Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) Cold Startup issues..

[Boosted6]

I know I might not get a reply to this seeing how my other thread on how to make more black smoke went way south but here goes.



My truck is a 98 12v automatic. 167k mile son it. When i let the truck sit over night and go to crank it in the morning it is a 50/50 chance that it will. Here is the complete setup to this issue.



Truck is plugged in all night and temps here are in the upper 20's low 30's at night. The fuel soleniod valve plunger will not pull in, I have to leave the key on and get out and push it in manually. After I do this it cranks right up. After the truck is ran just a little and the motor warms up and or everything under the hood wrams up it cranks everytime.



Trucks has a #6 plate, star wheel loose, 5" exhaust. I am taking it over to the cummins shop on Wednesday and if the soleniod is bad I was just going to have them replace it. I don't want to have to have them go over the truck troubleshooting this issue if it is a simple thing to fix.





Any and all help is appreciated. .

 

[blacksheepdiesel]

Boosted6,



Check the relay that energizes the solenoid, I think it is on the firewall directly behind/beneath the hood seal. Also check the positive cable on the drivers side battery that provides power for the solenoid.



Godspeed,

Trent

 

[JWaters]

why would you want it to crank in the mornings? I dont start my truck until the afternoon's. This is better for the earth and the air as it causes less smoke on start up. One day we will never be able to start our trucks because of people like you starting them early in the morning and smoking up the air. You can always wait until after lunch to start it that way it will not smoke as much!!!





Just Joking... ... ... ... ... LOL

 

[Boosted6]

It was the relay, but thanks for all the help offered on this site..... NOT...





Thanks Trent for the info. .

 

[JWaters]

you tripping dude! lol

 

[MMcCallie]

Manual Fuel Control

A really cheap option is to ditch the fuel shutoff solenoid and relay by installing a manual cable. I used a heavy duty PTO cable on mine. Have it set up so that the truck will start without touching the cable.



To kill the engine you pull the cable out and hold it a couple seconds until it shuts down. You can also pull out the cable, twist the handle and lock it so it won't start. Sort of an antitheft device. Far cheaper than having to replace electronics that will likely fail at some point. I like it.

 

[bighammer]

A really cheap option is to ditch the fuel shutoff solenoid and relay by installing a manual cable. I used a heavy duty PTO cable on mine. Have it set up so that the truck will start without touching the cable.

To kill the engine you pull the cable out and hold it a couple seconds until it shuts down. You can also pull out the cable, twist the handle and lock it so it won't start. Sort of an antitheft device. Far cheaper than having to replace electronics that will likely fail at some point. I like it.

I did the same, but used a very inexpensive choke cable. I don't the solenoid at all. I don't leave it running often, but when I do, I can remove the key and lock the wheel.

 

[cojhl2]

A really cheap option is to ditch the fuel shutoff solenoid and relay by installing a manual cable. I used a heavy duty PTO cable on mine. Have it set up so that the truck will start without touching the cable.



To kill the engine you pull the cable out and hold it a couple seconds until it shuts down. You can also pull out the cable, twist the handle and lock it so it won't start. Sort of an antitheft device. Far cheaper than having to replace electronics that will likely fail at some point. I like it.

I did the same, but used a very inexpensive choke cable. I don't the solenoid at all. I don't leave it running often, but when I do, I can remove the key and lock the wheel.



I like these ideas. However go look at the thread talking about Parking brakes where it was mentioned tht in the old big trucks when the engine was stopped with a pull cable, if you let the cable back to run position the engine would start when you least expect it!!!



Still a good idea tho,, I like it. .

 

[Joe G.]

That's the way the fish boat I had worked. It didn't take long to remember to keep the cable pulled until the all the noise in the engine room quit.

 

[MMcCallie]

My cable has a twist to lock in the engine kill position when the cable is pulled out. There is no solenoid on my engine. It is impossible for the engine to start when the cable is pulled out and locked. If released and returned into the run position, it will not start without the key making the starter spin the flexplate.



I too can remove the key and lock the wheel with the engine running, but the alternator will not be charging the batteries at this point because it shuts down the electronics. Key can be reinserted at any time and driven without having to crank again.



I would have to have severe aural impairments not to hear when the Cummins engine is running or not. There is also vibration felt upon shut down. Almost impossible to make a mistake, to not know when my engine is running or off.

 

[cojhl2]

My cable has a twist to lock in the engine kill position when the cable is pulled out. There is no solenoid on my engine. It is impossible for the engine to start when the cable is pulled out and locked. If released and returned into the run position, it will not start without the key making the starter spin the flexplate.



I too can remove the key and lock the wheel with the engine running, but the alternator will not be charging the batteries at this point because it shuts down the electronics. Key can be reinserted at any time and driven without having to crank again.



I would have to have severe aural impairments not to hear when the Cummins engine is running or not. There is also vibration felt upon shut down. Almost impossible to make a mistake, to not know when my engine is running or off.

You missed the point MMcCallie, which was that a simple rotation of the engine could restart it. Don't need the starter motor!



It's no big deal,, one just has to be aware of the issue. .

 

[MMcCallie]

Engine Starting With No Starter

cojhl2,



Interesting. How might the engine turn itself over? This would be cool to know. I'm guessing the truck would have to have a manual transmission, be left in gear, and be rolling with the cable left in the run position.



Are you also saying that it is possible for the engine to start even though the cable is locked in the off position? With an automatic, i'm wondering if it would be possible for the engine to start without the starter if the key isn't on. Perhaps with the key on and a switch to lockup the torque converter once the truck starts rolling, the engine could turn itself over and start if the cable is left in the run position. I may have to try it to find out.



Please let us all know,

Thanks,

Matt

 

[cojhl2]

cojhl2,



Interesting. How might the engine turn itself over? This would be cool to know. I'm guessing the truck would have to have a manual transmission, be left in gear, and be rolling with the cable left in the run position.



Are you also saying that it is possible for the engine to start even though the cable is locked in the off position? With an automatic, i'm wondering if it would be possible for the engine to start without the starter if the key isn't on. Perhaps with the key on and a switch to lockup the torque converter once the truck starts rolling, the engine could turn itself over and start if the cable is left in the run position. I may have to try it to find out.



Please let us all know,

Thanks,

Matt

No, No,,, Matt There is no weird reason for the engine to start itself.



With an automatic you have 0 chance of the engine to start with a push while left in gear. The only other reason it may start is if you are turning the engine with a barring tool,, of somehow turning it some other way.



"The least expect it" comment was not supposed to eman more than that.



The comment came because on another thread somewhere one of the posters mentioned that on the older big trucks we stopped the engine with a button to shut down the fuel (at least on a Detroit anyway, I can't remember how we shut down the 262's). So, as today when parking a big truck the trans is left in neutral and the Parking brake is set.



On these Dodges most people leave the manual trans in gear, and someone suggested instead of an elec solenoid to shut the fuel off they did as you and made a manual shutoff, which I really like.



One of the responses then went on to say "remember, if you don't lock it in the off position there is a chance for the engine to start if it rotates somehow".



That is all I was referring to.



My cable has a twist to lock in the engine kill position when the cable is pulled out. There is no solenoid on my engine. It is impossible for the engine to start when the cable is pulled out and locked



This would tell me you have no issue regardless. . I was expounding when I should have been quiet and not casued the confusion



John



John