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Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) caTCHER ecm (Marco's aka MAD)

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Taping the wire

Marco said:
I second that! :p



Hey Mr. Darkhorse,

did you tap that wire at the end?

Inquiring mind wants to know... . :-laf



I got the tap in & working this afternoon. My box is a Blue Chip APB. I used the Blue Chip pump cover& got a fine connection the first time. Following the instructions, I used the infamous ScotchLok. It tested 0 ohms on my meter but still didn't do the job. :( I know, I was warned. Chip was helpful & talked through the troubles. I ran a second ground to a manifold bolt & Bingo every thing worked & the extra power comes on rapidly :--) I sure don't need a dyno to tell me that. :-laf
 
I have been reading this for a while, and I can't help but ask this question... is the CATCHER anything like the program that Jim Jessup, (the engineer that made the Cummins B), or like Chris Oggal's program (guy from Cummins testing facility). This may be more a question that someone from the Indiana area may know more about??? I know of a few people that have told me that you meet up with Jim Jessup, and he hooks up a laptop, and a couple of clicks, and your done. I have no experience with none of the above, just curious if it is the same, or similar programs.
 
OK, JEEZE - enough's ENOUGH!



Here's what started this LAST batch of verbal garbage:



Marco sez:



"Gary, reading ( not actually, too much stuff, I remember what you said ) what you said in this thread, you were wanting a CaTCHER but wanted to know dyno numbers first. Bob provided us those numbers. Still not enough, you want now dyno #'s for CaTCHER combined with different boxes. Then it's that your box is better, adjustabel, more Hp... . blah blah blah...



And *I* replied:



Marco, that's an outright LIE - apparently your "memory" is faulty! I have NEVER made ANY claim as to my intention as "wanting a CaTCHER but wanted to know dyno numbers first. " IF you can provide ANY post of mine where I made such a claim, DO SO NOW!



Sure, I HAVE asked - as many others have - for dyno documented info on the actual performance of your CATCHER, both on it's own, and in combination with other power mods - but NEVER gave the slightest claim or intention that such information was all I needed to put my money on the line for one - can you show where I EVER said otherwise?




And I *STILL* challenge Marco or others to either PUT UP, or SHUT UP on the above issue!



Most of my interest and comments (as well as lots of other posters in this thread) have been for documented info on the CATCHER vs a EZ or Comp - JEEZE, how INCONSIDERATE and thankless of us to DARE ask! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:



As for the glowing claims and admiration for the MAD ECM, tell ya what - ANY of you CATCHER lovers with ONLY a CATCHER installed are invited to try YOUR truck pulling a 10,000 lb. load up a 8% grade against MY stocker with only a Comp!



As an RVer THAT has consistently been the basis of my interest, comments and questions - Bob pretty well answered my questions with his dyno results - and it's pretty obvious that in *MY* application, I'm better off with what I already HAVE - now WHY does that put so many undies in a wad and generate so many snotty comments? :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
Gary , you have chosen to tap your pump wire and there are a few members that choose not too.



You are shortening the life of your pump by doing so , and that is YOUR choice.



Unhook the pump wire and I will put the CaTCHER up against your ez mode "uncomp" any day.



If you want a true towing package without "tapping" the pump.



Then just wait ;)
 
"Gary , you have chosen to tap your pump wire and there are a few members that choose not too.



You are shortening the life of your pump by doing so , and that is YOUR choice. "





There's lot's of debate as to whether tapping the wire really shortens the VP-44's life or not - since the pump essentially provides the same volume of fuel flow per revolution regardless of tapping - tapping the wire only alters whether the fuel is delivered to the injectors, or is returned to the fuel tank. Personally, I don't know.



There's also no doubt in my mind that a Comp WITHOUT tapping the pump wire will provide about the same MAXIMUM power as the CATCHER - but with considerably LESS mid-range driveability in the lower RPM's than the CATCHER...



And yeah, my bet is OFF if I don't have my pump tapped! :D :D



Thanks for a civil and mature response - I sure get tired of the other sort - you guys with the CATCHER have a great mod that you are totally happy with, and one that meets YOUR needs and expectations - I respect your choice as well as your reasoning - sure wish some would grant me and those like me the same courtesy!



Many of us were, and still are interested in what the CATCHER does - our own needs may change, and a CATCHER just might be our next, best bet - but we won't know if we don't follow this thread and ask questions - look, it took *31 pages* in this thread to get reliable documentation...



Your post infers that something new might be on the horizon from Marco that is more appropriate for RVers like me - and as disappointed as I am in his senseless attack on me, I *will* be watching for any future upgrades.



Cheers, and thanks again.
 
Gary , I invite you and any other members or non members of the tdr, dtr, dieselram etc to attend the nw bombers 6th annual get together in Enumclaw, WA this month.



Come on Gary you are now living in the "Great Pacific Nothwest" and the drive is not that long.



We will save a spot for your fifth wheel.





I am serious this will give you the opportunity to drive or test drive the CaTCHER in every sort of configuration.



Thsi is not smoke and mirrors and I invite you to attend out annual party the 26th and 27th of this month



BOMB party is Saturday and Dyno day is Sunday, we will welcome you to the Northwest.



It's your choice :)



Last year was over 80 trucks :-laf
 
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Gary, have you ever dynoed your truck stock to see what hp/tq it is? If so, what are the numbers? Have you ever dynoed your truck with the comp on 5x5? If so , what are the numbers?



Like Jetpilot said earlier, an EZ only gets about 30-35 hp. to the ground. I guess I got lucky and got 39 Hp on mine. If the comp box says it makes 120 hp, (?) , does it actually get that to the ground? Just curious.
 
