Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) Bypassing the Fuel Shutdown Solenoid?

[Ben Rumson]

'95 with just under 160k.



Have replaced the Fuel Shutdown RELAY twice in the last month as well as the Fused Link between the battery and the relay.



Truck is not starting as it should again. I'm back to having to manually lift the plunger with key "on" and then truck will start.



I kind of remember hearing about some of you bypassing the solenoid entirely with an on/off switch... ?



What are the pros and cons of doing this?



How is this done?



Thanks

- Ben



Should I be checking something else besides the solenoid?

 

[856.9]

Some install a manaul cable, like an old choke cable.



Pro's no more solenoid, and not electrical to keep the engine running.



Con's have a cable if you don't like that kind of thing.





https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=64225&highlight=fuel+cable

 

[Dave Remillard]

I understand that some times the linkage on the solenoid can be out of adjustment and not allow for full upward travel. You may want to take a look at it. Give Al or Piers a call if you need help and advice to adjust it.

 

[Dan_69GTX]

A tractor supply place normally sells replacement cables for fuel shut off on tractors. They work much better than a standard choke cable.



Aren't electrical problems just FUN?!?!?



Check your Pmail...



Dan

 

[onestackdram]

I just literally took my selenoid off and made a manual shutoff myself. It wasnt really that hard at all. All you need is a 5/16" wrench and socket. A small 'L' shaped bracket to mount to the top bolt on the shut off its self. on the other end of the bracket you use have either two holes or one bigger one. with a small spring 2-3" run it to the throttle bracket forward to keep the shutoff in the open position and then go to Napa and get a choke cable to run to the cab, (will have to be a fairly sturdy one). This will set it up so that its a pull to shut off cable. and then it will spring back into the open position to start next time. if you have any questions of more detail just pm me

 

[HoleshotHolset]

I used a PTO cable... .



My only complaint is that it is almost TOO heavy duty... . it was a bit of a pain running that cable as it didn't want to flex much at all.



Other than that... it has performed flawlessly. I also see a . 005mpg improvement... . since the load on the alternator has decreased from not having to power up the shutdown solenoid.



Matt

 

[Ben Rumson]

No cotter pin....?

I fiddled with the adjusting screw a bit and got the truck to start on occasion without lifting the plunger.



Starts everytime with a manual pull-up on the plunger.



I also found out that the cotter pin was missing and the plunger had worked it's way away from the engine just enough to cover the hole where the cotter pin was supposed to be. I replace the pin.



At the moment the truck will start from inside the cab, but I don't imagine this will last much longer.



I won't have time to look at the cable fix for a few days, but will keep everyone posted.



Thanks all.



- Ben

 

[RLuster]

Not the solenoid

Two trucks that have had the same problem did a wire ck and the middle wire in the plug does not work at start up. we ran a new one and works fine now.

 

[radixr]

Rluster,



Did you replace the middle wire from the plug to the solenoid or from the plug to the relay?

 

[bighammer]

Stupid Questions

When you have a manual cable, is it important to the charging circuit (or anything else) to pull the cable before turning off the key? I'm pretty sure I would remember to do it that way, but if the truck is borrowed by a friend (or SWMBO ) and it's not done right, will it fry something?



Also is there any problem in having a normally "on" spring loaded setup as described above?

 

[856.9]

If I'm catching on right the fuel solenoid or maybe just the manual cable is left in the run position. So you pull the cable to kill the engine, then it returns to run.



If you've got a stick, hope you're parking brake is good. Truck might roll away and fire up.

 

[53 Willys]

I've been using a cable for about two years. I never gave a thought about shutting down the engine before the key untill someone brought it up here. So mine has been done this way for along time and there have been zero problems with the alt. As to the return spring if the cable does'nt return on its own-then it makes a good anti theft device.

 

[kaffine krazed]

Something else to check on the electrical solenoid. Take the postive battery cable apart take the bolt out of the terminal and make sure it is clean. I have seen trucks where the bolt had so much corosion on it the soleniod was running of the passenger side battery and the passenger side battery wasn't getting a charge. Another thing to do is move where it gets it's power from to the PDC instead of the battery to cut down on corrosion problems.

 

[Ben Rumson]

Thanks Everyone for all your help !

I installed my PTO cable last night and all is well !!!



I took great satisfaction in removing the Shutdown Solenoid and it's mounting bracket... aaaahhhhh.



I ordered a 10' PTO cable through AWDirect for $23 including shipping. VERY well made unit. My local dealership wanted $380 for a new solenoid..... NOT!



What I did:

Drilled a hole in the dash panel directly in front of my right knee.



Cut away some styrofoam on the back side of the moulding to aligh the bracket directly behind the hole.



Mounted a flat piece of steel behind it with a hole in it to secure the PTO cable to with a nut on each side.



Drilled a hole about 2" to the right (looking under the dash from inside the truck) and down about 2" from where the throttle cable on the fuel pedal goes through the fire wall.



