Considering an RV purchase

[jgillott]

Don't wait for retirement to go RVing! You are not guaranteed a tomorrow let alone good health. After watching my folks's health go downhill to the point they were not able to go RVing like they planned in their retirement we decided to not put things like this off. So we use weekends and vacation time NOW to go RVing.

There are no words that could be spoken that are more true than what you just posted above. As many of you know, my wife and I have been caring for my mother for 8 years come this April. My parents had great plans for retirement. My dad retired in August of 2009 and my mother had the first of a series of massive strokes in April of 2010. She has been totally dependent on us for care, feeding, changing, cleaning, etc. ever since. It has been years since she has been able to speak or communicate in any way and frankly it breaks my heart to see her like this.

Learn from their mistakes. Live now, whether you are 20 or 90, there is no guarantee of tomorrow.

Sorry guys for taking this off topic. I apologize.

 

[Killgore]

You're not off topic at all and I applaud your love and devotion to your family! All of us at some time or another are faced with issues that restrict our 'freedom' to come and go as we wish, either mandated by our family members or our own infirmities. That's why it is important to be able to take advantage of opportunities as they present themselves at any age. Having a camper affords an opportunity to go on the spur of the moment, or to plan and fantasize in detail about unknown destinations.

 

[KenHwy61]

You're not off topic at all and I applaud your love and devotion to your family! All of us at some time or another are faced with issues that restrict our 'freedom' to come and go as we wish, either mandated by our family members or our own infirmities. That's why it is important to be able to take advantage of opportunities as they present themselves at any age. Having a camper affords an opportunity to go on the spur of the moment, or to plan and fantasize in detail about unknown destinations.

Very well said!

 

[jgillott]

You're not off topic at all and I applaud your love and devotion to your family!

Thanks for understanding. And I just want to emphasize that it isn't about me, it's about serving our neighbor as they tell us over and over again in church to do. I can think of no better way to teach my children to live and love others than to take care of the one who once took care of me.

 

[Mark31]

Looks like jgilliot has one ear stopped up so the preacher's words can't go in one ear and out the other!

 

[Killgore]

'Walking the Walk', is the most difficult part of being a Believer; and yes, His light shines bright to all who know His story and sacrifice.

 

[Bob4x4]

To me ease of towing and durability was far more important than having tons of space and storage once parked.I chose a 25ft airstream back in 03 and it has proven it fit into my needs pretty well.I added 200 watts of solar power a nice control system for it and upgraded the supplied convertor.This poor trailer has survived way too many miles of dirt roads and very few parking lot style trips.Boondocking has always been my choice even though the trailer has smaller capacity than some others,adapt and improvise.

 

[Plemagie]

Since you are in central WA and most likely familiar with Alpenlite (made in Union Gap/Yakima), we have a '04, 29' Riviera, single slide with generator and yes it's a fifth wheel. We are selling because of illness. It's been stored inside and would be a great, reasonably priced starter RV. We're just west of Olympia. It's tows easily behind our '12 3500 SRW as well as our '97 2500 w/Banks. Just a thought and good luck with your pending retirement and your journey.
Bubble head 628
'12 3500 SRW Laramie Crew LB stock
'97 2500 w/partial Banks
'14 Kubota L38
'81 Isuzu Pup, flatbed
2000 Perkins 135 NA Marine (boat)

 

[Fordracer350]

Lots of good info above. I'll give how we got to what we have.
We towed a 17' hybrid trailer with a 1500 Ram SB. Lot of space for sleeping but taught us to want more walk-through and storage space. Light, single axle trailer. We got a 23' hybrid with a slide-out, which gave us great space inside but taught us the hybrid wasn't the best for Fall/Spring camping. Twin axle trailer towed much better, even though about 800 lb heavier. We started looking at various designs and sizes of hard walled trailers to decide on what we liked. Do a LOT of that. We went to look at a specific trailer we thought might work and while we were there looked at a 5th wheel the salesman said fit what we wanted. It was perfect, with the space and layout we liked. Ours is a 35' (31.5' past the truck). We looked at smaller and larger versions, but this was goldilocks for us. By the way all ours were Jayco - very good, not perfect. We got a used Ram 3500 with the turbo diesel (which tows this 12,000 trailer and accelerates uphill) - I love it.
Note that you still unhook from the trailer and use the tow vehicle for sight-seeing. The fifth wheel has so much storage I don't need to carry anything in the bed of the truck. I have a full with tool box Behind the cab for stuff I want to keep in the truck all the time.
The big message is; look at a lot of options, try them camping and then get what the spouse wants.

