Concealed Carry, Armed and Polite Society

[JPope]

Here in Minnesota, we have the usual debate (how it won't work, doesn't help, makes the streets more dangerous, etc. ) about the concealed carry law, that is due to be in affect shortly. Here is proof that it can/does work (though in another state, especially for those that refuse to surrender when wronged and no physical harm):



> An elderly Florida lady did her shopping, and upon

> returning to her car,

> found four males in the act of leaving with her

> vehicle. She dropped her

> shopping bags and drew her handgun, proceeding to

> scream at the top of her

> voice, "I have a gun, and I know how to use it! Get

> out of the car!"

>

>

>

> The four men didn't wait for a second invitation.

> They got out and ran

> like mad. The lady, somewhat shaken, then loaded her

> shopping bags into

> the back of the car and got into the driver's seat.

> She was so shaken that

> she could not get her key into the ignition. She

> tried and tried, and then

> it dawned on her why. A few minutes later she found

> her own car parked

> four or five spaces farther down. She loaded her

> bags into her car and

> then drove to the police station.

>

>

>

> The sergeant to whom she told the story nearly tore

> himself in two with

> laughter. He pointed to the other end of the

> counter, where four pale men

> were reporting a car jacking by a mad, elderly woman

> described as white,

> less than five feet tall, glasses, curly white hair,

> and carrying a large

> handgun. No charges were filed.

>

> Brings new meaning to a senior moment!

 

[Shovelhead]

Funny :-laf... . but scarey

There are people out there with CCW permits that would do something like that.

Watch your "6".



BTW Check out http://www.snopes.com/crime/justice/grannies.htm

 

[JPope]

Armed and Polite!!!

Thanks about snopes, though I had already run it through, hence the smilie. You should be here in MN. for the debate (if you want to call the horror stories about what "WILL" happen, even though there are stated cases where it has been legal in other states a debate) about concealed carry, even after it passed. It will be the OK corral, every day, every where!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The latest news report is that the woman legislator who sponsored the bill , was determined to have robbed two (2) convience stores as a teenager, though no weapons were involved, and I guess she confirmed!

Now everyone is jockeying for where CCW weapons can be excluded, where they can't, again those against are not changing nor those for are not changing, and the news types enjoying their tirades, and the ratings that go with the debate. No one mentions where the CCW weapons might have been beneficial to someone without a shot fired? Wonder how many times that happens, and no reports, no bodies, so again armed society is a polite society.

 

[Shovelhead]

A good website/forum for others of the CCW persuasion is www.packing.org



Lots of info.



Ed

 

[Champane Flight]

Why conceal?

Why conceal? If an armed society is a polite society, why not show it? The truth is, you can carry a gun all your life and you still may not find a reason to use it in self defense. Myself, I like the idea of putting it on your hip where all can see.

 

[Shovelhead]

CF, most states have "open-carry" laws on the books now.

Theoretically, you can legally “strap on” your “Hogleg” and waltz down Main Street.

Back in the real world………. you’ll be stopped by just about every LEO within 50 miles, and don’t wear your good clothes while attempting this as you’ll probably be spread-eagle on the sidewalk several times.



The American public “sheeple” have been conditioned by the government & media into thinking “Guns-Bad”, so the sight of a firearm sends them into panic.

This is how the Powers That Be got the “Assault Weapons Ban” passed.



Quote

The truth is, you can carry a gun all your life and you still may not find a reason to use it .....



I also carry an insurance policy on my vehicles.

Why?

I don't plan to be involved in a MV collision... ..... it's JICSH.





Just In Case "Stuff" Happens





Ed

 

[Boomer II]

Every state that passes concealed carry gets the same "blood in the streets" BS from the left, it doesn't happen.

 

[Champane Flight]

Don't

I had to strap on my old 44 one time about ten years ago. I was called to act with a posse on an escaped prisoner nearby. We had to stop a few times in the local towns for grocerys and always got the evil eye from city folks. Even got a store cleck so nervous he called the cops. This society automatically assumes the worse. I think it all started when they started taking the guns from the cowboys as they came into town.

