Changing oil types?

[K_Arts]

Ok guys. . this has probably been beat to death already, but I can't seem to find anything on it.



At 7200 miles I dropped the conventional oil and put in Amsoil 5w30hdd. I now have 19,600 miles and I have this sinking feeling that I put Synthetic oil in wayyy too soon. Is there anyway that I can tell if my rings sealed properly. Also, If I happen to drop the Synthetic oil and put in Premium Blue 15w40 would my engine be able to break in any more... . or did putting in the Synthetic prevent my engine from breaking in any more??



Thanks



Kev

 

[EMDDIESEL]

Personally, i would not worry about it. Just stick with the Synthetic now that you started. One of the ways you can tell if your rings are properly seated is how much oil your truck uses between oil changes. You switched at 7,200? thats not great, but its not early enough that i would worry about anything. Just continue on and dont think about it.

 

[DocStressor]

You don't have to worry about a thing. You can use synthetic oil from day one despite what some very conservative engine manufacturers say. It just takes longer for the engine to break in than with conventional oils. The parts still wear. Synthetics are not THAT much better lubricants than conventional oils.

 

[PHaller]

broken in?

In my experience the only way to break in that motor is to hook up somthing heavy... REAL heavy, and pull it 1000 miles. Only then is that motor broken in; and a 4000 lb. load of bricks in the bed won't do it.

Borrow a friends 15,000 lb. 5er or a gooseneck with 8 horses.

-Paul R. Haller-

 

[Dieselnerd]

Good point Paul. Mine was still using some oil towing my 7800# trailer after 20,000 miles. About a quart every 2000 miles. I got a new heavier trailer. 13,900#. After a few thousand miles towing the bigger trailer guess what? Uses virtually no oil between changes. You just have to work those engines hard, like you said.

 

[RAMalama]

transmission's TOO!

Even the six speed didn't settle down until I started towing my 14k Fiver. 1000 miles with that in tow and the engine and transmission had different personalities! This new DTH/DEE truck is interesting. Unloaded it seems more lathargic than my 12v. Loaded heavy, it comes alive as if saying "finally" and pulls harder than the 12v. It didn't show this though until recently. But it's true, the harder I work it, the better our trucks get!



My . 02. -Ian.

 

[Fuzz]

Pulling heavy..

Hey Kev,If you had that hitch you could pull my trailer up to Laramie tomorrow. . from DelCaminoRV. . It weighs close to 13000. . LOL

 

[Deezal Man]

K_Arts,



Its my belief that this is one of the most misunderstood topics known to exist in the internal combustion engine world.



I don't want to get into the dino vs. Syth debate. We've all been there, done that... So I will remain very general, To the facts... . NOT the brands.



Having said that, lets clear up a few "myths" about this topic.



A synthetic product... be it motor oil, insulin, skin, etc... is nothing more than an engineered replica of something existing in nature.



No magic, no mystery or hoax... ... Don't believe it? Ask someone with a hip or knee replacement if synthetics are a hoax. .



In relation to your engine oil... each and every synthetic and conventional oil on the shelf of your local auto store has an initial lubrication potential. Meaning its ability to lubricate is at its highest when poured from the bottle.



No amount of by-pass filtration will increase an oil's ability to protect your engine... ... ... . It can only prolong that initial level..... by removing contaminates that would otherwise decrease its ability over time.



Since synthetics are chemically engineered rather than refined from some natural substance... The end results are FAR more consistant and stable. Sorta like baking a cake. The right ingredients produce the desired product. Or, when was the last time you saw a naural emerald appear as brilliant as its synthetic counterpart??



In otherwords, refining can only extract what was there to begin with.



So what does all this mean in your case?



Quite simply, it just means your engine "MAY" take slightly longer to break-in, than it would if run on conventional oil. Than again... . it may not.



If you are asking for my OPINION in your situation. I believe it will take longer to break-in... . But I don't see a reason to switch to a conventional product... to speed up this process.

 

[jlhartak]

Leave the Synthetic in, I changed my 99 to Amsoil at 1,000mi. The Cummins burned about a quart in the first 5,000mi. and uses less and less as it wears in, less that a quart in the last change period which covered over 10,000mi.

 

[weber1048]

I would leave it in. Some vehicle's come with Synthetics from the factory. As my VW Jetta Turbo Diesel did and I have not seen any level decrease between 5k oil changes.



Doug

 

[Jetpilot]

I would leave it in and not worry about it. I have used synthetics since 1000 miles with no problems (ie oil consumption). This is my second Dodge Turbo Diesel that I have done this with and the first one was fine as well.

 

[Skibby]

change oil

I waited till I had 10,000mi. befored I switched to synthetic oil(Amsoil),I pull a15,000# fifth wheel an haven't used a quart between oil changes,I run 8,000mi. between oil changes.

p. s. And synthetic oils DO make adifference!

