Carli Upper Ball Joint Service How To

[JKosten]

I have been having a wondering issue with my steering than has progressively been getting worse.

My first steps to diagnoses was to check that all suspension parts are torqued and lubricated. After that I looked for unusual signs of wear or contact. When than did not reveal anything I started to research and ask around. The wondering was causing constant correction while on the highway and the steering felt tighter than it did when new. I almost replaced the P/S pump (so many have said it helped), but it is still on my parts self. The signs pointed at failed ball joints, but I have Carli Ball joints that are about 3 yrs old with maybe 40k -50k miles on them (maybe). So like I said earlier, everything on the suspension took grease and gets greased regularly.

Then looking at how the ball joints work the lower joints use a ball and cup, where as the uppers (Carli) uses a pin and housing. I have heard of them being machined very tight on tolerances and having a coating to help maintain lubricity. The upper pins could cause binding in the knuckle and create tighter steering.

I decided to pull my uppers a part to inspect the pins and replace all the grease inside them.

The results of disassemble, cleaning and reinstalation are remarkable and disturbing at the same time. The pins were worn unevenly, grease had failed, and the shafts were almost galled were the grease was displaced.

First step: lift and support one side of the front axle. Them remove the tire.

Next gather up a 7/16" wrench (ratcheting) 15/16" wrench and a 1-1/4" socket or wrench.

Then clean and remove the top cap with the 1-1/4" and clean away grease to reveal the pin. The grease should be red (not black)

Next use the 7/16 to hold the pin and the 15/16 to loosen the main nut.

Once the nut is removed lift up and wiggle the hub, the pin will pop up ward.

Now inspect and clean.

See the wear?

See page 2 (5 images per post?)

 

[JKosten]

Now clean the bore (see the wear?)

Next grease the pin

And now put it all back together and tighten. I went tight and then some. I can figure out a torque spec if needed.

Reinstall the wheel (torque) and go to the other side.

Do a test drive and check all parts for issues.

Updates:

"Did the spidle or hub get removed to do this" - No

"How long did it take" - Under an hour (most time was getting the tools, jack and stand out.

A couple things to note... (From a Carli rep)

1) The black grease. It's turned black because of the coating coming off. If you dig into the grease, you'll notice that only the top layer is discolored. This is 100% normal and expected. If all of the grease was black, I would have expected to see some very severe wear marks on your pin which your do not come close to displaying. Since these ball joints do not pass grease like most other joints (as in, you don't purge them), it is difficult to get fresh grease in an around the upper ball joint. This is why there is outer channel and inner holes to help grease pass through. When greasing your ball joints, I recommend doing a 1/4 pump, turn the wheel(s) lock to lock and top off from there.

2) The coating/wear marks. This is also 100% normal and expected. Since ball joints do not site perfectly up and down (remember your caster measurements?), it is natural to have wear on one side of the pin for the upper ball joint. This does not degrade from the performance of the ball joint. Think of the coating as more of a sealant (much like the black tar paint that Deaver uses on it's leafs) that is just an added level of protection but is something that does not hold up to abrasions. The strength of the ball joint comes from the treating and metallurgy, not the coating itself.


Torque sequence on the ball joints is:
Upper - 35 ft/lbs
Lower - 170 ft/lbs
Upper - 70 ft/lbs

This is done to make sure that both joints are seated into the tapers and also the knuckle does not get bound up on itself.

 

[RBridenbaugh]

My Carli ball joints are of similar age and have about 75k miles on them. Mine were very tight at first, noticed as bounce steering when cornering, especially with the slide in camper in the back. It took about 6 months for them to wear in and for the issue to go away. Any idea or recommendation on the frequency of doing this, as I'm always wondering how much grease really gets in to the ball joint when I lubricate them.

Did you use a drift pin to align everything prior to putting the pin back in or did moving the hub alone allow you to put the pin directly in?

Did this fix your tight steering / wandering issue?

 

[JKosten]

Last question: Yes it made a difference. The truck now tracks straight (but still follows with the crown of the road). The steering input needed is significantly less, yet more responsive.

Second question: The pin will self align is it is dropped in. You will have to put the bracket for the brake line over the pin and then tighten it with both wrenches. The next time I do this (in a year or so) I plan to replace the lock nut.

First question: I would say every year or so of hard abuse, or maybe every 25k miles of road driving. It took less than an hour and would be very easy to do if the tires are being rotated. I say that because my truck gets driven hard and I prefer to service early. It could go longer, but to me an hour and a 1/4 tube of grease is cheap.

 

[rscurtis]

Why would you have to disassemble the joint to grease it if it's equipped with a fitting?

