Competition Clutch,Traction Bars and other pulling mods???

[RyanB]

Hey all- I have been working putting a 1996 215hp 12/valve mated to a 6-speed into my 1989 GMC. The truck was actually a 2wd but I converted it over to 4wd by using a 1998 Dodge Dana 60front. Anyway, I have a few questions I am wondering if anyone can answer or help me out with. I am into pulling big time up here in Ontario and they just started an actual diesel class up here called 8000lbs Pro Street Diesel.



Here are my questions:



1-Which clutch will work best for my 6-speed and for pulling and street use. I have heard that the EEP is the best but not for fast shifting on the road. How are the other 2 dual disk's? I can live with hard clutch pedal effort seeing I do all highway driving. Right now I have $2500US set aside for a clutch. Which will suite me best.



2- Seeing I am still in the fabrication fase I think it would be best to fab up my traction bars right now. Does anyone have a design that works and is proven and don't mind giving me some idea's???



3- My last question is a little complicated. My original truck was a reg-cab dually. The interior was they old style and just looked like crap. Shopping around for a 1996-up interior I landed up finding and buying a crew-cab cab and frame. It was hit hard in the front so the wrecker I got it from cut the frame just behind the motor mounts. Here is the deal... . I can use my front frame section and weld it up to the crew-cab rear and run the crew-cab.

What would be best for pulling, the long wheel base or the 133" reg-cab wheel base? weight wise I figure will be around 7500Lbs with the crew-cab



As far as HP goes for the 12-valve I am looking at around 450-500 but in the rules for my class I have to run a single charger so that is keeping the power down from where I would want it:-(



Thanks in advance... . Ryan

 

[Got Smoke?]

:--) Wow I want to see plenty of pictures of this conversion along the way sounds AWSOME!



I'm not quite sure if you correct on your estimated weight though. If you go with a crew cab long wheelbase dually then I believe you will be over your estimated 7500lbs though. You may



Now as far the clutch goes I have no big devotion to any of the big 3 pulling clutch manufacturers (EEP, SBC, or Haisley Machine). With that being said if I was building a "Full on Pulling Truck" I would use a EEP Dual Disk. If you do though make sure you swap out the current slave cylinder on your 6spd for one made for 97 5spd. It will cut the increased pedal effort by more than 1/2. I've seen it!



As far as the HP level goes. Getting HIGH HP out of a 12V is easy! A Governor Spring Kit, a Torque plate, and a set of injectors. High Tech Turbo (www.htturbo.com) has a new turbo out that will meet the truck pulling rules for CTD's, and there has been plenty of discussion on it in the past week too so check it out! Looks to support 450-500HP range?



As for traction bars, the most reasonably priced traction bars that stand up to sled pulling IMPO would have to be Rob Thomas's. Here again I have no devotion to Rob, nor do I own his product. However, I have seen them up close and he makes quality stuff!

 

[FDavid]

SOunds like an awesome project you have there.



1) SBC, haisley and EEP all make awesome dual disks clutches but my personal nod is for EEP. I have seen those things in action and they are virtually indestructible.



2) member "Rob Thomas" is the one to see about traction bars. I think he has pics in his readers rigs gallery. BTW Rob, any word on the 3rd gen traction bars we talked about a while back?



3) The theory i have heard is that a longer wheelbase is better for pulling because of the weight transfer



Dave

 

[RyanB]

How much does a Dodge-Quad cab, cummins,6-speed 4x4 loaded weigh? The last time I heard a GMC crew-cab with a 6. 5L/Auto weighed in at just over 7200lbs.



As for the clutch. I know the EEP is pretty well the best for pulling, which is the best or nicest for street use? Explain to me please about the 1997 5-speed slave cylinder? does it bolt up the same way as the 6-speeds and why is clutch pedal effort less?



Thanks... Ryan

 

[Got Smoke?]

How much does a Dodge-Quad cab, cummins,6-speed 4x4 loaded weigh? The last time I heard a GMC crew-cab with a 6. 5L/Auto weighed in at just over 7200lbs.