 

[TwoSlick]

Deezel Man,



I thought your quote: "A synthetic oil is just a replica of something that exists in nature" was quite interesting. In fact, the definition of "synthetic" is the formation of a new compound or material that does not exist in nature. Perhaps you can show me where polyol-esters and diesters exist in nature, exactly?



It is true that PAO's(polyalphaolefin oligomers) are chemically similiar to crude oil, but they are much more uniform at the molecular level. PAO's are also completely "saturated", whereas even the best Group III, hydroisomerized petroleum oils are only 90%+ saturated ... . What this means is that there are no open sites on the PAO hydrocarbon chains where oxygen can attach itself. As a result "true" synthetics are much more resistant to oxidation than any petroleum oil could ever be ... .



TwoSlick

 

[Puff]

Originally posted by TwoSlick

As a result "true" synthetics are much more resistant to oxidation than any petroleum oil could ever be ... .

LE has data showing their 8800 15w-40 more resistant to oxidation than Amsoil HDD.

 

[TwoSlick]

Puff01,



Actually my friend Kevin Dinwiddle (of LE) and I argue about these things all the time. He is basing that statement on the results of the oxygen uptake test that LE uses, where you put a sample of the oil in a rotary pressure bomb, heat it and oxidize it in an accelerated fashion. I don't doubt that LE performs very well in this test and may even outperform some synthetics. However, if you compare the results of oil analysis in the field (the only testing that really counts for anything), you will find that any good synthetic like Delvac 1, Amsoil, Redline, etc will tend to show less oxidation.



It is possible to heavily fortify the "additive package" of a petroleum oil with oxidation inhibitors and get performance that approaches PAO/Ester synthetics, but once these additives are depleted the petroleum basestock is more easily degraded than the full synthetics.



It would be interesting to see oil analysis data taken under the same conditions, comparing the performance of LE with the better synthetics. If Kevin has such information, I've never seen it posted anywhere ... .



I'm sure the additive package that LE uses is excellent, but it makes more sense to me to combine it with a synthetic basestock that has inherently better physical/chemical properties. If the stuff was $2. 00-$3. 00/qt I could see it, but the LE 8800 is about the same price as the Delvac 1 and Amsoil 15w-40 full synthetics ... .



TwoSlick

 

[Puff]

TwoSlick,



That makes sense.



I’m sure you’ve seen these data, but for those who haven’t here are the Falex Wear Teeth and Oxidation numbers for a few oils that LE publishes. LE refers to the oxidation test as the TFOUT ASTM D4742. (For those not familiar with these tests—which includes me--higher numbers indicate better resistance to oxidation, and lower numbers for the Falex Wear Teeth test indicate better protection against wear. )



The first number is the Falex Wear test #; the second number is the oxidation #:



Amsoil HDD* – 2, 229

LE 8800 (CH- 4) – 3, 311

Royal Purple Long Rider* (CH-4) – 6, 701

Delo 400 (CH-4) – 7, 289

Valvoline P-Blue 2000* (CH-4) – 11, 142

Mobil Delvac 1 5w-40* (CH-4) – 12, 829

Mobil Delvac 1 5w-40* (CG-4) – 17, 905

Shell Rotella-T (CH-4) – 18, 275

Valvoline P-Blue (CH-4) – 19, 133



* - Synthetic oil



What’s interesting to me is that good old Delo 400 isn’t too bad, and the fact that it smells good is an added bonus. I think I’ll stick with the LE 8800 for now—at least until my supply runs out.

 

[Mundgyver]

When I bought my truck on 3 July 00, I put 1,500 miles on it within 4 days. I switched over Amsoil 15W-40 Diesel and have had no problems. Truck now has 36,000 on it with no problems what so ever. I would not worry about it.

 

[TwoSlick]

Puff01,



Do you have any oil analysis results you can post?

This is the best way to see how the oil is performing in the field ... .



TooSlick

 

[Puff]

TwoSlick,



Unfortunately, I don’t. I’m just about to submit my first sample for analysis.

 

[TomGolden]

my $.02

Well, just for the heck of it, here are my truck's experiences.



I have run Delo 400 15W-40 since the very first oil change at 2500 miles. I have been sending in samples to Blackstone labs since the second oil change at 6100 miles. The folks at Blackstone Labs have claimed they believe my rings are fully seated, etc. , and my engine is totally broken in by around 13,000 miles, and have recommended I could easily go to 6,000 oil change intervals on the Delo if I wanted to. I currently have 20,300 miles on the truck, and am planning on going to Amsoil when I run oit of my stock piled Delo 400, which will be at around 26,000 miles.



From day one, my engine has never used a single drop of oil, period! I make a habit to check all my fluid levels every weekend right before I wash & wax my truck. Even at my regular 4000 mile oil change interval, the oil is still at least a little transparent, though of course much darker than when it was shiny new.



Except for the 2000 miles of towing a Toyota 4x4 from Southern California to Wyoming to hunt Elk last winter, I have never towed anything with the truck.



Just my personal experiences with my truck.



Tom