 

[Fordracer350]

Lots of good info above. I'll give how we got to what we have.
We towed a 17' hybrid trailer with a 1500 Ram SB. Lot of space for sleeping but taught us to want more walk-through and storage space. Light, single axle trailer. We got a 23' hybrid with a slide-out, which gave us great space inside but taught us the hybrid wasn't the best for Fall/Spring camping. Twin axle trailer towed much better, even though about 800 lb heavier. We started looking at various designs and sizes of hard walled trailers to decide on what we liked. Do a LOT of that. We went to look at a specific trailer we thought might work and while we were there looked at a 5th wheel the salesman said fit what we wanted. It was perfect, with the space and layout we liked. Ours is a 35' (31.5' past the truck). We looked at smaller and larger versions, but this was goldilocks for us. By the way all ours were Jayco - very good, not perfect. We got a used Ram 3500 with the turbo diesel (which tows this 12,000 trailer and accelerates uphill) - I love it.
Note that you still unhook from the trailer and use the tow vehicle for sight-seeing. The fifth wheel has so much storage I don't need to carry anything in the bed of the truck. I have a full with tool box Behind the cab for stuff I want to keep in the truck all the time.
The big message is; look at a lot of options, try them camping and then get what the spouse wants.

 

[Dan_69GTX]

Between us and our extended family we have had many campers.

When looking at a camper there are several things I look for:
- If it has a slide, can you get into whatever you want with the slide IN? IE - can you use the bathroom without moving the slide?
- If your bed is tucked between two wall - at the head/foot, it is a PAIN to make it. And forget being tall and have your feet off the bed.
- Outside shower is nice to rinse off and not use up grey water space. (IE - at the beach).
- Older campers still have pilot lights vs electronic ignition for the propane applinaces. Pilot lights are a pain when the blow out.
- Older A/C units will require a larger generator to run when boondocking. (IE - at the racetrack).
- Wiring - Test multiple things AT THE SAME TIME that are on the same circuit. Some campers cheapen the wiring and it isn't a big enough gauge to run several lights at the same time w/o dimming. Best to do this test on JUST battery - not with the inverter plugged in.
- Do you want to camp when it is cold - make sure all tanks AND valves are above the insulation.
- Outdoor kitchens are GREAT!
- Cabinet door - do they open all the way w/o hitting something else? IE the A/C vents in the ceiling?
- What is mounted above the toilet? Whatever is there WILL eventually fall into the toilet - IE towels, medicine from the cabinet, etc.
- Do you want to mount something on the back bumper - what is in the way IE outdoor shower, spare tire, lights, etc.

Well, that is what comes to mind right now.

Dan

 

[Dan_69GTX]

deleted duplicate

 

[redandwhitebrit]

I am the owner of my second Northwood Arctic Fox travel trailer. The current model is a 2016 25Y, 30' "bumper pull", one slide, front queen bed, center kitchen, rear seating (either jackknife sofa or chairs). The commode is near the front bedroom in its own room, shower across the hall, with the sink and medicine cabinet next to the shower. It has two doors, and you can access the bathroom and refrigerator with the slide room in, so easy to stop for lunch and bathroom breaks. I have pulled this trailer about 30,000 miles and am very pleased with it. I owned a 32' Newmar fifth wheel, and could never get used to backing it or putting it in tight spots. I much prefer my travel trailer, as I also have a canopy on my 2016 Ram Laramie crew cab short box. I also use a Blue Ox SwayPro hitch, and find it provides a very stable towing platform in all conditions. It is all about what you like, but a high quality, well laid out RV is a great retirement gift to yourself.

 

[slowmover]

Been at this life-long; third generation with aero, all-aluminum trailers.

