Cummins powered Big Rigs

[JHansen]

A 16 litre Green Leaker you say?

Figuring better late to the party then not showing up at all? I'm not a S60 fan... . although I have never driven one my brother did-rated at 450 and pulling 39500 kg. (around 88000 lbs. ). About a week after he drove my truck with a 425 Cat pulling around 50000 kg (over 110000 lbs. )-he said mine pulled as good as the Jimmy did. I realize gearing makes a difference in perceived power-and my Star was geared for pulling (3. 90's with 15 direct-around 1850-1900 rpm at 60 mph-that portion of my memory was beaten out by the suspension or sonically damaged by engine noise )-but that much?



I had 1 guy justify his Detroit purchase by stating it was the lightest big block power..... in my mind engine is the last place to worry about weight. A Cat is definitely heavier than anything else-I guess the C15 and C16 have gone on a diet but I don't know how close they come to the others now weight-wise.



I fear the days of any power in any truck are coming to a close now-especially with DC owning 3 brands and an engine maker. I'll probably never own a Class 8-so it shouldn't bother me that much I guess..... but I still hold out hope of winning the lottery . Just like Matt I'd like to own one just for the sake of owning it-used to bug the guys I worked with that when I bought the lottery I'd order a chrome-dipped Pete with a big jesus Cat just to go for coffee in-pull the 5th wheel off and put a hot tub up there or something...



Jason

 

[Roadhouse]

If you are just looking, in a few months would be a great time to buy, cause the sales are way down.



i have owned the following.

International cabover 350 cummins 9 sp

International cabover w set back,double sleeper&airride

Ford LTL 9000 with 400 cummins 13 over

Ford LTL 9000 with 400cat& 9sp

Freightliner hood with electronic cat 9 speed

freightliner cabover 350 cummins 9 speed.



My fave by far was the international cabover with the setback axle. very comfy for me. I liked the horizontal steering wheel, pedal position &seat angle, but I have real short legs, good ride too. very easy to turn in tight spots,(I made 5-15 stops a day) and best of all,

CHEAP, less than half price of a hood with the exact same specs.



I did like the 13 speed though.



Stay far far away from the computer engines, just get one that is all manual. A manual engine never left me walking.

Stinking Freightliner computer engine left me walking several times.

Sensor thinks your antifreeze is low (even though its not) and you are walking, all that computer crap is just that.



I just couldnt get comfortable in the Freightshakers.



Best place to buy is from a company that leases them long term, like Ryder. have all the maint records.

Do not buy one from a owner-operator thats hurting for the $$$ he for sure has skipped on the maint.



If you want bragging rights do what I did, install a shower w/10 gal hot water tank and porta potti, and refrigator.

Just take some tubeing or a heater core, and coil it in a 10 gal tank, circulate the engine coolant through it and presto hot water. with a 12 v pump.



House boats have the coolest stuff.



The Cadilliac night vision thingie would be VERY cool to have.



All the guys bragging about how fast their $80K crome Pete would go, were jealous of my $500 shower in my $20K 4 yr old cabover, cause it saved me 2 hours a day, easy. (and I knew that the last person to use it didnt have athleates foot)



Big power is nice, but my shower saved me way more time that I would have made by driving faster,

I got there sooner, using less fuel, in a truck that cost 1/4 of the big power guys.

Used the diff to buy a cabin in the mtns.

I dont drive anymore, made the mistake of thinking, "If I am making this much with one truck, imagine how much I could make with 3 thruck. " bout the time my doc was getting worried about my 139/99 blood pressure the church we attended offered me a full time job, (BP is now 99/69)but I still got the cabin.

 

[kcjayco]

JHANSEN,



Could you explain why DC would have anything to do with the power level in trucks going down? Cat and Cummins have been increasing power levels. Detroit is coming out with a 16L soon, which doesn't indicate lower power to me.

 

[JHansen]

Not lower power, lower choices....

Sorry man-didn't mean to imply that DC/Detroit was going to end the power struggle that is currently going on in the Class 8 world-just that with all the takeovers and "strategic alliances" going on soon if you're looking for a particular powerplant you'll be locked into 2 or 3 specific truck makes. I personally don't care if Detroit came out with a 20 litre model-I have no desire to own one-even if DC does own them now... . If DC bought out GM you still wouldn't see one in my driveway . To be bluntly honest the only truck in the DC fold that interests me is Western Star-and I suspect they will screw that line away either through mismanagement or sheer stupidity. Cutting the production line in Kelowna doesn't exactly endear them to me... . As long as PACCAR keeps providing Cat power everything will be alright in my little world



The usual disclaimers arise-YMMV, IMHO, JMHO, etc. etc. !



