Caterpillar calls it quits

[JUeckert]

So Ford doesn't have input on the engine except for programming? I find that very hard to believe.

what's so hard to believe about that? navistar is a engine builder just as is cummins. cummins engines replaced ford, detroit and cat built engines in the two ton ford's for a few years, the older designed engines's couldnt pass emissions, the newer designed cummins line could. ford didnt have nothing to do with the design of the cummins engines did they? no! the 6. 9,6. 0 and 7. 3 engine's were navistar design, used in there own trucks primary, and fords secondary. gm is the only diesel powered pickup with a hand in the building of it's own powerplant, both past and present. .

 

[Yo Hoot]

I think Ford gets involved in the background during the engines preliminary design and I also think before and during the design Ford has a lot of input.

And If I'm wrong, it's a sad thing for Navistar because if the 6. 0 is all Navistar design than something is terribly wrong with that company.

Might as well kiss Caterpillar goodby in the on-road market since Navistar will provide the engines.

 

[AllianceDiesel]

6. 0 navistar engine is actually a good engine what I have been told, when you put the programming into it though thats where they are getting all their problems, 6. oh no was a joke, and 6. 4 is gonna be a joke.

 

[JUeckert]

there are three different common issues that plauge the 6. 0. turbo failure, egr failure , and head gasket issues. egr failure is fords baby for the most part, turbo and gasket failure is navistars baby. the head has a 10 bolt design, and is a weak point. major egr failure can lead to a head gasket failure, partly cause of the weak head bolt design. i have seen gasket failures in both international trucks, and even more fords, usually they have programmes added, or have had egr issues. the 6. 0 engine itself is a very stout design, but as mentioned had gasket issues. latter 6. 0 engines were much improved. as for the 6. 4, i have seen very few with issues, in fact i have seen more 6. 7 cummins issues then, 6. 4's .

 

[Wayne M.]

Mack is still out there and they have just come out with a new 16L for the heavy haul market...

All recent "Mack" engines- the MP series are in fact Volvo engines. Mack does very little on it's own anymore. Even their parts come in Volvo packaging.



Regarding the Cat/ Navistar thing, I think everyone needs to look beyond the light stuff, and look at the OTR stuff. I believe Navistar inked a deal with MAN a while back, which is their new "MAXX FORCE" engine. I think cat will market a version under their name.



It's sad to hear Detroit got out of the fire business



Big changes coming and it won't be good. I'm glad in a way that Cat isn't giving in to the gov't.

 

[AKaiser]

Wayne, which "Maxx Force" engine are you refering to? The big bores? I know the medium bores are based off the DT466, so it's not those engines. The DT is the engine that MADE International Engines a major player.

 

[Wayne M.]

Wayne, which "Maxx Force" engine are you refering to? The big bores? I know the medium bores are based off the DT466, so it's not those engines. The DT is the engine that MADE International Engines a major player.

I thought the Maxx Force was only one engine. I was wondering what was happening to the DT's during this tough time. I know all about the DT's- even when Detroit marketed them as the series 40 engine. The engine I was referring to was the big bore "all new" engine that navistar was bringing in from MAN. I read about it in "diesel progress" which I don't get anymore. I got a lot of good info from that trade magazine... .



AKaiser, is your location listed accurate as of right now?

 

[CurtLee]

So wait now its only Cummins and Detroit for OTR trucks?

Nope, there's volvo, mack, navistar/international just introduce a new motor, mercedes, detroit is still there. There alot more than two left. But cummins is still one of the most widely used motor out there. Oo.

 

[AKaiser]

AKaiser, is your location listed accurate as of right now?

Yep... ... ... ... ...

 

[Wayne M.]

Yep... ... ... ... ...

Whatever your mission is for being there, thanks!



Also... I was on the NYS Thruway the other day and I saw a International medium truck- possibly a "Load star"- looked like the typical medium International, just freshened up a bit, it had MAXXforce badges on it.

 

[Wayne M.]

UPDATE--

I was looking at what appeared to be a brand new International school bus, and there next to the door was a MAXX FORCE DT name plate. I guess that's how the DT's fit into this new name game.....

 

[Wingate]

I think that between the new emissions standards, low profit margin, and questionable warranty claims from OEM's, it makes sense to drop the OTR engine line.

There isn't alot of profit in making a C-9 for an OTR truck when compared to making a C-9 for a D6. Remember, Cat doesn't make the truck, so all they are selling is the engine.

Cat is a world leader in equipment, but some don't understand that Cat is THE world leader in off-highway stationary diesel and natural gas engines. Not relatively inexpensive small displacement engines, but large displacement 16 cylinder engines. I would think that these product lines have a larger profit margin.

I haven't heard exactly what the specifics are on the Navistar deal is. I know that Cat has been testing an 8 speed Automatic transmission for on ON-Highway application..... Wonder if it will end up behind a Navistar engine?