Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) CPS failure symptoms?

[RStacy]

Mine was a plain 'ol hex head...

Did you change it with the vp in place or removed? I started looking at it today-tight fit.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Did you change it with the vp in place or removed? I started looking at it today-tight fit.

I was swapping out the VP-44, and pulled out the CPS while the VP was out, just outta curiosity and to check for visual problems - looked fine externally, so thoroughly applied contact cleaner to plug contacts and reinstalled it. I'd sure prefer to NOT have to change one out with the VP-44 in place!

 

[Timbeaux38]

I swapped mine out withthe VP44 in. I was having the same problems as described in post #17. I am a small fella and it was a bear with my small hands. Getting it out was the easy part, but lining up the screw and getting it tight caused a nice cussin' fit. The sensor is cheap, and it should be replaced anytime you have the pump out wether you need it or not IMO

 

[Jetson]

RStacy, the 1999's run primarily off the Crankcase Position Sensor (CKP), but they also have a Cam Position Sensor (CMP). If you're loosing the tach, you probably have a bad CKP.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

The sensor is cheap, and it should be replaced anytime you have the pump out wether you need it or not IMO

The problem for me was more related to availablity than cost - it's a 250 mile round trip from here to where they MIGHT have the proper sensor - so sometimes we either have to wait - and that was no option in my situation - or else take yer chances...



So far, all is well - and about 3000 miles on the replacement VP-44...

 

[Willys]

Gary, any updates on how your VP is doing? Has the 216 code come back?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Gary, any updates on how your VP is doing? Has the 216 code come back?

AH, a thread from the past! :-laf



No more problems - replaced my OEM VP-44 with a II rebuilt, all is well. As to the CPS, removed it, visually checked - waste of time, since there's really nothing external to check other than obvious damage - but did clean the plug end contacts with contact cleaner and reinstalled. I'm really not much inclined to swap out properly working parts just because I "happen to be in the area" - it would be just my luck to replace a good one with one defective right outta the box!



Besides, there's really not much in a CPS to fail - it's a simple magnetic sensor - a metal core with wire windings around it to sense tone wheel teeth as they pass in rotation, or something similar. Not much current involved, and unless the actual connectors fail to make proper contact, or the CPS/leads get damaged as the VP-44 is being replaced, nothing much to fail.



The original VP-44 was returned to II to have ONLY the out of spec parts replaced, turns out mine was one of Bosch's infamous design errors, where they used a brass advance cylinder liner. Those have proven to fail early to accelerated wear - just as mine did - the rebuilders now use a new outer case that employs a steel advance cylinder liner. Other than that, all the rest of the internals were fine, and reinstalled - that pump is now my spare...

 

[Willys]

Gary- I think your thread might be hitting on something here though. A friend and I have been working on his truck- it has the dreaded 216 code. After talking to a well known local diesel guru(and a scan), he determined it was the crankshaft position sensor. I replaced it yesterday and the truck is running well again. (I posted more details in a thread a month or two back) I'll have my friend check the codes again this week and see if the 216 code has disappeared. So far though, its working.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Gary- I think your thread might be hitting on something here though. A friend and I have been working on his truck- it has the dreaded 216 code. After talking to a well known local diesel guru(and a scan), he determined it was the crankshaft position sensor. I replaced it yesterday and the truck is running well again. (I posted more details in a thread a month or two back) I'll have my friend check the codes again this week and see if the 216 code has disappeared. So far though, its working.

Never can tell - keep us posted!

 

[rweis]

Am I correct in that if the Camshaft Position Sensor is totally dead (broken wire) the truck will not start or run?



Bob Weis

 

[T Peterson]

Is there anything other than the VP that could be removed to gain better access?

TIA



Tom

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Is there anything other than the VP that could be removed to gain better access?

TIA



Tom

I don't think so - the VP-44 seems to be the primary obstacle.