Needless to say I’m biased in favor of the travel trailer with an indefinite life span, not those that aren’t worth owning as they hit ten years.

The RV market went downscale forty years ago as the doctors, lawyers and others moved to de-regulated cheap airline flights. And their wives became “career women”. And the explosion of truck traffic after that industry was “de-regulated” to favor big money interests.

Then massive urban sprawl since 1970 as the cities were ethnically-cleansed and folks had to have two incomes to afford more house, greater transportation costs, all to have decent schools for their kids.

The 3-4 week annual vacation became a historical curiosity, sort of like a fully-funded pension.

But the tax laws permitted low cost financing for RVs, and the buyer became someone near retirement who might use one/two rigs over a ten year period.

They’re made like junk. Cranked out as fast as possible.

My folks kept theirs 27-Years. Sold it in 2004 and it’s still on the road. I think they replaced the awning.

Mines a 1989. Just reaching the point where re-upholstery and new appliances a standard job.

There’s no comparison in towing one versus the usual box.

The critical decision isn’t all the well-meaning and well-done posts above, it’s that one must take a step farther back:

A. How long will you own it?

B. How many nights aboard per annum?

C. A rough idea of how many miles, potentially, in that period?

Ifit’s more than 75k miles and seven years, don’t buy a box. Get something meant to travel, and meant to last.

Of the five aluminum trailer manufacturers from the Golden Era of RV travel circa 1955-1975, only Airstream remains. And it was the entry level down-market offering. Survived as a prestige brand for Thor (which with another company produce 80% of today’s trailers).

Ten years old is still “new” with an AS type. 10-15 years and most of the depreciation is gone. Great age to buy one.

And you sure don’t need a one ton series. Much less a truck.

But trucks are the default choice for today’s less informed buyer. The latest half tons (400HP 6.2L with 10-auto can see 24-mpg solo at 60-mph). Etc. In no way is a one ton type ever as easy to live with as a half ton.

So the second question to be answered is:

How much junk goes in the tow vehicle? Find out.

Install the CAT Scale phone app and get an adjusted TARE weight on the current truck. That’s driver, max fuel and gear permanently aboard during your ownership.

The scale ticket values and truck axle limits are what one works within.

Since over 90% of RVers never get hitch rigging correct, they also don’t understand what’s payload and what isn’t.

Let’s say the TT you buy has a tongue weight (TW) of 1,200-lbs: here’s how that will sit on the truck

After adjustment, 940 lbs to truck with 260 onto trailer axles.

Of that 940 remains big about 400 will be on Steer Axle, and only 540 on Drives.

Your 1200-lb TW adds 540 to count against “payload”.
Which is why cars and SUVS — already superior road vehicles — have always been preferred as the one family vehicle to do it all.

Vehicle spec is big. The wrong vehicle makes for greater expense, greater rollover risk, and is never as easy to use or to drive.

So take the truck you ha e now and as the second scale weight, load it up as you would for camping. Driver plus pax and gear.

The weight of that gear is the thing. Subtract the earlier TARE weight.

1. How long will I own it?

2. How many nights aboard per year?

3. How many miles will it cover?

4. What weight of gear MUST go in the tow vehicle (TV)?

5. What TV best suits family needs Year-round? That can also tow the TT?

A truck is pretty much dead last for serious consideration. Unless one is also a contractor, farmer, rancher, etc. A better design of TV can pull an open trailer to carry more than any one ton can in the bed. Etc.

With trucks, IFS plus rack & pinion steering and lowest center of gravity is the winner.

Same with 4WD. I’ve maybe had to pay to get towed from a rut two-three times the past half-century. Be sure it’s needed. I can park the trailer and use other ways to go “farther in”. And my expenses prove the superiority of the choice.

Just “wanting “ 4WD isn’t enough.

As to the TT, any Suspension other than torsion Axle needs replacement. Same with disc brakes (antilock) over drums.

As to hitches, there’s no point to other than the Jim Hensley-designed pair: Hensley Arrow or ProPride. They eliminate sway.

Probably the people who’ll tell you a 5er is “more stable” than a TT also believe that obsolete hitch designs are adequate.

