Calling all experts on Turbo Chargers ???

[HonkinDiesel]

I'm no expert on turbo chargers, but I'm trying to get a little educated here. I've been reading the Holset and Garret website to get some background on the subject. (Good reading I might add) I also read the existing history on turbo threads on this TDR 1st gen site.



Most of you have upgraded to the Holset (or PDR) HX35 wastegated or swapped out our honkin 21cm housings for smaller ones and the like. And then some keeners have slapped on some twin turbos...



Soooo, I'm aching to ask, has anyone out there looked at using other brands of turbos such as Garret, KKK, etc. ?



What about Variable Vane Turbos, or Variable Geometry turbos like the Holset HE300? Has anyone tried this technology?



Why go for twins over some VVT or VGT technology?



So maybe some of you would be willing to share your thoughts on this subject?

(Pastor Bob jump in here anytime!)

 

[swankmetal]

well, i can offer that the reason vgt turbos haven't gotten much use is that they really aren't available to the public yet. and they're extraordinarily pricey. there is one guy who successfully ran one a while back. his handle is/was wiercummin. i tried getting ahold of him with no luck. because i've got a big vgt and a little vgt. i've got some ideas. as far as other brands go, schwizter turbos get a lot of use these days. they are supposedly built pretty tough. i would certainly like to try a couple of the garrets myself. anyway, does that help?



dave

 

[HonkinDiesel]

Thanks for the reply Dave. Judging from the response we have alot of lookers but no more takers. You are the only brave one to post an answer.



Are you planning on puting those VGT's on the cummins? If, so you gotta let us know the end result.



I'm looking to reduce that turbo lag and still get good top end response. Twins, VVT or VGT seems to be the only way to go. I'm not keen on twining... Too much plumbing!



I'm kinda shocked, I guess no one else has anything to add. It is sounding like the better Turbo technology is still in its infancy and is only available to itsy bitsy vehicles like the VW TDI's. I had heard through the grape vine either the power choke or Duracrap might be using a VGT. They are 6-6. 5L engines. Maybe I have to take a closer look at what they are using.



- Peter

 

[swankmetal]

have you searched the rest of the site? there have been a few threads on them here and there, but not a whole lot of actual info. supposedly, bank$ is/was working on a garrett vgt system. but only for 3rd gens. the reason for going with twins is that a single just can not be that efficient on the top end at really high boost. in communicating with a guy on here, kennytaylor, who works for holset, i learned that the vgt's will be available on the aftermarket next year. we'll see. as of right now, there is no support for them in this country. and yes, those two that i have will hopefully come to rest under my hood. it'll prolly be awhile though as it will require a whole lot of r&d, and electronics(i strongly dislike that word). sorry i can't offer more, but if you come across anything, bring it to the table.



dave

 

[HonkinDiesel]

Dave:

I've been over the 1st gen threads and not a whole lot of info on turbos.



I'll keep my eyes peeled for aftermarket VGT's and let you folks know. I hope everyone else will too.



As for the electronics R&D if you need some help maybe I can assist. I'm an Electronics Engineering Technologist. Let me know what you want to do and maybe I can find an easy solution for you or at least discuss your options.



Peter

 

[justinp20012500]

There are lots of people using different variations of the S300G (comes on L10 cummins, and C10 CATs)







<<<<---- Check my gallery out, there is a couple pics of the S300G in there.





Justin

 

[RonA]

I believe Swayse went from twins to an Aurora turbo. Must not have liked it as I see it's for sale. The norm seems to be buy several high performance turbos and then go to twins. They do seem to hold up better in the long run.

 

[DieselMinded]

Here's some reading for ya'



http://www.3d. otisnet.net/turbo's.htm



http://www.3d.otisnet.net/turbo_101.htm



http://www.3d.otisnet.net/charger_swap.htm



DM

 

[HonkinDiesel]

I found this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Chev...ewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQitemZ7991896071QQrdZ1



How do I know what will work and what won't? I'm finding it very difficult to get spec's on certain turbos. Like what do the Chev's or Ford's use? I get little tidbits from certain sites. But it's almost like turbos are shrouded in this dark mysterious smoke that no one wants to divulge the secret :{ (either that or they don't know! ).



Can almost any turbo be adapted as long as it approximately rated for the size of engine (ie. 5. 9-6. 5 L)?

Some have an interesting orientation of the intake and outlet. Can this usually be modified with adaptive plumbing?