 

[Crash_AF]

Actually, I believe Colorado is still an open carry state. When I was stationed there, I went to the range up on Rampart Range Road quite often and wore my 1911 on my hip in Colorado Springs and never had anyone look twice at me. Heck, I even went into the Walgreens to buy ammo and the clerk didn't even bat an eye.



Funny anecdote, I walked into a convenience store just outside Manitou to get some sodas for myself and the guys I went shooting with while carrying one afternoon. Inside were four punk kids with another three or four outside leaning on their 'thumper skates'. About 1 minute after I walked in, all four of them walked out and they congregated around the furthest 'skate until I left.



So yea, I'm a firm believer in an armed society is a polite society.



Later,

Joe H

 

[Rman]

Re: Why conceal?

Originally posted by Champane Flight

Why conceal? If an armed society is a polite society, why not show it? The truth is, you can carry a gun all your life and you still may not find a reason to use it in self defense. Myself, I like the idea of putting it on your hip where all can see.

CF the idea behind concealment is too "blend in". The perp (bad guy and i'd probably mispell the big word version) doesn't know who is armed, and automatically assumes no one is... normally. If you were to arm yourself and show it, then in some cases you would be MORE of a target. The perp says, hey if i take him out first everyone else is helpless.



Obviously the scenario can be reversed, if the perp saw your gun he'd tuck tail and run somewhere else to ransack. That would be an ideal situation, but somewhat unlikely. Society never lends itself to easy decisions on matters like this. Public perception is always going to be in favor.



I can carry freely in Utah, and like having the right too, but to be honest i still rarely do. The responsibilty is really large, and if you were to ever "make a mistake" such as one like the old lady in the story did... they'd hang you for it. The liberals hang on every instance just waiting to pounce on you for making a mistake. yet the crooks can go kill someone and get out of jail in 5 yrs.

 

[BFC]

Re: Why conceal?

Originally posted by Champane Flight

Why conceal? If an armed society is a polite society, why not show it?

'cause all the bleeding hearts liberals will make you life hell, even if it's legal! It gets old being stopped by every LEO in the county because somebody called about "an armed felon walking the streets" I rather keep the police working on actual crimes and keep the bad guys guessing.

 

[RustyJC]

And somebody would probably try to interpret it as "brandishing a weapon" (whatever that is).



Rusty

 

[daveshoe]

Ohio has a ''constructive excuse'' law that allows concealed carry only if a undefined good reason permits it. My dad sold his farm and needed to move the proceeds four blocks from lawyers office to the bank. We are talking life savings here . I gave a call to the Greenville Ohio police dept. and asked for an escort. No can do -- Liability issue or some such crap. I then informed them that a constructive excuse existed and that I would handle security. The dispatcher started crapping backwards-- '' well sir, you cannot have weapon in close proximity to a motor vehicle'' and stuff to that effect.

I asked her if she had ever seen ''Catch 22''

I then told her that , yes , my parents were elderly , but they were capable of walking the four blocks to the bank.

I also offered to repaint the city police cruisers since the ''serve and protect'' certainly did not apply in Greenville ,Ohio

I finally asked her that since we were trying to comply with the law if the city would prefer open carry -- would she prefer a holstered handgun or possibly a pump shotgun?

Story gets too long from this point, but the point was made. BTW Ohio's ''constructive excuse law was ruled unconstitionally vague by two judges and is now before the state supreme court.

 

[Boomer II]

Re: Re: Why conceal?

Originally posted by rhickman

CF

I can carry freely in Utah, and like having the right too, but to be honest i still rarely do. The responsibilty is really large, and if you were to ever "make a mistake" such as one like the old lady in the story did... they'd hang you for it. The liberals hang on every instance just waiting to pounce on you for making a mistake. yet the crooks can go kill someone and get out of jail in 5 yrs.

