Damn engine knock (with sound clip)

[EConnelly]

masked profanity

This sounds line mine. This is not the same engine when I bought it. My fuel mileage dropped 18 to 13. 5. The dealer worked on it and the mileage dropped to 11. They worked on it for a week and now it is back up to 13. 5. I have 24000 miles on it and I am the point now that I basically hate my truck and I will never buy or recommend a Dodge Cummins again. For now the dealer wants me to run a couple of tanks through with fuel conditioner in it to clean the injectors. I think STAR is trying to run the warranty out. I am sure they know they got a problem and refuse to accept full responsibility for it. My neighbor Dodge sounds great and that me even more. Contact me in a couple of months, I can't stand this noise I will probably be getting a CHEVY. My buddy is claiming 24 per gallon with his CHEV. #@$%!

 

[macdaddy]

You need to get outta the Dodge!!!!!!

This sounds line mine. This is not the same engine when I bought it. My fuel mileage dropped 18 to 13. 5. The dealer worked on it and the mileage dropped to 11. They worked on it for a week and now it is back up to 13. 5. I have 24000 miles on it and I am the point now that I basically hate my truck and I will never buy or recommend a Dodge Cummins again. For now the dealer wants me to run a couple of tanks through with fuel conditioner in it to clean the injectors. I think STAR is trying to run the warranty out. I am sure they know they got a problem and refuse to accept full responsibility for it. My neighbor Dodge sounds great and that me even more. Contact me in a couple of months, I can't stand this noise I will probably be getting a CHEVY. My buddy is claiming 24 per gallon with his CHEV. #@$%!

Oh yea the chev is the way to go



Mac

 

[ACerf]

I have to say that the "Knocking" is pretty common with the 03 on up. I noticed it on mine after a few thousand miles. But it has never been an issue with the dealers, and as everyone has mentioned, it goes away when put into gear. Sounds better then the Ford Power Strokes!

 

[EConnelly]

Tony T. my family and friends said the same thing about the noise. My buddy didn't like the response I recieved from the different dealership brushing me off on the noise. He bought a Chev just because of the noise and the stock reply from the service mechanics #32 "no abnormal sounds" and #33 "normal". "They all sound like that" to the poor sap like me that thinks he has a noise.

I am running the fuel conditioner through a couple of tanks to try to clean the injectors. I have cut and pasted the excellent posts from TDR on this knocking noise and will be using this information to assist the dealer I working with to solve the problem.

DBURKHARD has the solution and that is going to help me allot.

As far as me getting a CHEV, that is from deep down frustration. I have teeth grinding problem and this knocking noise doesn't help me. When I stop at a traffic light I have to put the transmission in neutral to quiet down knocking rythum and this is a high priority for me to get it fixed.

The first sound clip is a perfect match to my 03.

I wish the post would stick to the apples and leave the oranges out. We are talking about the 03's and up that is having the problems. This noise is serious bussiness to me and there are several others that is having the same problem with the same stock answers coming from STAR. They got a problem and STAR knows it.

Even on it's worst day, my engine is still quieter than a Ford.

 

[Tony T.]

This morning I went to the dealership to talk with the diesel tech that checked out my truck last week. Me and him took a ride and the truck ran flawless no knocking, smooth as silk even I commented to him sounds like a diesel to me,also I said you must think I'm nuts this being the second time you have checked it out. Last night me and the wife went out to eat to a place 27 miles from my home the truck at low rpm pulling up to stop signs,lights,etc and accelerating from knock,knock,knock up to a 1000rpm then fades away. Sounds like someone is beating the crap out of the side of the block with a claw hammer as rbattelle has stated before with his truck in other post. I took it over to the dealership this morning just to talk to and have the tech listen and the knock let me down :-laf . Now this tech seemed to me like a pretty cool guy he told me he was leaving early today, but if I could bring it back next week and plan to leave it a couple days I will go through it checking all the injectors and also try to re-produce what your hearing. I even put it in gear at idle with left foot on the brake and gradually increased throttle with no knock to be heard,before it would really knock hard or loudest at 800-900 rpm, he said lets go for a ride and see if it will do it, we drove through residenal areas real slow, several stop signs,etc nothing no knock, smooth as silk. It's frustrating! it will not knock at the dealership. He did start getting a little technical with me explaining some stuff about the ECM and firing of the injectors an such, he also mentioned about the torque setting on the injectors could be off. All and all he really seemed concerned with my concern or he would have never recommend me to bring it back next week. Mine seems to be really intermediate knock. My mechanic friend has heard it when it was knocking, and said it was not normal that something was out of adjustment, but he does not have the scan tools or what ever to diagnose what it could be, but says it sounds fuel related to him. Hopefully they will pin=point it this next time. My truck has always run good,no white smoke at start up, no codes,no abnormal vibrations, no real drastic drop in mileage either, just a knock that does not sound normal.



Tony

 

[EConnelly]

I ran 2 tanks of fuel using fuel conditioner after the last time I had the engine checked for the knocking noise. I still get 13 to 11 miles per gallon and it still knocks. I will be taking it in again and see where Star wants to go or more than likely not go from here.