"Come on Gary you are now living in the "Great Pacific Nothwest" and the drive is not that long. "



Dunno Bob - I have this nagging apprehension I might be guest of honor at a lynching party... :-laf :-laf



Weather is sorta uncertain as well - but are there details over in the local chapters section? What sort of dyno is used, and do they give both HP and torque? Decent RV facilities?



Thanks...
 
M.a.d. =

M. A. D ECM--which stands for Marco and Doug



Almost correct.



M. A. D. stands for: Marco - Andy - Doug.

And of course Marco IS MAD. :D :-laf :p



Now, PLEASE!!! can we get back to a more friendly talk?



After all, remember, PLEASE, we're trying to have some fun with the BOMB's on our trucks. FUN is the keyword here, well at least for me. Did you notice that I almost always talk about toys 'n games? Oo.



Other than that my opinion still remains:



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41wc1wv4c6f54sfc4dsw35fc4ds35

f4135ds



Marco
 
What did we learn? The dyno runs need to be started earlier. Here is the graph but the true CaTCHER magic happens earlier.



#ad
 
Something NOT right with that graph!

Ohhhh, ahhhhh, I seeeeeee!



Hey, where is the power loss you've promised me? I want my power loss back!!! What the heck, first you promise something and now THIS!



Nah, I want my money back! :-{}



Marco
 
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The goal for my truck is 400HP without a wire tap. I just received a set of Mach 4 injectors that should put me there or a bit more :)
 
Money back!

Money back!



Thinking about it.



There was an advertised power loss of 50 hp.

Your graph shows instead an power increase of the CaTCHER vs. stock ECM

of 62. 9 HP.



So, in all you give me 112. 9 hp MORE than what I have paid for.

Oh MAN and the torque! Also the torque is higher than what I wanted!



Needless to say I'm not a happy camper! I want my money back... twice! :-laf



Marco
 
Bob Wagner said:
What did we learn? The dyno runs need to be started earlier. Here is the graph but the true CaTCHER magic happens earlier.



I don't care if you offer double my $$ back. I'm not giving up my CaTCHER :-laf No doubt in my simple mind, it's the best go toy on my truck. :D



Thanks for the graph,Bob. I can see some of what puts the grin on my face what with that torque curve climbing like that around 2,000 rpm. What it doesn't show is how fast I feel the response when I push on the pedal at say 1,200 rpm. IMHO that's the best of the CaTCHER magic.
 
darkhorse said:
What it doesn't show is how fast I feel the response when I push on the pedal at say 1,200 rpm. IMHO that's the best of the CaTCHER magic.



That might not be the best thing for the Torque Converter in an auto??? Not much line pressure at low RPMs. SNOKING
 
SNOKING said:
That might not be the best thing for the Torque Converter in an auto??? Not much line pressure at low RPMs. SNOKING



I don't know much about automatics but I'd guess it isn't much of an issue. Marco could give you some insight though. He's got an auto & some, shall I say, "manly" injectors. I gather that he's not exactly feather footed either. :-laf
 
Gary, have you ever dynoed your truck stock to see what hp/tq it is? If so, what are the numbers? Have you ever dynoed your truck with the comp on 5x5? If so , what are the numbers?



Like Jetpilot said earlier, an EZ only gets about 30-35 hp. to the ground. I guess I got lucky and got 39 Hp on mine. If the comp box says it makes 120 hp, (?) , does it actually get that to the ground? Just curious.




Sure - here's my last dyno sheet from May Madness year before last:



#ad




Note there is no torque figure included, so I had to figure it myself using the formula:



Torque = (HP x 5252) divided by RPM



Thus, at just under 311 HP (310. 6, actually) and at 68 MPH, I turn 1950 rpm on my truck - sooooo,



310. 6x 5252 = 1631271. 2, then divided by 1950 = 836. 5 torque



NOW, from the dyno graph, if I *really* wanted to display a high torque number, I could use the numbers at 60 MPH, where I turn about 1800 RPM and STILL get the same 310. 6 HP as at 68 MPH:



310. 6 x 5252 = 1631271. 2, then divide by 1800 = 906 torque



I didn't make a run there with the Comp off - but earlier dyno runs with it off gave 204. 9 HP and 437 torque - lets do the math:



the Comp delivered 310. 6 hp, minus 205 HP stock, = a gain of 105. 7 HP - and a GAIN of up to *469 ft lbs torque*, depending on which point on the graph you base calculations.



In other words, the Comp alone more than DOUBLED my torque, while increasing HP by 50%!



Now, THAT'S not too shabby from an otherwise stock engine either! :-laf



But again, this is apples/oranges - the Comp and the CATCHER are designed to do different things for different folks with different needs - the Comp fits MY RVing needs perfectly, just as the CATCHER is exactly what OTHER users want - and *I* see no problem with that, AS LONG AS a CATCHER owner, OR MAKER, doesn't suggest he will get the same power from a CATCHER as *I* will from my Comp on a similarly modded truck.



Marco has never claimed otherwise as far as I am aware, so suggestions that I, or users LIKE me would be better off with a CATCHER instead of a Comp in *our* RVing type use are WRONG, even if he IS the maker of the CATCHER!



Sure, early on I had no idea WHAT the CATCHER would do, so asked LOTS of quesions and made lots of comments based on info as it was provided, nor would I have ruled out the possibility that I might buy one if it proved better than what I already had - but I NEVER made a claim that was my purpose!



And NO, I make no apologies for insisting on documented FACT over and above "seat-of-the-pants" guestimates - hell, I've talked with guys who SWORE a good wax job gave them an extra 50 HP - according to THEIR "seat-of-the-pants-meter" :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
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