Can you imagine sitting in a Luby's restaurant eating with your family when some nut drives through the wall and starts shooting the people you love? How would you feel knowing you could have stopped it? Ask Susan Gratia Hupp, it happened to her. I'll take my chances with the court system, it is an awsome responsibility not to be taken lightly, but if I'm against the wall I intend to prevail. Like the saying goes, I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

 

[Champane Flight]

Make believe

I guess both sides of this issue are living in a make believe world. The anti-gun crowd wants to believe that no guns are the answer, this is make believe because of avilability of guns to criminal element. The pro gun crowd wants to believe that everyone should be carrying, this is all well and good, but the truth is not everyone who owns a gun is a responsible owner. It is also a scary thought having Joe Blow, who has never fired a weapon in combat, or had any training, in a firefight with the bad guys with inocents and children in between.



Some of you guys are gun enthusiasts, and I was to at one point in my life. I have many weapons in my home. They get fired once a year, sighted in, cleaned and oiled, and put back in the safe. When I was young, I lived for guns, hunting, and markmanship, after living with a weapon for two years and being hunted, it all changed. But you have to admit the selling, bartering, and ability to get weapons by any "idiot" is out of hand. All the gun laws in the world will not change this. We could ban all guns and still have the same problems, you would have to ban stupidity. Maybe open carry is the answer, or maybe concealed carry is the answer. It is not the weapon that does the killing, but the holder. Maybe furnish everyone a weapon then go hide for awhile, when the smoke clears we might have a better world and a lot of digging to do. It would be nice to have a world without any guns, but that is make believe.

 

[Jumbo Jet]

"Concealed Carry" by it's name implies that the criminal, the Pope, and the police DO NOT know whether or not you are carrying. Therefore, people with sufficient amounts of Common Sense will have a little respect for everyone they meet on the streets. Ask yourself, is he/she carrying a weapon?



Concealed Carry has made a difference in many states.



R E S P E C T We need more of it!

 

[JPope]

Concealed Carry,MN. Version Continued

It is getting more interesting here in MN. A local church just filed suit against the state, because the law (not even in affect yet!!) does not allow them to keep guns out of their PARKING LOT. They can post their building(s), but not the parking lot, so they claim it does not allow for freedom of religion!!! Find it curious that religion requires 'closed' parking lots, couldn't be that it is just another excuse by those against?? The rhetoric gets more "interesting" each day.

I understood that most concealed carry laws prohibit 'flashing' or 'displaying' the weapon (maybe that is brandishing??), even though in many states it is legal to carry exposed. In one of Massod Ayoob's books he even warns against 'printing' of the firearm through clothing, as a potential problem, though I thought it was more of a warning, so that someone would not become identified before they desired??

 

[RustyJC]

Re: Concealed Carry,MN. Version Continued

Originally posted by JPope

It is getting more interesting here in MN. A local church just filed suit against the state, because the law (not even in affect yet!!) does not allow them to keep guns out of their PARKING LOT. They can post their building(s), but not the parking lot, so they claim it does not allow for freedom of religion!!! Find it curious that religion requires 'closed' parking lots, couldn't be that it is just another excuse by those against?

This is getting into a touchy area here because "right to carry" rights are bumping into "private property" rights. If Joe Blow doesn't want anyone bringing firearms onto his property, should he as a private property owner not have the right to make that restriction? My employer doesn't allow firearms, alcoholic beverages, drugs, etc. on company property, in company vehicles, etc. Does that violate my "right to carry" - yes, I suppose so, but I work on his turf, not mine.



Rusty

 

[JSmith]

Concealed carry

I like the ability to carry if one chooses.





I would rather have a gun and not need it, than

Need a gun and not have it.



Waiting on 911 can get you killed.

 

[Jumbo Jet]

One of Arkansas' CC restriction was carrying in public parks. Muggings and assaults INCREASED in public parks. Arkansas finally repealed that restriction.



I really don't see how the State can legally regulate what takes place at church anyhow. Church is kind of public, but inside the doors and also being comprised of 'registered' members abiding by a set of self initiated by-laws would/should set them apart.



I think if a church wanted me to carry a gun, the state couldn't prohibit that. The restriction probably hasn't been tested in each state court system.



Church could be a dangerous place. A nice hollowed out Bible to conceal my Beretta 9mm would work just fine.



Maybe I should start a David Koresh type Church of the Divine Automatic Weapon!!