CDL requirements?

[TX Gooseneck]

I'm trying to figure out what the law really is, as I get a different story from the DOT everytime.



To need a CDL for weight, do you have to be over 26,000lbs or does your vehicle just need to have a GVWR that exceeds this? I was on my way back from california and was running private with my truck, trailer, and a bucket truck and my total weight was 25,550. The gentleman from the Texas DPS gave me a ticket for not having a CDL because my gross combined of the truck and trailer was 36,499.



Which is a completely different story than what we've heard.

 

[gwagner]

the way i found out the requierments. i went don to my local dmv office and picked up a cdl study book. it might also say on the back of your license the wt. limits your allowed to have.

 

[Froadin]

I was just wondering this exact question the other day.

There are people on here that are running like you do, and should KNOW the answer. So I will wait and watch to see what they say.

 

[RustyJC]

You might want to do some research HERE.



Rusty

 

[RustyJC]

Here's something interesting from the Texas DPS website:

The licensing provisions in Part 383 are intended to help reduce accidents by setting standards that:



Require commercial drivers to be properly qualified and to hold a single valid driver's license (CDL);and



Disqualify drivers who do not operate Commercial Motor Vehicles (CMV) safely.



Classes of Commercial Driver's License



Class A CDL - Any combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 26,001 pounds or more, provided the gross weight rating (GVWR) of the vehicle or vehicles being towed exceeds 10,000 pounds.



Class B CDL - Any single vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) in excess of 26,001 pounds, and/or towing a vehicle that does not exceed 10,000 pounds. Any vehicle designed to transport 24 passengers or more, including the driver.



Class C CDL - Any single vehicle or combination of vehicles that is not a Class A or Class B if the vehicle is designed to transport 16 - 23 passengers, including the driver or used in the transportation of hazardous materials that require placards under 49 CFR, Part 172



Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) means the value specified by the manufacture as the loaded weight of the single vehicle.



Gross Combination Weight Rating (GCWR) means the value specified by the manufacturer as the loaded weight of combination (articulated) vehicle. If there is no manufacturer's specified value, GCWR is determined by adding the GVWR of the power unit and the total weight of the towed unit or units and any load.



Persons Exempted from Texas CDL requirements:



Farmer, Rancher or his employee operating a vehicle that would be classified as a commercial motor vehicle, and is owned and operated by a farmer or his employee, used to transport agricultural products, farm machinery or farm supplies, not used in the operation of a contract or common carrier, used within 150 air miles of the person's farm or ranch.



Persons operating firefighting or emergency vehicles necessary for the preservation of life and property.



Military personnel operating military vehicles.



Persons operating recreational vehicles for personal use.



A person operating a vehicle owned, leased or controlled by an air carrier and that is operated exclusively at the premises of an airport.



A vehicle used exclusively to transport seed cotton modules or cotton burrs.

Notice the exemption for RVs? Now I feel better!! :-laf



Rusty

 

[Eric_77]

Okay this is fairlt hard to follow but I will try my best.



CDL is requred for a vehicle in commercial use ( ie operated to transport goods services for a profit, in the furthance of commerce) that weighs or is registered above 26,000 pounds IE add up your truc GVWR and trailer(s) GVWR or when weighed on scale is over26,000( if registration is less then you will get an overweight ticket as well) you also must have a DOT number (US or state if intrastate) fuel tax permit and log, medical, drug test, federal motor carrier authority if you are hauling for hire (ie you are a shipping company) and a insurane form on file with state.



Second issue is if you are over 10,000 pounds traveling interstate you must carry log books and have USDOT number if you are commercial, this number is raised to 26,001 for texas drivers if they do not travel interstate 10 days prior or ten days after date ( this is way confusing part)





Here is a contact for N. Texas area Randy Jones Texas Dept of Publc Safety Commercial Vehicle Enforcement (214)861-2223

 

[HBarlow]

TX Gooseneck:



From the info you provided, the actual combined weight of your truck, trailer, and cargo (if weighed on a scale) was 25,550# but, and this is the key, the gvwr from the data plate in your truck's door frame and the gvwr of your trailer from its data plate added up to a total in excess of 26,001# (36,499#).



The total of the gvwr data plates is what the DPS License and Weight Trooper uses for enforcement and that is why you got the ticket. I had a recent discussion with the DPS Captain at the Lubbock Regional DPS office on this subject. I guess their thinking is based on what your truck and trailer COULD weigh, not what it actually weighs.



Although you were apparently not hauling for hire, your equipment was considered used "in furtherance of commerce" therefore you should have had a CDL class A and should have been in compliance with other requirements such as physical exam, drug test, fire extinguisher, DOT vehicle inspection, logs, etc.



Harvey

 

[patcarman]

i will try to help... . i have a class a with hazmat and which alows me to drive a combined vehicle weight of 80000 plus,now you can have a rv or large vehicle with rv plates and not have a commercial licens and also i know some farmers that have a tractor trailer and haul corn in the state of indiana and have farm plates and dont have cdls,as far as truck and trailers if you have aplate that is on your truck or pickup or should i say the vehicle with the motor that is the plate u go by,not the gvr. if your plate saye 26000 then you can not exceed it without permits. i have been driving now for ten years and to the best of my knowledge i am right,now if you are conciderd for hire or commercial then you must have a logbook and go by the guidlines,if you have any questions go to the licensebranch and they have the commercial books for free and you can brush up,,,,,just remember if you get stopped and you are not in compliance then do what us truck drivers have been doing for years play stupid it will get you far... ... it has for me... ha ha

 

[TX Gooseneck]

I had my medical, fire ex. , triangles, etc. He did the full run down. My point of contention with the officer is that I was private.



I think it's insane to ticket you on a 'could be' basis. That would be like buying a gun and having to go to jail because you could use it violently.



