Cryo'ed Input & Output shaft -

[KatDiesel]

Anyone that has both shafts in the transmission cryo'ed..... whats the most boost you have launched with?

 

[Bigsaint]

Eric, I believe that CSutton has his output shaft cyro'ed. I'm sure Chris will see this and respond.



Scott W.

 

[CCahill]

Eric...

Are you talking about launching in 4WD?



Colin

 

[Greg Boardman-RIP]

I just have the input. Took a race on the street with a Ford that belongs to my buddy. I launched in 4X with about 16 to 18 on the boost guage. He couldn't believe how I could hook it like that. The 4 X launch will be our little secret..... Greg

 

[KatDiesel]

Originally posted by Bigsaint

Eric, I believe that CSutton has his output shaft cyro'ed. I'm sure Chris will see this and respond.

Ya I know he has something, jsut not sure if hes gone to the strip much?



and I know Jim Fuller has them... and he launches at 25psi or so.



Just was wondering if there were any others running around.



I currently launch at about 15psi ... gonna try 20psi or so when I get the shafts in. Around 25psi the truck overpowers the brakes... ... . Its kinda scary when you are sitting at the line and the smoke disappears because you have so much boost built!

 

[KatDiesel]

Originally posted by CCahill

Eric...

Are you talking about launching in 4WD?

Yep... . I don't know any other way



4WD way tooo much fun.



I figure once the shafts are done, then its time to freeze the transfer case.

 

[csutton7]

I only have the output cryo'd at this time--I have only made it to the track once and didn't do a boost launch and here in SF it's a little hard to do any testing as I've got one city block to get the truck stopped, so I'm of no help---but based on my sled pulling the cryo'd output shaft has held on for 10 pulls or so and I'd say it's a very smart thing to get the input shaft and whatever else you can cryo'd... ... . chris

 

[CUMINNTSTRKN]

eric



so far i figure i have over 200 hard launches on the transmission. i have launched as high as 30psi with the twins. as far as the brakes holding i'm using my g-tech so when it says go i bring the boost up to 25 psi and let go. i haven't had to stage my truck yet at the track. while street racing i bring the boost up to 15psi and then right before i launch i just nail the throttle so i don't know how high i'm launching at.



btw i raced a cbr 929 last friday, it took him 2 blocks to catch me. but when he came around it wasn't pretty. si know my truck won't run in the 10's on the motor.



jim

 

[EShaw]

cryogenic quenching

Guys,

Who does the cryogenic quenching of the input and output shafts? How much does it cost? How big (dimensions) are the shafts? What are they made out of (Alloy)? As a knifemaker to enhance the edge holding ability of my knives my blades are cryogenic quenched... ... . not every knifemaker does this... ... .

This is so cool... ... ... ... . -310 F hehehe

Where I'm goin' with this is you can do it yourself and maybe save some dough... ... ... maybe not.

Tools/supplies needed:

common sense

liquid nitrogen (welding supply house)

insulated cooler... ..... 2... ... ... 1 fits inside other

heavy leather welding gloves (safety precaution)

common sense

safety shield (clear)..... covers whole face

tongs

wire

wooden dowels

oven

common sense

Did I mention you need common sense... ... ... Don't even consider this if you're clumsy

Eric

 

[KLockliear]

I got'em too. I've found out a few things about the 4WD launches, but I'll let you guys figure it out for yourselves.

 

[Bandit1]

i am just curious but what does freezing the shafts do to increase strength? also how is it done? thanks

 

[csutton7]

they dip it in liquid nitrogen or something along that line, for a few hours--



the super cooling affects the molecularity of the metal, if you think of a pc of metal as a bunch of small cables or rods, it removes imperfections in the rods(small cracks)because the super cooling affects the molecules and makes them align themselves together thus eliminating the small cracks thus making it stronger--does that make some sense---



the output shaft is in the Overdrive housing and needs to be pressed in with a 20-30 ton press--let a transmission shop do it for you---DTT should have the shafts available--if they don't then let me know----chris

 

[Chipstien]

DTT!

Yes, DTT does offer the cryo'ed shafts. Call DTT for pricing as I do not know.

 

[Strick-9]

The place I'm using for my cryo work drops the temperature slowly. I believe it is around 1° per minute until it gets down to -300°F. Then they soak at this temperature for 22 hours. Then they bring the temperature back up slowly and perform a heat temper to 300°F. They recommended that anyone could do the freezing part, but if the following heat temper was not performed, I should expect a bunch of tiny transmission parts.



I don't know how much truth there is to this, but they quoted the same prices as other shops, so I figured why not.



For those of you interested, call around. You'd be surprised how popular cryogenics is becoming in the world of motorsports and how cheap it is.



-Chris

 

[csutton7]

strick-9..... you are correct in the way it's to be done---cool it slow and warm it up slow and temper it----chris

 

[CUMINNTSTRKN]

i talked to steve at bd today and i do not have cryo'd anything. my shaft's have been heat treated. what ever they did it's working so far.



jim

 

[Idaho CTD]

Cryogenics

Cryogenics has been around for years in the gun world. In most instances it reduces group sizes and fouling(when done to the barrel). It has also been found to increase the usable life of the barrel by 25+%. There are a lot of companies that have the equipment to do the process but it can take a while to get it done if the demand is low. Most will only run the "freezer" if they can get it full. It costs a lot every time they run the "freezer" so to keep cost low they need to fill it. I have heard of people doing complete motors albeit dissasembled. I just know a little about the process due to the fact that I build guns for a hobby. 300 Below is a pretty common name in cryogenics. Just chiming in with my . 02.



Nathan

 

[Jetpilot]

Kat,



I both my input and output shafts are cryoed. I have launched with 15 lbs boost in 4WD several times... . I am considering trying 20 and 25 just to test the waters.



Doug

 

[jwgary]

cool

Sorry for the pun... I couldn't resist. I wrote a paper on cryogenic treatment when I was in school. I have done a lot of study on it and we use cold treatment (not cryogenic) on our tool steels at work. For all you metallurgists out there, I will explain a little of what goes on. In any hardenable steel, the heated steel (cherry red) is in a solid crystal phase called austenite. When this is quenched, it turns into another phase with a slightly different crystal structure called martensite. You can never get rid of all the austenite when you quench. Retained austenite is a bad thing and causes stresses and dimensional instability. A cold treatment (about -125) will eliminate almost all the austenite. The Cryogenic treatment takes this a step further and causes the iron to squeeze out carbon atoms, making a more refined grain structure. A temper (at about 350) is needed to temper the newly formed martensite to relieve stresses. Don't think that you can just get some liquid nitrogen and dip your shafts in it to make them stronger. This is rocket science! Everything must be in a controled environment. Everyone knows what happens when you pour cold water into an engine that's overheated right? CRACK! That is only a difference of about 150 degrees. We are talking about at least twice the temperature change by dipping in liquid nitrogen. Let a professional do it... it's not that expensive. Sorry for the long post. I just hope that someone finds this interesting. I know I do

 

[Cummins Corvette]

Re: cool

Originally posted by jwgary

Let a professional do it... it's not that expensive. Sorry for the long post. I just hope that someone finds this interesting. I know I do

That someone would be me. Thanks for the info!



Chris