I can do maneuvers at highway speed with my CTD & 35’ Silver Streak — all day — that will roll any 5er or conventionally hitched TT.

There’s not a more unstable rig on the highway than a 4WD pulling a box. Toy haulers worst.

I run about 3-4000 miles week. It’s a standard CB joke that the lifted diesel pickup with off-road tires yanking a toy hauler at 70-mph has Baby Daddy at the wheel. Those poor kids in the backseat don’t have a father.

Over the years I’ve seen several dozen RVs wreck. And happened onto the aftermath countless times.

The ER docs all say the same. Want a nice long life? Avoid two things: being gunshot, and being in a serious accident.

Let’s not dial up laughter with anyone talking “skill” or “good habits”. You won’t want me as your right seat instructor. Or rig inspector.

Take your time. Be clear as to where you’re starting. Not ifs or maybes or just in case or damned guesstimates.

Use real numbers. Finance and insurance. Towing mpg penalty of 50% at 60-mph (less with better TT). Etc.

Towing isn’t too hard. It’s setting limits. Miles per day. MPH. Having a plan, before driving. Arriving in daylight. 300-miles or 3 o’clock is just as valid today as when I first heard it in the 1960s.

Etc. Lots of vehicle specific forums and blogs, etc, to be read.

Turn off the TV the rest of the year. You still can’t cover it all. And it’s not dumb versus smart questions as the ten year new guys believe, it’s even knowing there’s a question to be asked, at all.

Good luck

 

[toomeyddt]

Guess I will throw in on this, too - in addition to 'all of the above'.... have been full time living in two different trailers for last 11 years. And seen thousands of rv's and talked with hundreds of owners coming through the trailer park I stay at most the of time. Some miscellaneous thoughts...

One constant you can count on is that most of the newer stuff out there is junk - within the last 10 years or more. Rubber roofs on a trailer are guaranteed leak - in NO more than just a few years, if you are lucky enough to get that long. Most new ones have another built in leak - the slide out. Again, a few years, max. Lots of maintenance PLUS the added benefit of getting to bring into the trailer anything that happens to drop onto the roof of the slide out. Rain. Leaves. Branches. Squirrels. Dirt. Ask me how I know. And yes, you can sweep/wash the top off every time you bring the slide in, and go a long ways to 'fixing' that problem.

Dicor is the rubber roof used, and the caulking/sealant used for the most part. Dicor sealant is crap. Guaranteed to fail soon. There are commercial sealants available that are much better. Everywhere you find Dicor, take it off and replace. Sikaflex 1A is one that works. There are other commercial products out there, but I haven't used them yet. It's kinda like the stuff used to fill cracks in sidewalks. Plus it costs less.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7LIW1Mwpds

NO SILICONE SEALANTS EVER!! RTV is biggest no-no you can ever do anywhere on an RV!! Also, Flex-Seal - doesn't work! Ask me how I know...!

Avoid at all costs, wall construction that has luan plywood glued to the fiberglass layer as outside wall. It is the worst possible wall you can get. When it leaks - not if - the plywood turns to wet toilet paper and is called "delamination". It shows up as large "bubbles" seen on the outside wall. If you want the best shot at being able to use the trailer over time, don't look at ANY trailer that uses luan laminated wall. Filter out all of the trailers that don't use Azdel (google is your friend!), or build like Doubletree/HitchHiker/Teton. Azdel is good. Rubber roofs delaminate ALL the time - another 'when' not 'if' - so look very closely at roof!! The Dicor sealant on any rubber roof - around vents, A/C, anything on roof - is bad after 2 years MAX!! Again, Sikaflex!!