Jason

 

[kcjayco]

Well, in view of the fact that I work for KW, I can't dissagree with KW quality. I have also worked for F/L. The base engine for Paccar this year will be Cummins, unless you specifie Cat. Only two engine choices this year. The drivetrain will be Arvin Meritor, unless otherwise specified. This means that Pac/Lease trucks will be Cummins and Arvin Meritor. Here's an engine for you. Converts to about 12,000 HP.





Engine model 8000

No. of cylinders 20V

Cylinder arrangement 48°V

Bore/stroke mm 265/315

Max. output kW 9000

Max. speed rpm 1150

 

[JHansen]

No more Jimmys at Paccar?

Can't really say it breaks my heart-but you should have been able to figure that out from my previous postings My neighbor up the road will be sore though-he loves his T800's and S60's. Too bad for him I guess... .



I did like the T800 I had after I got used to it-I ran a Star for the first 5. 5 years of my truck driving apprenticeship. Mine was horribly rough, loud and crude-but boy was it tough! No shortage of jam either... . it was a strong 4-1/4. But I gotta say I had a hard time getting used to the KW when I got into it-short of glass compared to the old Star (depths of the windshield and side glass were quite a bit shorter-in fact I told my boss it was like sitting at the far end of a culvert trying to see what was going on!). Worse for me because I'm 6'1, I like to have lots of leg room, and my belly sticks out too far so I like to keep my seat back. I had a bad time getting used to having to lean forward to see around the B posts-I know you can get 1/4 windows like the old 5 window Chev pickups but we had twin stacks so all you would have gotten to see was the backside of the muffler. Used to scrub my rearend on the B pillar too getting into the cab-apparently I needed an overdimensional sign... . . The KW dash was hard to get into compared to the Star too-on our Stars anyway the important gauges were all along the top row of the dash-on all our KW's they were scattered because of the dash design. Probably different with the new dash now-I haven't seen one in the flesh yet. You could get used to it-it was just a struggle moving from the 1 truck to the other.



But I love Cat power-if I was ever in the position to be an owner-operator I would settle for nothing else. Up here our GVW's are quite a bit higher than yours-so the engine/driveline weight isn't quite as much a factor. And if I was buying now I'd go for either KW or Pete-resale quite a bit easier and better $$$-wise. I really love the way a 379-129 looks-but a W900L ain't so bad either! Decisions decisions decisions... .



Jason

 

[TPyle]

Unless PACCAR has changed their minds AGAIN Paccar can still get the S60 (btw for 2002 it will have cooled egr/variable nozzel turbo too). DC never said that they would quit selling S60s to PACCAR. PACCAR said that since DC owned competing brands AND an engine that PACCAR uses they did not want they engine. The last that I was told by my Detroit rep was that PACCAR had seen the number of S60 powered trucks that they had sold and decided that it was not worth loosing customers and agreed to offer ther engine.

As far as market/resale goes KW has taken the hardest hit. They have lost approx. 3. 5% market share. Pete has tanked in resale. Western Star is the only brand to have its NADA value increase in the past 2 years (although its still bad too).

As long as I can still get my Cats in a Starcar I will have somthing to sell!!

 

[JHansen]

Actually TPyle you're just the guy I wanted to talk to!

DC stated on the Star website that there were going to be model line cuts across the family..... what's getting chopped out of the Star lineup? See there are no more Heritage cabs-I knew that was coming for a while-they were pretty outclassed by the Constellations. They could cut the whole Sterling line and it wouldn't break my heart any-looked at a new Louisville that the county bought right before Ford sold out to F/L-plastic doors!! Not for this cowboy... .



I really liked the Stars we had-but DC disillusions me to say the least. That's the only reason I would lean towards a PACCAR truck right now-pretty sure of their stability...



Jason

 

[HoleshotHolset]

Excellent replies folks! I'm really getting into the big rig scene..... I have to commend those of you who drive for a living, to some it may seem like an easy job... . but we all know otherwise.