 

[Tony T.]

Update: to my "knock" it's gone like a freight train , I took the truck to the dealership Monday 8/1/05 and this being the third trip for the knock issue it finally decide to knock for them. As I pull in the drop off bay the service writer comes out and first thing I said was do you hear that knock, his response was "yes". I heard it knocking before you pulled inside the bay. I told him go get the diesel tech thats been working with it the last two times. He did and first thing the tech said was "yep" thats a injector knock. He then took the truck back to the shop and the service writer proceeded to get me a loaner rental truck to drive. I got a 05 Dodge 1500 4x4 with 1800 miles to drive while my truck was being fixed. They ended up replacing #2 injector, cause leaking injector as stated on the invoice. Got the truck back Wed 8/3/05. My truck never had any white smoke,no codes thrown,and mileage never dropped, well I did detect a very slight mileage drop seems like. Now it sounds like a well tuned sewing machine.



I would like to thank (McKinney Dodge) McKinney,TX for the "no hassle" any time I've shown up with a warranty problem. Even though it was the third visit for the knock issue it just would not produce the knock the first two times for them.



Tony

 

[rbattelle]

Woo hoo! Glad to hear it was resolved.



-Ryan

 

[Cattletrkr]

There are days I'll think to myself, "Dang, this thing's purrin' like a kitten". Then there are days I think I'm back in my old '01. Haven't figured out if it's weather conditions, just my ears, or something else. I've ruled out fuel as a possible source 'cause I've got a tank at home that gets refilled once a month or so from the same source.



Will a goofy injector turn up in an oil analysis? Mine came back with "<1%" which I assume is typical.

 

[rbattelle]

There are days I'll think to myself, "Dang, this thing's purrin' like a kitten". Then there are days I think I'm back in my old '01.

Mine's the same way. 2. 5 years and 48k miles... I don't think it's anything to be concerned with. I think weather has a lot to do with it.



-Ryan

 

[JStieger]

Mine's the same way. 2. 5 years and 48k miles... I don't think it's anything to be concerned with. I think weather has a lot to do with it.



-Ryan

My truck makes the knocking noise too, but it's intermittent. It seems to do it when it's +95* weather though. For example, the past 2 days have been 100*, and knocking sound at every take off.



When I first heard the knock I thought that it was my clutch since the noise occured whenever I let out the clutch with the truck in 2nd gear and came from under the truck around the bellhousing area. It barely made the noise in 1st and never in reverse!



So for grins and giggles I put my transfer case in neutral and then shifted through all the gears at varying rpms and no noise whatsover except in 6th. In 6th gear I had the same knocking sound from the same area, but I could also hear the gears whirring. Also, if I slip the clutch a bit more it knocks more. However, if I kind of dump the clutch and still take off at idle speed, I get no knock. If I drive the truck like a manual gasser by giving a bit of fuel, as low as 50-100 rpms, while letting out the clutch then no noise also. The other interesting thing is that if it was making the knocking sound, I could put the transmission in neutral with clutch out and the noise would get quieter. I could also clutch in and clutch out and make the noise disappear. I could also wiggle the shifter around in neutral against a gear position and make the noise quieter or stop. Weird...



The truck doesn't smoke white clouds (does black though!), mileage hasn't negatively changed, oil analyses are excellent, oil never smelled like fuel, and dynos show no loss in power so I will just monitor the situation.



To me the knock sounds like a 2nd gen CTD or even like the clutch rattle that the early 3rd gens were famous for, including my truck. I'm even beginning to wonder if it's just the gear lash in the transmission with the hot thinned out oil.

 

[TexBamBam]

I got the knock... but it's not predictable... sometimes it does it when pulling, sometimes when coasting, sometimes at idle. But the fuel additive seems to help some... got me what is causing it.

 

[Buffalo]

RBattelle,



In my opinion, it's not weather related.



My '03, HO has "knocked" in temps. from 40 degs. to 118 degs. Humidity and extreme, desert dryness. 1100' elevations & 9500' elevations.



I've been using Primrose 405 fuel additive, for awhile, now. The knocking started well before I started using additives.



Nothing I've tried has helped. Neither has DC. However, the dealer acknowledges the "knock" exists but, it, aparently, does not occur during DC's testing. So, they won't do anything about it.



Joe F. (Buffalo)

 

[rbattelle]

You might be right, Joe. I just don't know. No one seems to...



-Ryan

 

[Grayhackle]

Took mine to the dealer today (Quality Dodge, Tooele, Utah) and they said it was a dirty injector. On previous trucks dodge has refused to replace the injector (s). The mechanic said that dodge says the truck needs heavier use. Like pulling a fifth wheel up Parleys canyon at 70 mph. Also, they sold me an injector cleaner to try. Diesel power injector cleaner. So, I will try that for awhile then take it back in and complain some more.



Also, the truck has 12,678 miles and I have used Stanadyne since new! I am going to find a new additive after I have tried the dealer stuff. Label says it is made by the makers of StaBil and Heet.