Haven't seen a metal roof used on a newer trailer for a long time, but it is the best. If you can find a "beater" that isn't too bad a shape, and are handy and want a project, put your own aluminum roof on! IF done right, it will last LONG time! Think Airstream, etc... In general, you can find a used project trailer and spend less money and fix it up to be a better trailer than you could ever buy from showroom! (Except for Lance, Doubletree, Hitchhiker, Excel, etc) Side note on Doubletree and Hitchhiker - place I stay had a tornado event 3 years ago - most of the trailers were disassembled, but a few stayed together (even though still totaled due to damage from debris). For rolling down the road, I like the idea of something that will hang together better. Lot's of "how to" videos out there... Small scale stuff, there is a guy called mobiltec that shows some interesting small work stuff. His canned ham projects show construction techniques that are still used a lot today on the cheaper stuff out there - I have 2, 1990's 5'ers that are built just like a 1950's Shasta! (Kit Sportsmaster and a Fleetwood).

Fiberglass tub - yes. ABS tub - no!

Atwood ovens will never get temperature right.

Dual pane windows sound nice, but unless you are gonna do a LOT of winter camping, not worth the hassle. My single panes have been to -18 F (Kit) and while that is miserable place in that trailer, it wouldn't be much better with the dual pain windows! Plus they leak and fog up and are very expensive to fix. Sooner than later. (See what I did there... pane/pain...) Another "ask me" event...

Watch out for the cargo weight - how much stuff you can take with you! You will always want to take more than you think. It always weighs a lot more than you think! Weigh the loaded, ready to go, rig at a truck stop scale! DO NOT EXCEED!!

Tires - always have to change within 5 years, even if only 50 miles on them. They will not stand up and you do NOT want a blow out and the associated damage! Again, ask me how I know. I try to avoid Chinese tires and only use Goodyear Marathon (and yeah, I know, some of them are Chinese made now...) Biggest tire you can get is best. Size, load rating, etc. Nitrogen fill is a gimmick. Why bother with unnecessary expense? Air is "free"...


This guy. Mostly talking about motorhomes, but absolutely applies to trailers, too. He IS telling it like it is. Boils down to buyer beware big time!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IP_u2JR51_Y

 

[tommyturbo]

MRoberts. Even though we love our TT, we are always open to upgrade. Every October, we attend a manufacturer sponsored
rv show in Pomona. As with you, we are looking for a 25-30 ft TT. It's hard to find that size with a floorplan like our
current one. Because we are seasoned campers, we are very picky. Our must haves always come first when shopping.
For us, we are looking for 6 lug axles with 16" wheels (to upgrade to Michelin XPS RIB), walk around queen bed, full bathroom,
opposing slides, all full hookups at the left rear, 30 amp, enclosed underbelly, gel coat, saniflush black water tank, high
efficiency bath exhaust fan and maybe a fireplace heater. On the last day of this last rv show, we actually found one
that was decent. A Winnebago Minnie Plus 27RBDS. I don"t remember the retail price but I ground the price down to
$30,000. We would also have to swap out 16" wheels and tires. The deal breaker was the pitiful trade in price for our
lovely nine year old Cherokee. That hurt. Even a private sale could only bring $7,000 max. We just could not part with our
TT. A TDR member mentioned OutdoorsRV and I checked out the Blackstone Class Mountain Series 250RKS. It had
16" wheels and good tires standard and everything else looked to be high quality. The only disappointment was
because the bathroom was forward and that the sewer was also forward which meant needing a long hose to the rear dump.
Our latest TT shopping adventure.
Tommyturbo

 

[GAmes]

Yes it is!!

I will immediately go fetch a fresh drink and re-position my chair when I see the couple with the brand new motorhome drag out a pair of walkie talkies before they attempt to back into a spot.....rarely am I disappointed watching that scenario unfold.....

HEY!! I resemble that. Walkie-talkies have probably saved a few marriages. We still use ours, have even replaced them a couple times. It makes backing into a tight, tree lined site a two minute job.

 

[MRoberts]

"look at a lot of options, try them camping and then get what the spouse wants."

Probably the soundest advice yet! :-laf

 

[kthaxton]

So true.#ad

 

[6V92TA]

MRoberts. what you desire you should be fine using a 2500 series pickup but it never hurts to have more truck than you need.

I'm not going to say much after all the other input you have received but I think it would be a good idea to go to a bunch of RV shows and look at everything available, and make a list of must haves and see the stuff you don't like too.

like somebody said, if it has a slide, can you get in the refrigerator and the bathroom if the slide is in. there are all kinds of little things too think about.