By the way, since this is an old thread resurfaced, I now have about 15K miles on the rebuilt II VP-44 - never ANY related codes, and the OEM CPS is still installed - no codes other that the couple earlier related, 40K miles and 5 years or so back...



Glad I didn't replace it...

 

[T Peterson]

Good news Gary, I'm still hoping the code I pulled, P0341 if I remember correctly, is truly the culprit and I don't have an APP's going out or worse, the VP. Thanks for the reply, by the way the CPS I bought was $38.



Tom

 

[willyslover]

just a lil note to this. . don't assume napa is lower priced than Cummins

I bought one at Napa [while shopping for another sensor [map] , napa was out of the map so off to Cummins I went. while there asked the parts man the price of this sensor and they were ~$15. 00 lower than Napa... so a call is worth the time

 

[PRout]

Question from the past. .

Am I correct in that if the Camshaft Position Sensor is totally dead (broken wire) the truck will not start or run?
Bob Weis

Note: One time it wouldnt start ... . Noticed the fuel pump wasnt going on either. . Waited a few seconds, and re-tried, and it fired up, FP was running again.

Due to the occurrence mentioned above, I "suspect" at least under certain conditions, if the cps dies, the engine wont run. I know for a fact that this truck runs with no fuel pressure. .
This is referring to a year 2000 truck that has the sensor mounted down by the crank, not up by the cam.

 

[T Peterson]

Help, Not The Cps

Well, it's not the CPS. I took it to a trusted mechanic to replace the cps and it still threw the same code, they checked the wiring between the cps and the ECM and said it was good, so they said it must be the ECM, so I bought an ECM from Bob Wagner (thanks Bob) replaced it and the same fricken thing. Here are the symptoms, start cold, drive for 4 to 6 minutes then tach dies and 2 seconds later I lose power (not limp mode I think, I can still go 70 or so but not uphill and very little acceleration) then 4 or 5 minutes and tach comes back, 2 seconds later power returns and all is fine until the next cold start. Anyone have any ideas? At first I thought it might be a bad ground but symptoms are so predictable, could it be heat related. Any and all ideas welcome. TIA



Tom

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Well, it's not the CPS. I took it to a trusted mechanic to replace the cps and it still threw the same code, they checked the wiring between the cps and the ECM and said it was good, so they said it must be the ECM, so I bought an ECM from Bob Wagner (thanks Bob) replaced it and the same fricken thing. Here are the symptoms, start cold, drive for 4 to 6 minutes then tach dies and 2 seconds later I lose power (not limp mode I think, I can still go 70 or so but not uphill and very little acceleration) then 4 or 5 minutes and tach comes back, 2 seconds later power returns and all is fine until the next cold start. Anyone have any ideas? At first I thought it might be a bad ground but symptoms are so predictable, could it be heat related. Any and all ideas welcome. TIA



Tom

Sounds like a possible alignment/gap issue between the tone ring and CPS sensor, causing an erratic or irregular signal to the ECM - a good real-time code reader/analyzer might show exactly what is going on - at least the Actron 9145 I use allows monitoring sensor inputs as the engine is running...

 

[JLandry]

Well, it's not the CPS.



... so I bought an ECM from Bob Wagner (thanks Bob) replaced it and the same fricken thing.



Any and all ideas welcome.

EDIT: I mistakenly read the P0341 diagnostic procedures for a gasoline engine equipped truck and tried to lead Tom down the wrong problem solving path... until he caught it when I emailed him the procedures and wiring diagram for the CPS.



Sorry 'bout that Tom!



Back to square one...



John L.

 

[T Peterson]

Thanks guys, good info, looks like I'll have to talk with my guy. I do trust him but not everybody can know everything about everrything. I'll arm him with this info and let him give it another try. I'll keep y'all updated. In the mean time I'll see if I can scratch up enough poker money to get a reader like Gary's



Tom

 

[JLandry]

EDIT: Irrelevant information to Tom's situation given... see post #38.



John L.