,DAO . 01

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Then I picked up a 17" ViewSonic LCD for 250. 00 delivered from www.newegg.com

 

[Byershome]

Newegg is the place to go if you want to build it yourself, they aren't always the dirt cheapest but they are usually close. As to AMD or Intel, I've not built a Intel system since the Pentium 233MMX came out and you won't find one on my work bench being built anytime soon(probably never). Performance and compatibility wise there is no difference. Intel achieves performance using brute force( pipelines and clock speed) AMD does it by being more efficient. You will just spend more for the Intel processor, memory and motherboard for equal performance. I have a Barton core 3200+ and use AutoCAd lite on occasion along with my home design cad software from punch and it doesn't even blink when rendering in 3D.



Considering how much LCD's have come down and some of the great discounts I've seen lately you might want to look closer at getting one rather than a CRT.

 

[TPCDrafting]

Ok so it sounds like the AMD/Pentium selection is a matter of personal preference like many products.

So now I'm looking at 32 bit vs 64 bit. I know it's the typical "more is better" scenario, but is it worth the additional cost? I'm only seeing about a $200 difference so I'm seriously considering the 64 bit processors. If it's not really worth it, I'll save the cash for something else. PC Club so far has the best "build it piece by piece" website that I have found. Anybody have any objection to PC Club?

 

[Byershome]

I would go 64 bit and purchase WinXP pro 64 bit version to go with it. It probably will not make much difference though unless your CAD program is 64 bit also.



It is probably to much for you to spend but the new duel core 64 bit processor AMD just cam out with will smoke anything Intel has, badly. Of course it is kind of cheating because it's really two processors in one

 

[PC12Driver]

Until there are more 64 bit programs, a 64 bit OS is not really worth it. To run the current 32 bit apps, XP64 needs to emulate 32 bit mode. So instead of the OS just running the app, it needs to throw a middle man in the mix to translate. Every 32 bit app that I've seen run on XP64 has taken a hit in performance (not much, but it's there). And there's been some cases of current apps just flat out not running on XP64.



As far as processors, the 64 bit trick is one of the ways AMD can make a 2. 2 GHz processor run like an Intel 3. 2 GHz. XP64 will take more advantage of the 64 bit processor, but if the apps are still 32 bit nothing is gained.

 

[fkovalski]

... I'm using Autocad Arch'l Desktop now and it runs pretty good on this p4 1. 8ghz. ...

Tim-

Which version are you running? Will you be upgrading? We just stepped up to ADT 2006 (gotta do the old dog/ new tricks thing again with it) and had an Instructor give us a 3 day seminar on it. He mentioned that anything other than P4 (or Intel M chips) would not support it. I was asking him this in terms of laptops that I am shopping. I assume it hold true (?) for PC's. More info for you for what it worth.



Also, I second what Steve mentioned about the Dell outlet. They also seem to be running some pretty good deals for smoking machines at a decent price.



Side note: The learning curve as it appears to me from our current 2004 to 2006 is similar to that of when I stepped up from V14 to DeskTop. It is definitly more powerful, but is going to take some getting used to.

-frank.

 

[TPCDrafting]

I'm considering upgrading to 06 but I'm also looking at other cad platforms as well. I'm not real satisfied with Arch'l desktop, it's not as advanced as it ought to be by now. At least for what I'm doing anyway.



I've been browsing the ACAD forums and many are saying the AMD processors are the way to go. I'm sure Autodesk gets an endorcement to say all they can run on are P4's, but I'm leary at the same time if it's true or not.



I've been drawing steel shops for the last two weeks :{ :{

 

[TPCDrafting]

Us computer freaks might find this intersting:

http://www.inventor-certified.com/graphics/SV10_Puiblic_by_time.pdf



It's a CAD package test on several machines, all paramaters were set the same on all. I guess AMD works just fine.