 

[seafish]

NICE write-up…thanks!!! though I AM surprised to see the uneven wear…I strongly suggest talking with Carli and letting them know what you found to see if it is normal or not…I am sure that they would want to see the pics of the pin!!

 

[AEdelheit]

I did this on my truck as well and it made a big difference. These are great joints but the grease doesn't flow through the joint so any coating that wears off just gets stuck in the grease and the grease just stays at the bottom of the joint, it has no way of moving out of the joint or to the top away from the contact areas. I have talked with Carli about this and they confirmed the wear is normal and the coating is designed to wear off, the joints still work great and there is nothing actually wrong with them.

 

[Hardwood05]

Awesome write up, just installed these in may truck, hope to have many years of trouble free service.

 

[Mobius1]

Surprised I am just seeing this thread! I took the top cap off my carli uppers and cleaned the grease last winter. I did not however remove the pin and clean it and the bore. I have pretty much had the Carli uppers since they were introduced. Every once in a while they make a squeaking noise and I would grease them and it would go away... I may have to do this this weekend!

Great post!

 

[Mobius1]

Just doing mine now. Mine look to be in kinda rough shape.

 

[Mobius1]

Definitely a lot of pits in the bore. Also the pin has pits you can see in the pics above. Also you can see right above the taper a groove that has worn into the pin. I think I need to send these pics to Carli and see what they think...

 

[Regcabguy]

Definitely a lot of pits in the bore. Also the pin has pits you can see in the pics above. Also you can see right above the taper a groove that has worn into the pin. I think I need to send these pics to Carli and see what they think...

Definitely.

 

[Mobius1]

I emailed the pictures to carli. I will wait to hear back from them

 

[Ozymandias]

Surprised I am just seeing this thread! I took the top cap off my carli uppers and cleaned the grease last winter. I did not however remove the pin and clean it and the bore. I have pretty much had the Carli uppers since they were introduced. Every once in a while they make a squeaking noise and I would grease them and it would go away... I may have to do this this weekend!

Great post!

How old they are, year?

How many miles on them?

How frequently did you grease them, did you grease them accordingly to the instructions?

Thanks for the information.

 

[Mobius1]

How old they are, year?

How many miles on them?

How frequently did you grease them, did you grease them accordingly to the instructions?

Thanks for the information.

Not exactly sure how old they are. Whatever year they were introduced. I want to say there is about 100k on them. Most of them were with a heavy duty winch bumper and oversized wheels and tires. They were greased about every oil change so 6-8k miles. Or if they started making noise (squeaky)

The way I greased them was, I lifted the front end off the ground, got the weight of the truck off of the balljoints, put about 1-2 pumps of grease into the joint and turned the wheels side to side. Not QUITE what the instructions say how to do.

http://www.carlisuspension.com/Instructions/Dodge/Components/Instructions - CS-DBJP.pdf

 

[Ozymandias]

Yeah, but not to far away except the intervals, they say 3000M greasing.
But may it was just the first series of the joints, hope fully today parts doesn't look like yours after time.
I set high expectations into this Joints compared to the price and with a lifetime warranty behind it.

Thanks for sharing your experiences with us.

 

[Mobius1]

I have an update...I emailed those pics to carli, I was able to find my old sales receipt. I bought these balljoints in 2009. Carli is going to send me a warranty replacement of the balljoints! Here is the correspondence from Carli Rep...

Thank you, Dean. Your ball joints were first run, black coating joints. Both the metallurgy and coating in yours was different than our current, production ball joints. We're sending you a new set of upper ball joints to replace yours; you should see a significant improvement!

What are you running for lower ball joints?

They said they don't want the old ones back as the metallurgy and coating in my current ones are different than the production ones now and they asked me to destroy them....I don't really think that is possible if they lived in my truck for 6+ years and 100K miles, if that doesn't destroy them, nothing will!

All in All, well done to Carli for great customer service.

 

[seafish]

Thanks for the update….good to know that Carli continues to back their BJ's…I actually remember the "first batch fiasco" they went through….yours must have slipped through the cracks.

 

[Mobius1]

Thanks for the update….good to know that Carli continues to back their BJ's…I actually remember the "first batch fiasco" they went through….yours must have slipped through the cracks.

Actually I think the first batch fiasco were the lower balljoints. I actually had the nut break off while driving my truck. No one was hurt and nothing bad happened. However I called them and gave them pics. That is when they found out the metallurgy that was used not up to carli's standards. Sage Carli himself actually called me and sent me a new set and paid for the labor to install them!

 

[Ozymandias]

Veeeeeeery Nice, that's what I call customer service!
Glad I bought this Parts!