Cummins alert

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I took this from this months copy of Equipment World... . Cummins has issued an alert to all it's dealers and customers regarding certain coolants. It says, in part, "Based upon available data, Texaco Extended Life Coolant and other similar formulations supplied by Equilon Enterprises should not be used in Cummins engines. " According to Cummins, these coolants attack some seals used in it's engines. This allows coolant to leak into the crankcase, where it reacts with the engine oil to form a thick sludge. Should that occur, says Fleetguard's Gary Spires, "The engine has to be totally disassembled and cleaned out; there is no shortcut. " Cummins is working with Equilon, Texaco and its supplier of seals to come up with a solution. For now, however, the company is telling customers to stick with traditional antifreeze, either ethylene glycol or propylene glycol.

 

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Here's another sidebar... . Gary Spires of Fleetguard lists five of the cardinal sins he sees committed in the maintenance of cooling systems. (1) Failure to top off with what's already in the engine, which should be a fully formulated coolant. Don't simply add water or straight antifreeze. (2) Using test strips to trigger maintenance action. Spires says it's important to maintain the system as recommended, then use testing to confirm that all is well. (3) Buying bargin-basement antifreeze. The chemistry may be inadequete. There may be contaminants. (4) Using inadequate recycling equipment. Don't rely on filtration to do the job. True recycling requires expensive, complex equipment and a trained operator. (5) Not giving enough attention when mixing coolant in house. The ratios must be correct, and the product must be thoroughly mixed. Spires recommends mixing with a trolling motor or sump pump for two hours or more.

 

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Bilford, Did they mention Prestone Extended Life 5/100 antifreeze/coolant? Geeeze I hope not. It contains, Ethylene Glycol, Diethylene Glycol and Disodium Sebacate. I does not contain the following; phosphates,nitrites, silicates, borates or amines.

Thanks for the info #ad
Bill R
Bob K, I E-Mailed Cummins with our concerns
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1994 Dodge Ram SLT Cummins 5 speed 4x4,3. 54 gears, Scotty Air System,PIAA Platnum Super Whites,Optima red top batteries, manual trans filter,Turbo&Exhaust blanket,Magnaguard rear diff cover,Edelbrock IAS shocks,muffler removed,Borgeson steering shaft,Trailmaster steering stabilizers,Rancho upper & lower links,Polyurethane sway bar bushings,Skyjacker 2" leveling springs(front),Fabritech Stage II Traction Bars,Denman Coyote A/P LT305/85R16(36" Tall) tires on Stock Dodge Chrome 16x6. 5 wheels,Bushwacker Street Flares,Back-off saftey brake light,Bugflector II bug shield, Royal Purple ,Amsoil& Red line lubes throughout.

1970 Plymouth Cuda (under construction)
1968 Hurst HEMI® Dart , Nah its just a screen name ;-)



[This message has been edited by 1968 Hurst HEMI Dart (edited 10-26-1999). ]

 

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I too hope the prestone extended is ok.
I just changed out the DC coolant. Flushed the block clean of the DC coolant.
I have 4500 miles on my 99.
The folks on the Ram list pointed out that the DC coolant wasnt compliant with what Cummins recommended. . and the waterpump wouldnt like it. A couple of the guys on the list have been using the prestone extended life in the ISB with out a problem... so "there go I" and now I hope going there wasnt the wrong thing todo...
It's only been two weeks,,,and so far so good.

 

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Don't you folks think it is pretty ridiculous to believe that the coolant DC puts in the truck at the factory violates Cummins' recommendation?

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'99 3500 QC 4x2, Auto, white/agate, 4. 10 LSD, camping & towing pkg. , Mag-Hytec rear cover & trans. pan, Auto Meter gages, Mopar bed liner & mud flaps, Prime-Loc fuel filter relocation kit, Tekonsha Sentinel brake controller, Rancho step rails

'97 Pace American 28' "Aerosport" tag race car trailer



[This message has been edited by drag racer (edited 10-26-1999). ]

 

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I agree drag racer.
Why would they put it in if it was no good?

I talked to Cummins awhile back about what THEY would recomend, when I changed my antifreez,and they said the Chrysler antifreez was just fine to use. I plan on changing mine as soon as it is due.
I don't know who started this rumor but I don't beleave it. Save your money and change it when it is due.
I see in another post the Phawrd site says we have trouble with the 6 speed. News to me.

I think this is the ONLY site to get reliable information. #ad
#ad


Don

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"The Shadow" 1999 Dodge Ram SLT 2500 QC 5spd 3. 55lsd, Short Bed, Sport, Black, Camel/Tan Interior, Trailer tow package, Camper package, Infinity sound.

Elba Twp, Michigan

[This message has been edited by Don Marriott (edited 10-27-1999). ]

[This message has been edited by Don Marriott (edited 10-27-1999). ]

 

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Hemi... They didn't mention Prestone, but for more info Fleetguard gave a number to call. FLEETGUARD-(800) 223-4583. bilford.

 

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I have an E-mail from Texaco on this subject. It appears that Cummins does want the silicates in the engine to protect gaskets. The Texaco extended life silicate free has an organic acid, that is named in the letter, that attacks the gaskets. If anyone wishes a copy of the E-mail forwarded to them please contact me.

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Paul A. Schmidt
95, 4X4, SLT 2500, 5 spd. , 4. 10, 270 hp. TST, Pacbrake, Walker muffler,
GearVendor O. D.
Eastern PA.