Removed failed solenoid and mounting bracket.



Attached an "L" bracket to the top bolt of the Fuel Shutdown Arm and drilled a small hole for the PTO cable to go through.



Cut cable to length (about 2. 5 feet long is all) and installed it using two "cable stops" - one on each side of the "L" bracket to hold the cable in place and allow it to push and pull on the lever. Cable



Done.



From inside the truck, all you can see is the knob. No external bolts are visible because they were used to attach it to the brace BEHIND the moulding. When the knob is pulled to shut the fuel off, all you see is a nice small hole with the metal tube that the knob is attached to. Push to run and pull lto stop. Works great. Knob is easy to reach - no bending or need to actually look for it. It's right there in front of my right hand as I reach to shut off the key. The cable is stiff enough that no additional fastening was needed on the engine end of the cable. Also nice is that it's almost a direct straight path foreward to the shutoff lever. The cable is out of the way and no sharp bends or kinks.



I tried a throttle return spring from the shutoff arm foreward so that the lever would reset to the foreward/run position after being pulled, but the hole I drilled in the moulding is tight enough on the pull shaft behind the knob that it rubs against the plastic and there's too much friction for the spring to pull it back. So far I haven't minded it this way. If my wife complains, I'll pull out the good 'ol Dremel Tool and widen the hole ever so slightly.



I don't have a digital camera, but I'll borrow one sometime and take a few pics for everyone to see the finished deal.



Smilin' wide this morning !!!!



Thanks again for all the help.

-Ben

 

[Ben Rumson]

and another thing....

I can't even begin to list how much money the TDR Members (you guys) and Journals have saved me. Certainly in the serveral hundreds of dollars, if not thousnds - especially considering preventive maintenance items like the KDP Fix, transmission Cooler Quick Connects!



Not to mention the quality upgrades I've made to the performance of the truck itself.



Here's to everyone - Cheers !!!!!



- Ben

 

[HoleshotHolset]

Ben:



Glad you got her up and running.....



It looks like our many PM's made at least a little sense.



Always happy to help out where I can...



Matt

 

[rich m]

Re: Thanks Everyone for all your help !

Originally posted by Ben Rumson



I ordered a 10' PTO cable through AWDirect for $23 including shipping. VERY well made unit. My local dealership wanted $380 for a new solenoid..... NOT!



-Ben

just ordered mine!

 

[Ben Rumson]

Rich,



The cable is very heavy duty and looks very sharp. The handle is about 2" in diameter and easy to grab onto.



Only drawback/advantage is that it is very stiff. The cable is about as big around as your little finger. It can bend a fairly tight circle, but not as easily as a rubber hose.



I cut mine completely off to about 4 feet. Then I used a dremel cut-off disk to cut the outer plastic sheeth and the dozen or so continuous verticle wire supports. From there I used my pocket knife to cut through the inner white (teflon coated?) sheeth until only the center pull cable was left. I let this "run long" until I had everything installed and knew more precisely how short to cut it off. I left it a bit long just in case I decided to rearrange anything in the future.



A Cable Stop (Autozone - the large silver colored ones - the gold colored ones are too small) will keep you from having to kink or bend the main cable and will make fine tuning much easier.



Don't buy anything to hook the far end of the cable yet. You may not need anything. The cable comes with a small pair of clamps to secure the far end of the cable to something to keep it from moving when pushed. In my case (mounting the knob in front of my right knee [half way between the top and bottom of the lower dash moulding piece] and running the cable directly foreward to the shutoff lever) the cable was so short when finished and rigid enough that I didn't need to fasten the far end to anything else besides the shutoff lever.



If I can steal my bro-in-law's (PSD owner... ) digital camera again, I'll take some pics for others to see and e-mail them to you.



Good luck with the UPGRADE.



As a side note: A friend and I are going to UPGRADE his to the same setup this summer BEFORE he starts having problems with the POS Solenoid.



Got to admit though, that it's pretty weird to shut the key off and have the engine still run.....

 

[radixr]

Pictures, Ben, we need pictures!!!Oo. Oo.

 

[Ben Rumson]

Update #2

Originally posted by radixr

Pictures, Ben, we need pictures!!!Oo. Oo.

Trying to get a digital camera so that I can post pics for all to see.



UPDATE:

I got a wild hair and decided to secure the engine end of the cable just because... Big mistake. Waste of time.



My PTO cable (AWDirect) has continuous verticle strands of wire running the full length of the cable underneath the outer plastic sheath. This makes for a very tough cable, but when I secured the engine end of the cable with a clamp to the side of the AFC housing the vibration of the motor was transferred/conducted directly up the cable into the cab and made a horribly LOUD whinning noise. Far to loud to deal with.



The engine end of the cable is plenty stong without being secured to anything. I should have left well enough alone.



Oh well, live and learn. I just had to keep tinkering...