Looks like I'll be getting my CDL next week.

 

[QRTRHRS]

First off TX Gooseneck, I think you should contact your lawyer over this since the penalties can be severe and may affect future CDL issues for you. I happen to have an article from the Nov 04' magazine Horsetrader which highlighted an incident in Texas but the gross was not an issue per sey. If you want, I can email you the Houston law firm involved.



After this, why not bite the bullet and at least look into taking a CDL course and what it will cost to get your DOT number and all? It should be all deductable as a business expense.



Texas law may exceed DOT which states: http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/fmcsr/regs/383.5.htm



"Commercial motor vehicle (CMV) means a motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the motor vehicle --



(a) Has a gross combination weight rating of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more) inclusive of a towed unit(s) with a gross vehicle weight rating of more than 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds); or



(b) Has a gross vehicle weight rating of 11,794 or more kilograms (26,001 pounds or more); or



(c) Is designed to transport 16 or more passengers, including the driver; or



(d) Is of any size and is used in the transportation of hazardous materials as defined in this section. "



But under http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rulesregs/fmcsr/regs/390.3.htm#f



"(3) The occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furtherance of a commercial enterprise;"



Beyond that, some more food for thought. I don't know if this is DOT or not but in PA drivers of commercial vehicles over 10k in interstate or 17k intrastate must also possess a medical certificate. Are you running a radar detector? If you got ticketed for no CDL then you could have gotten hit on that if applicable.



patcarman



Generally, farmers can go up to 150 miles from their farm in furtherence of their operation. The occasion load of gravel for their neighbor in not applicable.

 

[TKingsbury]

You dont necessarily need a commercial license, but depending on your combination you could need an A or B. There are non-commercial versions of both. If you are doing anything for hire or as part of a business, you need commercial. For a class B it says a single vehicle with a GVW of 26k or more needs a B, but your combination might require it even if your single vehicle is less than 26k GVW. This is why the International CTX or whatever it's called is rated at 25,999 GVW. You don't need a B to drive it (think soccer-mom, be SCARED). Now if you hook something to it the story may change. This is what I understand and could find in my handbook. I have a Class A with everything, but I don't use my license, I'm just required to have it for work. Take what I say with a pinch of salt since I don't deal with the DOT everyday. Bottom line is, if a cop thinks something isn't right he will find something to ticket. Did he let you continue on your way without changing anything?

Travis. .

 

[TX Gooseneck]

Travis,



He black flagged me. I had my dad with me (CDL) and he had to take over. He thanked me for being courteous and working with him. I had the one ticket and FIFTEEN warnings. Said it could have shot $2000 in fines had I been a jerk about it.

 

[TKingsbury]

That sure was handy having your dad there, eh? If you've got a bunch of warnings and now a ticket, it sounds like you need to suck it up and get your CDL. You probably wont be so lucky next time, especially if you encounter the same cop. Good luck with whatever you do.

Travis. .

 

[knewman]

need to get in touch with someone in austin preferably the same person every time about our trucks the laws are very open for many different interpataions. one thing that happen to me back 3 years ago when we were pulling for hire was one of my guys was shut down 15 miles from the house while running empty for no CDL because we were tagged for 36000 lbs left hot supper on the table to go get him.

 

[EB]

I see it in weight stations all the time. Someone will be parked and in the process of unhooking their trailer. The DOT officer will tell me that they were not licensed to pull that combination, (class A) If the plates on the door and on the trailer or the registered combined weight is over 26,001 lbs and they aren't running farm plates on both truck and trailer, they are going to have to park it and get a pretty high dollar ticket. Your best bet is to go ahead and get a class A license, you can get it without air brakes and no hazmat if you don't need it and there really isn't anything to it. Be sure when you go to take your driving test that you have someone with a class A drive you down there. If not you will get another ticket and will have to call someone to come pick you up and drive your truck and trailer home.

 

[TX Gooseneck]

EB,



I've got a lighter gooseneck trailer I can take with me when I go. I'll be calling tomorrow to see if I even need a trailer. I've heard some scuttlebutt that our local DMV will still allow you to test if you don't have a trailer (Perhaps having to do with the number of trailers that are delivered out of this area and not owned by the driver) so we shall see.

 

[OTRPU]

Not pertinant to original question, but I stopped at St George POE for RV 5er permits, truck & trailer, a couple days ago, DOT had two 5ers dropped in slots in the parking lot. Evidently a couple of 3/4 ton pu haulers were over their rated rear axle weight. Some haulers are running 3/4 t's cause they don't have to log back MT. Course it can come back and bite you I guess. DOT's I've talked to don't like people not logging back and also don't like magnetic signs. I just wish people would run compliant cause when they don't DOT starts looking at all pickups. Then they stop me alot just to check me out, takes my hours, but whatcha gonna do. When loaded I'm legal to the teeth. And MOST the time when MT.



Cheers,

Steve J

 

[TRLRTRSH]

Cdl

The below is from Washington State: Crazy but in Washington you can be 95 years old, and drive a 50,000# class A motorhome, but you need an endorsement to drive a motorcycle





CDL Exemptions



The law exempts three groups of drivers from the CDL:



Farmers transporting farm equipment, supplies, or products to or from a farm in a farm vehicle are exempted provided the farmer or a farm employee operates the vehicle. Products include Christmas trees or wood products transported by vehicles 40,000 pounds GVWR or less.

Fire-fighters/Law Enforcement Personnel operating emergency equipment are exempted provided they have completed the Emergency Vehicle Accident Prevention Program (EVAP) and they carry a card certifying completion.

Recreational Vehicle Operators are exempted when driving RV's for non-commercial purposes. This includes two axle rental trucks, and horse trailers for non-commercial purposes.