 

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I REALLY Hope this issue is put to bed soon... .
And I hope everyone out there has good luck!!!

I would suggest that everyone who reads this go out and do the Fleetgaurd CC2801 routine!!!

This stuff has got to be the easiest stuff I've ever used!!

Pre-mixed and made by Cummins/fleetgaurd for our engines!!

HONESTLY... the coolant change was as easy as an oil change!!!

Use the 1/2 now. . 1/2 later method and "Run like the Wind!!!"

AGAIN GOOD LUCK TO ALL!!!

Larry

 

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I was kinda thinkin' about using the Waring blender to make up some small batches. But the motor would probly burn up before 2 hrs.

 

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I just read the Texaco/Cummins service bulletin Paul has (13 pages) Prestone seems to be ok. The problem seems to be 2-Ethyl-Hexanoic acid, the main organic acid in Texaco Extended Life Coolant. I am still waiting to hear from Cummins #ad


[This message has been edited by 1968 Hurst HEMI Dart (edited 10-27-1999). ]

 

[Archive]

I recieved this response from Cummins about Prestone Antifreeze. Prestone does not contain Nitrites... . So I guess Its ok???

-------------- ------------------------------- Subj: Re: Hi Brian, Need an Urgent question answered
Date: 10/28/99 7:49:09 AM Pacific Daylight Time
From: Brian. C. Kuznicki@Cummins.com (Brian C Kuznicki)
To: BRILEY6258@aol.com


Bill,

Thanks for your E-mail message.

We have no details to share about any specific products, however, extended life
coolants, all with nitrites, have been found to cause degradation of silicone
seals and gaskets used in Cummins engines. Failures have been documented at
mileage from 80K miles to 380K miles. The failures to date have occurred on N14
rocker housing gaskets and N14 oil cooler gaskets. Other failures have occurred
at low rates on B, C and M engine coolant system gaskets.

These seals have been in full production since 1991 with no failures when using
other coolants. The seal material in use was rigorously developed for the
million mile engine and has proven to achieve this life. To protect our
customers from premature failures of engine cooling system gaskets and seals,
the use of these extended life coolants and its derivatives will not be allowed
in any Cummins engine.

Further, it is to be understood that this action will not affect the Cummins
Engine Company warranty in general, but failures that are attributable to the
use of these coolants will not be the responsibility of Cummins Engine Company.
It is the responsibility of the manufacturers of such products to ensure their
compatibility with engines and cooling systems already in the marketplace.

Let me know if you have other questions, or if away from your computer (or you
have a time-critical request that needs urgent attention), feel free to call me
(toll-free, from North America) at 1-800-DIESELS (343-7357), or 1-812-377-5000
(toll call, worldwide, ask for 800-DIESELS).

Regards,


Brian Kuznicki



[This message has been edited by 1968 Hurst HEMI Dart (edited 10-28-1999). ]

 

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So it seems by the above posts the Prestone is ok and it is a wise move to go to a no nitrites coolant.
The issue with the DC coolant was that it wasnt a low nitrites coolant. It is a standard Ethylene Glycol which are loaded with nitrites.
The Fleetguard blue is low in or has no nitrites as well as the Prestone orange.
Glad to hear it's a Texaco only issue.
Thanks.
Bob

[This message has been edited by bobk (edited 10-29-1999). ]

 

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Hey, just a warning out there for do it your self types. Ethelyne Glycol(sp) is seriously dangerous, watch yourself and dont let it get on you. The vapors are even more hazardous.
Jack

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97 Red, slide in camper, Trails West 2 horse slant trailer, K&N air, 255. 85. 16 Big O XT, Banks Stinger Plus(minus exhaust), 4" BD exhaust (minus the muffler), A pillar gauge mounts, after market overload springs

 

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Bob, I thought Cummins response was a bit vague on Prestone products. I E-Mailed Prestone with our concerns. Attached a copy of the cummins e-mail ect... . waiting for a reply.

[This message has been edited by 1968 Hurst HEMI Dart (edited 10-30-1999). ]

 

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Bill,
Thanks for the double check.
It'll be great to hear it from them.
This Texaco thing is very new compared to the other FAQs and email posts.
Others had changed to the prestone extended life without a problem... so far...

Jack. . thanks for the warning. . I do know how bad the coolant solvents are. . the coolants are cancerous (sp?). 25 years ago I was doing brake jobs with an air hose and it would have been nice if warnings were out there about the asbestos (again sp?)dust.
Now we use solvents to wash the dust away. .
and the pads arent asbestos.
Still. . which is worse the dust or solvents?
Used motor oil is as bad of a carcinagine (again sp?) as the coolants. Seem the combustion byproducts in the oil are the problem.
Automechanics should be dropping from the racks like flys, by the reports of all these things that are bad for us.

Come to think of it the air we breath can kill us...

I think I hear my supplier of medical grade oxgen coming, I was starting to run low.
gotta go. . gotta give him the empties. .

There is all this bad stuff out there we use day to day... and it doesnt seem to stop, we just keep making all these consumables with agents that arent heathly for us.
Come to think of it...
The high frequency switching power supply in your PC can make you shoot blanks if not properly sheilded and positioned too close to your lap.

Allright. . I'm all EPA'ed out...

Sorry. .
--(inhale)---(cough)
Bob