As for the clutch. I know the EEP is pretty well the best for pulling, which is the best or nicest for street use? Explain to me please about the 1997 5-speed slave cylinder? does it bolt up the same way as the 6-speeds and why is clutch pedal effort less?



Thanks... Ryan

Well my old Regular Cab Long bed Dodge 2500 4x4 5spd weighed in @ 6700 & change with a full tank a fuel, me, & toolbox with little junk in it.



Factor in a extra set of fullsize doors, and a dually axle and you will be pushing it to meet 7500lbs. The 5. 9CTD is HEAVY my front axle has 42XXlbs on it alone!



As far as the slave cylinder swap, should just be a bolt up deal. I *think* that all dual disk's drive the same on the road, they just take a extra second or so to shift. I have a friends with EEP's (pure pulling truck that see's some road driving), and a friend with SBC's Dual Disk that is a driven everyday both seem to handle the same on the road.



I believe the statement that your gonna get from everybody on here is if your gonna pull a lot with this truck EEP is the way to go.

 

[RyanB]

Okay, another question about the clutches. From EEP's site they say the dual disk is $1700 and Haisley's Street-Puller $1941. Can you tell me if both include the same thing things and does anyone have an aprox price on a street-dual disk puller from SBC before I call them up on it?



Thanks again... Ryan

 

[Got Smoke?]

Okay, another question about the clutches. From EEP's site they say the dual disk is $1700 and Haisley's Street-Puller $1941. Can you tell me if both include the same thing things and does anyone have an aprox price on a street-dual disk puller from SBC before I call them up on it?



Thanks again... Ryan

Well Haisley Machines clutch went up $100 :-laf



All 3 clutches include everything you need: Flywheel, disk's, center plate, pressure plate, and throw out bearing. Now depending on what model 6spd you have you just might need the bigger input shaft (1-3/8"). I think '99-'00 were the years for the small shaft 6spd, do you know which year yours is?



Used to I think SBC's Street Puller was like $1700, but now Peter can set up the clutch several different ways (check out this page for details http://www.southbendclutch.com/dd.html ) and I'm not sure if that cost's more or not. You can get them with 6 or 10 button disc's, and Peter can adjust the plate load on the pressure plate.

 

[RyanB]

My 6-speed is out of a 2002. I was there before they built it to make sure I had the 1 3/8 imput shaft. There was no way I was going to go with the wimpy 1 1/4"!!!!

Is there anything else you think I should know or should have for the truck. Just so you know... . I also went with a 2003 AAM dually rear out of a GMC. I was going to go with a Dodge but the posi in the GM axe is alot better than the dodge one. Gear ratio wise I went with 3:73's just to give me a happy median between good fuel millage and get up and go!!!



Ryan

 

[Got Smoke?]

My 6-speed is out of a 2002. I was there before they built it to make sure I had the 1 3/8 imput shaft. There was no way I was going to go with the wimpy 1 1/4"!!!!

Is there anything else you think I should know or should have for the truck. Just so you know... . I also went with a 2003 AAM dually rear out of a GMC. I was going to go with a Dodge but the posi in the GM axe is alot better than the dodge one. Gear ratio wise I went with 3:73's just to give me a happy median between good fuel millage and get up and go!!!



Ryan

Well the traction bars we recommended won't work because even after reading about it I forgot this is a Cummins conversion. You will have to fabricate your own. Nah, sounds like you've got everything on track right now. I can't wait to see the finished results.

 

[RyanB]

Thats why I posted. I know I have to fabricate my own but I am just wondering what works (traction bar wise) for everyone else. I am also at the same time going to do the drive shaft loops.

 

[JDailey]

EEP's clutch is good, but I definatly wouldn't say it's the best. I am partial to Haisley's clutches, I've had several and they are superior to anything else I've seen(aside from a Crower). Plus they all come with an SFI steel flywheel. I definatly wouldn't buy a SB to pull with. Look at what the top trucks are running. Talk to people who have them. Then make you're decision. Asking a question like that on here can be tough, because alot of people who are giving you advice are just keyboard peckers. Never seen one of these clutches(turbos,etc,etc..... whatever) let alone pulled or driven one. Just don't let someone who doesn't know make a decision for you that you will regret.

