coming Friday - 3-flows, SPS66, Juice dyno & drive pressures

[JStieger]

RESULTS!! - 3-flows, SPS66, Juice dyno & drive pressures

Well, I just drove 210 miles through a few deer crossings to Twin Falls, ID and got tons of boost versus drive pressure readings. Pretty neat stuff... :-laf



Another 120 miles to go and 1-hr of dyno time at Meridian Motorsports here I come... this is what I'll do:



1) 3-flows injectors with Juice off

2) Level 1 x low boost 3

3) Level 1 x low boost 5

4) Level 2 x low boost 3

5) Level 2 x low boost 5

6) etc.



Last time I dynoed with DD3 + Juice + HTB2/62/14 I did a very smoky 473 HP/919 TQ with the start of my fuel systems problems from hell. I also did all low boost 3 runs first followed by low boost 5 so it was hard to see what contribution the low boost levels had due to the outside temperature changing quite a bit in that hour or so.



I will also post uncorrected dyno sheets as well as power/torque versus time to show how the turbo spools. I'll also see if Don at Meridian Motorsports still has my old HTB2/62/14 dynos saved on the computer and replot those versus time as a comparison.



Anything else you guys want to see?



So far on the drive here with tons of level 5 blasts my fuel system is still leak free... knock on wood...



Stay tuned to TDR late Friday or early Saturday PST...

 

[JStieger]

turbo, injector data...

The post will compare using the same dyno and actual (uncorrected) figures:



1) DD3 injectors and Industrial Injection 3-flow injectors

2) SPS 66 turbo versus HTB2/62 mm compressor/14 cm2 exhaust housing

3) SPS 66 turbo boost versus drive pressures with turbo wastegated at 40 psi.



Baseline with stock injectors and box off = 272 HP/531 TQ

DD3 injectors and box off = 375 HP/701 TQ

3-flow injectors and box off = 369 HP/697 TQ



Observations:



1) 3-flow injectors are basically 100 HP

2) Assuming HTB2/62/14 turbo is the same as PS62, we see that the 62 mm compressor yields about 20 HP over low rpm range until peak-to-peak. We also see that the same SPS66 HP comes in about 60 rpm later than the 62 mm compressor.

3) Boost versus drive pressure is 1:1. My SPS66 is wastegated at 40 psi so I couldn't get valid numbers past 40 psi boost. If one mats the throttle, the boost definetely gets ahead of the drive pressure in the 15-35 psi boost range, which I guess is the so called "quick spool" feature.

 

[SRadke]

Good reading Julius. Always good to see unbised info and reports on products direct from the user.



Can you make any comments on the EGT diffrence between the HTB2 62 and the SPS 66. Also, did you do the injector swap at the same time as the turbo swap? Thanks



-Scott

 

[JStieger]

dyno results...

PDR cam + SPS 66 turbo + 3-flow injectors + Edge Juice:



A x B = Juice Level "A" x Juice Low Boost Level "B"

All numbers actual, uncorrected rear wheel:



1x1: 381 HP/748 TQ

1x5: 391 HP/753 TQ

2x1: 400 HP/800 TQ

2x5: 394 HP/807 TQ

3x1: 428 HP/863 TQ

3x5: 430 HP/850 TQ

4x1: 469 HP/901 TQ

4x4: 467 HP/899 TQ

5x1: 494 HP/928 TQ

5x5: 503 HP/943 TQ



Observations:



1) the low "low boost" settings made the power come in earlier than the high "low boost settings, but maybe slightly less overall power

2) on the 5x5 run, rail pressure maxed at 26,700 psi around 2100 rpm and settled at 15,000 psi. Maybe with more air via a higher wastegate setpoint (45 psi ???), I might have squeezed a few more HP...



I also suggest to not make quick judgement about the rail pressure observation. Remember that I have bigger injectors so the ECM is probably calling for the pressure since less relative pressure is there for any given condition relative to stock injectors such that the CP3 has to work just that much harder to get the pressure the ECM wants. With smaller (stock) injectors the pressure is already there already, maybe at a lower relative value between stock and modified injectors with the Juice on. I observed that this high pressure is also definetely not sustained through the whole rpm range and it is a one time thing at a relatively low rpm.

 

[JStieger]

power versus time graphs...

Forgot to add that max boost was 40 psi and max EGT was 1300* on 5x5 runs. Max engine temp was 197* according to Attitude monitor. Previous dynos in summer with DD3 and HTB2/62/14 reached a max engine temp of 210* - probably a combination of summer and high EGT I would guess...



Anyhow, here are some power/torque versus time graphs with my HTB2 runs from the summer that Don saved comparing to the SPS 66 runs. If I was more energetic I would graph them out and pick 2 points and calculate the time from X HP to Y HP for each turbo as a measure of spoolup time.

 

[JStieger]

Can you make any comments on the EGT diffrence between the HTB2 62 and the SPS 66. Also, did you do the injector swap at the same time as the turbo swap? Thanks



-Scott

I had the DD3 and HTB2/62/14 done at the same time this past summer.



Then my DD3 injectors got all carboned up so I replaced them with the 3-flows and the SPS66 at the same time.



As far as EGT difference, the runs today went a lot quicker than the previous DD3/HTB2 runs this past summer due to the engine water temps being a lot cooler. When I dynoed with the HTB2 I actually had to take a break for about an hour because the engine temp got really hot and took forever to cool down - even with turning the AC on while idling to pull the heat away!



The graphs definitely show that while everybody says "spools almost like stock", the SPS 66 power still comes in later than the 62, which supports why the 62 is better for towing. I am spoiled with the cam though so I don't know if the rpm spread would be even more for the guys without a cam ??? (But the HTb2 dynos were done when I had the cam too).



Also, I removed the adjustable wastegate elbow a couple of weeks ago and replaced with a stock elbow because I didn't like how the boost would just blow past the wastegate setting. So I might put that adjustable elbow back in or screw around with the wastegate rod length a bit...

 

[RWood]

injectors

How do you like the injectors for towing?

 

[JStieger]

How do you like the injectors for towing?

Good, smooth power that mirrors the factory torque and horsepower curves! I normally tow with the TST on 1x0 (for advanced injection timing only) and a bit ~20-30% of MP8 pressure. This coupled with a 62 turbo I run now yields a lot less low boost smoke, which clears up pretty quick as compared to when I ran the 66 turbo. I only tow up to 7,000-8,000 lbs car trailer and the smoke while towing is really only visible in town taking off from lights with a little right foot action so it can be controlled, but not 100%. However, I think most hardcore towers would advise going to a slightly smaller injector - say 40/50/60 HP range - for better EGT and smoke control. Otherwise, I have no EGT problems yet as well as maintaining or accelerating past 75 mph or so on long 6% interstate grades (with the aforementioned box settings - any more than that is overkill for towing IMO!).



SRadke runs smaller 40ish HP injectors w/ TST and tows a heck of a lot more weight than I so maybe he'll offer some of his views too.

 

[SRadke]

My 40 hp injectors are cake for towing. I also have the SO truck though, it only dynos 250hp with the injectors alone.



I usually tow with my TST on Hp 3 (twins program). That get's me a smoke free 350-375 hp with no egt worries and its plenty adequate to destroy a transmission without a little caution :-laf



-Scott

 

[OT-OF-HERE!!]

3 flow injectors on 04.5??

Is anyone running 3 flow injectors on an 04. 5. What hp levels are offered? Anyone running these with twins? How much are they? Tks