Caterpillar ACERT 6.6L - Why not?

[MMiller]

*I* believe that Cat has earned a reputation in the engine market from their reliability and "power" in extreme situations. In the OTR market, if you want a long lasting, gutsy diesel, then you get a yellow one to pull your bull hauler, or your heavy equipment haulers. Granted they are harder on fuel in an OTR truck, but seem to hold up better, and have better grunt then the other two major players. This has been earned from the high horsepower, overhead cam 1693's, then the old "4-n-a-quarter" 3406's, and the early c15/c16's. You want to ride in a truck with guts, go climb in a Pete with an early 600 hp C16, hook it to a big load and head for the mountains.



Cat engines are a lot like a 5. 9 in a Dodge truck. MANY, MANY people buy a Dodge to get a REAL diesel engine for thier work truck. MANY, MANY people buy a large truck with a yellow engine under the hood for their work truck.



Michael

 

[MOates]

Two years ago when I was helping some friends move from Wyoming to Texas, between Amarillo and Forth Worth we passed two brand new Western Star rigs from the same company running together. As we went by them, on the rear truck I saw silver under the hood and knew that it had an MBE 4000 engine. On the front truck I saw yellow, and knew that it had a Cat C15 in it.



A few miles down the road we pulled into a rest area. Just as we were coming out of the bathroom, these same two trucks pulled in. I'd never had the chance to check out a Western Star as they're built on the opposite coast, so I went over to talk to the drivers and check out the trucks.



One thing that really stuck in my mind from my discussion with one of the drivers was his opinion of the two engines. His company had bought 30 of these trucks, half with MBE engines and half with Cats. He said one with a Cat engine would pull all day long, but one with an MBE engine wouldn't pull worth s###!!!:-laf

 

[JFaulkner]

We've owned them all and in 1990 we bought our first Cat powered truck (die hard Cummins before that day) 425hp 3606B and every truck since then except one used truck (to be used as a spare N14) have all been Cat. There are so many myths floating around about them it's not funny. I always hear that Cat engines are hard on fuel. The driver has WAY more to do with fuel economy than ANY engine brand ever could. Give me your highest MPG truck and I'll drag it down to nothing to prove it. I always hear that parts are more expensive. What parts are you buying on a regular enough basis that their price would dictate which brand engine you would buy? I never understood that logic.

 

[AKaiser]

Actually, the first tracked tractor was built by a British company, Hornsby in 1905, who later sold his idea to Holt, so "technically" the original patent belongs to CAT as they bought it from the designer.



First World War.com - Encyclopedia - The Holt Tractor



MAKE: Blog: The World's first fully-tracked vehicle

 

[DJW]

It's claimed the first idea of a Track Layer was devised by a Frenchman, however wether he made a success of it was not recorded. His idea was to lay a track, then push a wheel along it, and then pick up the track, by joining both ends it made the idea practical.

 

[DJW]

Regarding Spark Plugs on a diesel engine, on entering the shop one morning there was a tractor, not sure if it was farm or industrial, (two different kind of Mice or Birds) look alike though. The owner said it was a diesel, I then asked why the 6 spark plugs in line on the right side of the head, he said look at the other side, there were the tubes to the head, plus short levers to prime injectors, he said it was started on gas and then switched to diesel, I mentioned the big difference of compression ratios gas to diesel but he couldn't explain the mechanics of the engine, I did learn though that American diesels were just 17 compression ratio, as I already knew European diesels were 20 to 22 compression ratio so I was really puzzled. It was a wheeled tractor and that was in 1957. I am well aware of farm tractors with spark plugs started on gas then switching over to another fuel as I had one. In Britain the fuel used was called TVO short for Tractor Vaporizing Oil. Some British bus diesels were started on 2 cylinders then when running the rest were engaged, not sure if they were Albion or Gloster-Gardner there were a number of diesel engine makers there.

 

[TyThompson]

What really sets Cat apart with it's bulldozers is the high-track design, and their differential steer system. No one else has these. As far as large bulldozers, I would buy a cat any day. (I've worked on plenty of 'em. )

 

[MMichaels]

More over-the-road stuff...

Last year I drove a new Volvo 880 with their 625 h. p. engine, and it was more power than you could use, even grossing 80,000 lbs. Pulled the 5-mile grade (Tejon Pass, on I-5 in southern California) at an indicated 54 miles per hour, again, fully loaded (18-speed, 3. 42 rear ends).



Anybody else have experience with these Volvo motors?

 

[Dl5treez]

Caterpillar earned a reputation amongst OTR drivers, particularly O/O's, as the preferred engine to drive due to the above mentioned governor and also the engine's design-influenced power curves.

At an equivalent rated RPM the typical mechanical CAt (3406 for example) will exhibit a peak torque RPM approximately 300rpm lower than that of an equivalent Cummins (855 'Big Cam') and ~ 500rpm lower than the Detroits of the day (8V92 'Silver').

In layman's terms what happens is you hit the hill will the Detroit screamin' and immediately start downshifting to keep the engine screaming to the top. The Cummins will require a couple downshifts, and the CAT could probably make the top without downshifting at all.

Top-of-the-hill speeds will be pretty much the same for all engines--assuming the drivers were proficient to the task--however the edge would go to the CAT because the momentum-killing shifting was not required.

The CAT engine requires a different modis operande in regards to the driving of it, particularly with drivers feeling like they're lugging the engines too much and downshifting too soon, subsequently taking the engine out of it's powerband, killing efficiency and fuel economy. Thus the complaints about poor fuel mileage.....

CAT used to supply OEMs with a special audio and/or video instruction manual which explained highly detailed operating principles of how to effectively drive with a CAT--the #1 technique talked about on these tapes/videos was how to climb a grade without downshifting, and letting the power curve of the engine do the work.