As far as which truck to get..... I'm still researching. I've narrowed it down to either Cat or Cummins (leaning heavily towards Cummins, however... . ) and I really like the newer aerodynamic Kenworth bodies... . and some of the so-called Freightshakers. I'm not a big fan of the cabovers... . too 'boxy' for me.



You all have provided a lot of really valuable information and for that I say a great big thank you!!

The research continues.....



Matt

 

[TPyle]

Jason



The only models in the Western Star line up to get cut are the 5800/5900 Set back aerodynamic/set back axle series. This is no big loss for Star as they were not very popular models anyway. They still make a set back axle truck though. I would like to tell you about Sterling and Freightliner models cuts but I think it best to wait until the news is "out there".

As far as the Heritage cab it left not because of lack of demand. I'm sure there a quite a few die hard small cab fans that won't buy the Constellation. The main reason that it got cut was because of tooling. That cab has been around since the late 60s. Its been on Diamond Reos, Autocars, Whites, and Stars. The cost to retool the line that built the cabs would not be worth the cost. (at least thats my Reps story). And as to WS moving from Kelowna, I'll believe it when I see it!!

 

[kcjayco]

The fact that I work on all three engines, does give some insight into the pro's and con's of each one. I think all three are good engines. They have strong points and weak points. All in all Cat is a good engine. But if I were an owner operator and figured I'd keep it past the warranty period, then no I would not opt for Cat. The power is available in all three in enough quantity.

 

[BCFAST]

Cat Power?

Sorry, but I just dont understand why any of you like Cat. Only drive a couple of them personally, and I didnt like that "cam-y" feeling... besides, the parts are considerably more than Detroit or Cummins. I also notice that, whenever I spy a truck on the roadside with the hood up, it's yellow 9 out of 10 times... . gueranteed! I sure enjoyed my Series 60. Linear power, quiet, great mileage and cheap parts... what's not to love?

 

[Champane Flight]

Depends

It all depends on what you want the truck for. Heavy hauling,off road lumber,long haul,short runs,in city,what payloads,the list goes on and on. I myself for long haul work with max payloads would go Cat C-15 or C-16,15sp,4:10 rears. Probably Freightliner Classic,flattop 60"sleeper. Weight is everything,the less a truck weighs,the more payload,more money!KW tops them all in weight,followed by Pete,and the rest. In todays market it is cheaper to lease new. Not to mention leases are tax deductable!

 

[therabbittree]

hey holeshot. . i too have been looking at a class 8 to have to redo and bring to shows and to use as a back up to make some cash if i get fed up with my regular job. . ha. . my hang up is the insurance cost. . i need full coverage to cover the loan i'll need to buy the truck. . but if it isn't used commercially ie do just drive to shows and for fun i would think insurance would be cheaper. . and if i wanted to go out on my own i would just get the real insurance... any ideas on that or any luck finding info on tha?... i have driven tractor trailer flatbed for a while and more straight log truck with pup or dump with equipt. . i have my A and drive for a living no. . just want to have my own. . kinda like my friends have novas or mustangs . . well i want a truck ha. . later

deo

\x/ hillfolk!

 

[E7mack96]

Why not a Mack???

i haven't seen anyone mention Mack. The engines and drivelines are very durable. I know as I consistantly haul 100,000 lbs in mine (yeah, overweight fines are a PITA). I like the look of the new Vision, but my current setup is a CL 713. Mack retains value quite well, as they are not as popular out there.

 

[HoleshotHolset]

therabbittree:

I'm with you man!! I could not have said that any better if I tried. You're right... all I really want to do is mess around with a class-8 truck, I'm not looking to make loads of $$ or even use it daily, but it would be cool to use as a commuter every once in a while. Not to mention, if I ever get kicked out of the house... I have a little rolling condo!! The insurance, maintenance costs, and registration costs are what are keeping me back..... I can buy the truck, I just can't keep it going. Fuel costs aren't really an issue..... 7mpg loaded or unloaded... I can live with that... . Hell, 460cid F*rd powered pickup trucks get worse gas mileage towing 5000 lbs... . and I can hook up and tow 80,000 lbs and get 7mpg!





E7mack96:

All the Macks I have found are a LOT of $$... . I have a friend that has two brand new ones... . I just can't get over the looks of them... I like the '96+ Freightliners. And as for the Mack engines/drivetrains... . I'd buy anything if I could find evidence that would pursuade me in a manner reasonable enough for me to buy it.



Matt - if it's diesel, I LOVE it!