 

[swankmetal]

how good are you with a welder? that's all it takes to "make sumthin work", right? i'm realising that i need to really start learning about wheel trim and stuff like that. that's what is going to open a couple doors. have you gotten familiar with turbo maps and all that stuff? sorry i can't be of more assistance, but i'm still learning too.



dave





on edit: seems like most people selling stuff (ebay, classifieds, and most shops even) simply have NO IDEA what makes these things work. bad place to start. a good place to start is high tech turbos website, htt.

 

[HonkinDiesel]

Things lookin up

I was in touch with DieselUSA.com and got a reply back with mixed emotions from me. I'll keep you posted as I get more info. Anyway I thought I'd share this with you all... .



ME: "While I was in the Honeywell/Garret website where they referred me to you as a possible vendor. I was looking for a turbocharger of the Variable Nozzle or Variable Vane type, that would be suitable to replace and upgrade my old 21 cm Holset on a 1993 Intercooled B5. 9 Cummins diesel engine. Right now I have lots of turbo lag at start and I really think my engine would benefit from some newer turbo technology. Is there anything you could recommend (direct bolt on or modified fittings)? If so, where could I see the spec's and prices? And finally, would you be able to sell to B. C. Canada?"



THEM:"We e-mailed Garrett and they came back with this information.

We are coming out with three Cummins upgrade kits for the 1998. 5 - 2002

Dodge vehicles. Most of the components should fit on the 1993 but I can't confirm that. We currently are not working on VNT upgrades for the Cummins engine. :{

The three stages of kits:

stage 1 will give 170+hp over stock

stage 2 will give 270+hp over stock

stage 3 will give 370+hp over stock

stage 1 and 2 should be out by the end of next month. Oo.

stage 3 should be out be the end of the year,

We do not have any prices at this time"

 

[Devan Manis]

The three stages of kits:

stage 1 will give 170+hp over stock

stage 2 will give 270+hp over stock

stage 3 will give 370+hp over stock

Are these figures ASSuming you have enough fuel to make that horse power?

 

[HonkinDiesel]

Hopefully I'm about to find out. I requested the info package to be sent to me and to keep me posted on anything new. I'll pass it on as soon as I find out anything.



In answer to your question BManis, "I would assume so!" Lets see what the kit includes.

 

[swankmetal]

peter, how are things looking on your end? i'm finally going to take you up on your offer of electrical assistance. the control module for these things is going to need at least the following:



data collection:

boost (pressure transducer?)

rpm (question is how to pull the signal directly out of the cps)

shaft speed (turbo, it has a sensor)

throttle position would be good



actuator:

now is when it gets complicated. the above signals need to go into some kind of "black box". out of this box needs to come the signals which will control the electronic, variable air regulator that the big turbo needs (it is controlled by an air actuated diaphragm, that needs 35 psi for full movement). IT ALSO needs to supply the small turbo with the proper ELECTRONIC signals (it is controlled by a linear actuator type deal). let me know if this is enough info to either get you interested or already disgusted with the project. i have a pdf from holset that i could email if interested. it might make more sense of this. hope to hear from ya soon.



dave

 

[Devan Manis]

So honkin diesel how did it turn out? you have got it haven't you?

 

[HonkinDiesel]

Hi Dave;



I'd be more than happy to sink my teeth into such a worthwhile project. I figure we could go with a programmable Integrated Circuit (called a PIC) or go full microprocessor using a 68HCXXX series, depending on what you have in mind.



I'll need all the detailed spec's and info on the extra goodies you are adding to your baby. I've got the info for the standard equipment. I'll also need a detailed description of what you want to acheive. (Ahh yes... besides more power)



If you are willing to be patient and make it a go, then lets do it!

Warning It will be a bit involved and patience will need to be a factor as my work place has gone a bit crazy. We are short staffed, waves of work and I'm kinda left holding the bag working 12/7 typically. So this might be a good winter project. It may also cost a few bucks to see it through too (parts only of coarse), but we can talk about that later. Please spend a few minutes and detail what you want to acheive, what exactly what you have for added engine goodies as well as what you want to add and then PM it me at your convenience.



Peter



PS Hi BManis; I haven't had time to get back to Garret yet but I garentee you I will. I'm just doin my home work first (when I get some time again) and when I finally find what I'm lookin for I'll be back here to let you folks know what you think.