 

[willyslover]

suggest you look at Scott Vorhees truck in readers rigs aka BigBadDoge

he has some of the best fab work on this board for pulling !!

and he is around 750 +/- HP



also look at CSuttons rig. . great looking hoops on his [and tested also ] Chris has done a bunch to his. . has Hyd. ram steering



both are high HP daily drivers, one a builders work rig [Chris']



good info posted on the other stuff !

 

[Got Smoke?]

Asking a question like that on here can be tough, because alot of people who are giving you advice are just keyboard peckers. Never seen one of these clutches(turbos,etc,etc..... whatever) let alone pulled or driven one. Just don't let someone who doesn't know make a decision for you that you will regret.

I never claimed to own one, and my sig doesn't say I have on either. However, I attend as many pulls as possible and I see what wins, that's what I've based my facts on in this thread. Now if I had the $$$ I'd own one in a heartbeat, but everything comes in due time.

 

[RyanB]

Well, no mater if you have the products or not all the advice/idea's you all have the better!!!!! One other thing you "got smoke" might find of intrest is that I also took a set of folding Dodge Towing Mirrors and put them on my GM doors. There was about 4 hours worth of fabricating per side but in the end they turned out awsome and you would never know they didn't come on the truck! Can't wait to have the truck on the road with the mirrors folded out over looking the duals... should look sharp.



Ryan

 

[Got Smoke?]

Well, no mater if you have the products or not all the advice/idea's you all have the better!!!!! One other thing you "got smoke" might find of intrest is that I also took a set of folding Dodge Towing Mirrors and put them on my GM doors. There was about 4 hours worth of fabricating per side but in the end they turned out awsome and you would never know they didn't come on the truck! Can't wait to have the truck on the road with the mirrors folded out over looking the duals... should look sharp.



Ryan

Pictures man we want pictures! :-laf

 

[RyanB]

Well, I have spent so much money on this truck so far I can't afford a scanner!!!!!!! I have tons of pics already and I will try to buy a scanner asap!!!!

 

[cjohnson]

As for clutches,



I can't comment on Haisleys as I haven't run one. I have the EEP and my truck is a driver. I also tow a heavy trailer with it. The clutch works great for everything as long as you don't mind the heavy pedal. As for the slave, in order for the early one to work on my 00, I had to pull the metal "piston" or rod out of my original and put it in place of the one on the new slave. As it comes, it doesn't line up with the pedal on the later Dodges. Once you get it on there, it works good, much better than the original. Engagement is exceptional for such a strong clutch, better than most high perf. single discs. The extra money for the Haisly is due to the SFI steel flywheel I think. EEP will sell you one for theirs too and it costs more. Its nice to save the money if you don't need it. Probably only need it if you are running big rpm's, 4000+.

I have heard bood things about the Haisly and I know the EEP is good, probably won't go wrong with either. Some people are starting to have some luck with the SBC from what I hear. But their have been some growing pains with his pulling DD.



Craig

 

[RyanB]

Okay, seeing I don't have a slave at all for the transmission right now which one should I get and does anyone have any part#'s for them? I am hopeing that I can hook up my GM hydrolics to that slave.



Cjohnson- one question about your EEP. I have heard for pulling it is great, street driving= heavy clutch pedal, and is towing really that good with your double? and one other thing is how is fast shifting? think you could or want to drag race with it shifting wise? I know this truck will weigh in at close to 8000lbs but it would still be fun to take down the track every now or then.



Thanks... Ryan

 

[Redram 1]

Call peter he can build what you want and he stands behind his product,I run his pulling clutch,no complaints here.

 

[RyanB]

Okay, I will probably land up calling Peter also. But can you tell me why you run his clutch and why it is or might be better than the others??? I am looking for some hard evidence that one is better than the other one or at lease views on why you like it. I find that manufactures are biased when it comes to buying stuff... but then who would say... . "the other guys is better... but you should buy mine!!!"



Ryan