The electronic engines are great across the board, but CAT's reputation is well deserved.

They do cost more to repair, but CAT is well known for extremely high standards in regards to their quality---the filters for example are the best money can buy for any application. Any farmers out there who bleed green can relate to expense trips to the dealership parts counter. :-laf

Plus, CAT engines just sound friggin' cool.

It can be a little strange for a new driver to pull a grade with 105,500 on top of your axles at 1,250RPM, but a 3406 will do it all day long, with a bad ***** growl nothing else can match.

 

[Ncostello]

As far as the yellow iron is concerned... the high track design was mainly to eliminate the "final drives" which are the weak point of a dozer. All of the weight of the machine and the load being pushed theoretically goes through a single tooth of the final drive pinion... which eventually breaks or wears out. The high track design introduced the sun gear idea whereas several innergears share the load and spin the larger one. Lasts longer I guess.



Plus the high track dozers just look cool!!



The construction company I used to work for had many pieces of old yellow cat iron. 631 scrapers and plenty of D8's from the 60's. They'd all been rebuilt a dozen times and just keep making money for them. So they keep them around since they are well paid off. That and the fact that new D8's and 631's cost a million dollars each.



I've operated 844 Rubber Tire Dozers, 637 Twin Engine Scrapers and D10's. The power you feel from such machines is amazing. All through simple joysticks nowadays. Its like playing a videogame except with major power.



Off topic I know.

 

[TyThompson]

KW with 3406 pulling a 325D with 6. 6L Acert.

(Grossing around 125,000 lbs. )

 

[bmoeller]

*I* believe that Cat has earned a reputation in the engine market from their reliability and "power" in extreme situations. In the OTR market, if you want a long lasting, gutsy diesel, then you get a yellow one to pull your bull hauler, or your heavy equipment haulers. Granted they are harder on fuel in an OTR truck, but seem to hold up better, and have better grunt then the other two major players. This has been earned from the high horsepower, overhead cam 1693's, then the old "4-n-a-quarter" 3406's, and the early c15/c16's. You want to ride in a truck with guts, go climb in a Pete with an early 600 hp C16, hook it to a big load and head for the mountains.

Cat engines are a lot like a 5. 9 in a Dodge truck. MANY, MANY people buy a Dodge to get a REAL diesel engine for thier work truck. MANY, MANY people buy a large truck with a yellow engine under the hood for their work truck.

Michael

I pretty much agree.

Don't know about the new ones, but the 500hp '02 ISX (non-EGR) engine we have in a T800 pulls hard. The W900L I'm driving now has a '02 525hp C15. Pulls a little better. The T8 has 3. 70 gears and I have 3. 55 in the new one, so that does make some difference. Evens them up a bit. The ISX 500 is capable of hanging a 550 C15 pretty well. Just depends on the hill. In the mountains, I don't get passed very often in either truck. Walk or run past most of them.

Get better mileage with the Cat. Can't hardly ever break 5. 3 with the ISX on the long haul stuff. Usually 4. 9-5. 3. Get 5. 4-6mpg with the Cat.

 

[bmoeller]

Caterpillar earned a reputation amongst OTR drivers, particularly O/O's, as the preferred engine to drive due to the above mentioned governor and also the engine's design-influenced power curves.

At an equivalent rated RPM the typical mechanical CAt (3406 for example) will exhibit a peak torque RPM approximately 300rpm lower than that of an equivalent Cummins (855 'Big Cam') and ~ 500rpm lower than the Detroits of the day (8V92 'Silver').

In layman's terms what happens is you hit the hill will the Detroit screamin' and immediately start downshifting to keep the engine screaming to the top. The Cummins will require a couple downshifts, and the CAT could probably make the top without downshifting at all.

Top-of-the-hill speeds will be pretty much the same for all engines--assuming the drivers were proficient to the task--however the edge would go to the CAT because the momentum-killing shifting was not required.

The CAT engine requires a different modis operande in regards to the driving of it, particularly with drivers feeling like they're lugging the engines too much and downshifting too soon, subsequently taking the engine out of it's powerband, killing efficiency and fuel economy. Thus the complaints about poor fuel mileage.....

CAT used to supply OEMs with a special audio and/or video instruction manual which explained highly detailed operating principles of how to effectively drive with a CAT--the #1 technique talked about on these tapes/videos was how to climb a grade without downshifting, and letting the power curve of the engine do the work.

The electronic engines are great across the board, but CAT's reputation is well deserved.

They do cost more to repair, but CAT is well known for extremely high standards in regards to their quality---the filters for example are the best money can buy for any application. Any farmers out there who bleed green can relate to expense trips to the dealership parts counter. :-laf

Plus, CAT engines just sound friggin' cool.

It can be a little strange for a new driver to pull a grade with 105,500 on top of your axles at 1,250RPM, but a 3406 will do it all day long, with a bad ***** growl nothing else can match.

I have fun with the ISX and C15 on grades. Mess with the other drivers a bit. LOL I can pull most grades in O/D for a longer ways (or all the way to the top) than a lot of others. When I start slowing down enough to warrant a drop to direct, the others are starting to get up to me where they might want to change lanes. Go to direct, and I leave them behind again. Oo. :-laf

The Cats sound a LOT better than the ISX engines. The ISX is too quiet. Only sounds like a real diesel when it is started below 40*. Gets a little rattle then. Otherwise, it is mostly gear whine from the DOHC cam drive gears. Not to bad straight piped, though, but still not as good as a Cat or BC or N14 Cummins.

 

[Dl5treez]

The ISX is a great platform..... a lot of driver say it offers the best of what is Cummins and best of what is Caterpillar in the same package..... now if it only had Series 60 fuel economy it could be the perfect engine. :-laf