 

[betterthanstock]

As I've posted here before, my truck did that for about 1000 mi before I noticed it getting louder. Knowing that my dealer is a pain to deal with, I spent about $5 on a bottle of injector cleaner (forgot the brand, at Walmrt made for both gassers and diesel) and dumped it into about 3/4 of a tank. I also dumped in a quart of type F ATF, and a dose of Powerservice, and at first, nothing. I then continued with a quart of 30W non-detergent for a couple more fuel tanks, and it has disaapeared. Have noticed that after a fillup, it feels less powerful without that 30W, so now I routinely use it, and the engine is quieter than when new, and feels like it has way more power. I think it also lubricates the upper cylinders better, gets better mileage and probably less blowby too.

 

[jungledave]

Well I would say that one injector is sounding more like a 2nd gen and I sure think it is wrong. Sounds much better after injector replacement. My 05 sounds very much like yours in second sound bite.

 

[Kday]

I've got a knock that is intermittent but definitely there, I also have a lot of smoke on light acceleration until the boost comes on. My commute to work is about 80 mi. of 70 -75 mph cruise control, when I get off on my exit and accelerate hard my truck smokes like I have injectors and a chip with no extra power. It's strange that under light throttle for a long period of time would cause this, it never did it before. I can duplicate a knock-bad with the engine in neutral and rev it up to about 2K and let it idle down. It knocks and kind of clears up after a while. So far I changed the fuel filter, made it a little better and have run numerous tanks of power kleen, lucas through it and taken it to the dealer with the same story of "there's nothing wrong with it". I'm going to take it in and demand a full injector test as the last time I think they just drove it around, I picked up the truck after they closed and didn't talk to the writer. I'm getting tired of going to pass vehicles and dumping out a cloud of smoke with a truck with no guts. I just don't have time to leave my truck with them to play with.

 

[mysteryman]

strange knock....

Hi Dan, I listened to your knock... I have the same one. Mine is a LOT more faint than yours... If I had a new truck and it sounded like that I would be major ****** and they would be fixing it or taking the truck back...



I would recommend taking the truck to a cummins service center... . The dealer guys are not going to help you..... they do not know how to fix diesels... . they never break ..... hence they never get to work on them enough to learn them.

I took mine into 5 different cummins dealers in 5 different states... . They all said that it was normal... BS... . I said ... None of my other 5 make this noise...

They then said that I have too good of ears..... I am sure this is true! I was an automotive engineer half of my life. I don't miss much... .

I decided after getting to my shop in Md. that I was going to find it hell or high water... . The first thing I did was change the injectors... It was time anyway after 230,000 mi. The sound got a bit fainter... . Still annoyed..... I ran it and cracked loose each injector line to see if it would disappear... . No luck due to my knock being so faint. . I then did a compression test ... . #3 cylinder was 50 lbs higher than the rest... . There was the problem... ... #3 was hitting harder than the rest and I could hear it... . The stethoscope confirmed it also...

Now why was it happening????? I suspect that # 3 injector was dripping for a long time. . I believe this caused an excess amount of carbon to build up in the combustion chamber causing the compression to be raised... ... Then each time that cyl fired it made a louder knock than the other five cylinders... ... . Under a load it got louder... . Most that listened to it could not even hear it... . but I could... .



other things that cause excess carbon in one cyl. are leaking valve seals, leaking rings or a burned piston ring land.....



Mechanical things that could cause the knock are , loose flywheel bolts , piston rock or slap,



The knock you have sounds like a combustion knock..... the first thing to do is to buy a stethoscope... ... they sell them at harbor freight tools online for about 5 bucks and they work quite well. Put the probe on each cyl and listen for one cyl that is louder than the other.....



Another thing to do is get a temp crayon and put mark on each exhaust port. start the engine and see which mark melts first... . if it is carbon build up or a dripping injector . The cyl knocking will be the hottest running cyl... Raytech makes a point and shop temp gauge that will work as well. I still prefer the heat crayon personally.....



The next thing to do is start the engine put the parking brake on and put it in gear so you can hear the knock clearly... Then crack loose each injector line loose one at a time and see if it goes away... if it does the line you cracked loose that made it stop is the cyl causing the trouble.



The last thing to do is a compression test... they SHOULD all be about the same if the engine was built to spec ... Cummins told me that they see as much as 75 psi difference in their reman engines... . don't buy it... its BS ... tell them to give you an engine that was built with the proper balance and or cc volume in each combustion chamber... All cylinders will hit the same if they all have the same cc volume in each of the chambers!



Please let me know what you find... . your knock is loud enough that it can be found easier than mine was. . Mine has nearly gone away now but I do want to find it once and for all..... Your knock sounds exactly as mind did . Yours is just 10 tomes louder... ...



Does yours get louder when you are towing a load??? mine does but not much. Good luck and please stay in touch... ///Terry PM me if you want my phone #

Half the people here say the truck sound normal and the other half say it sounds like crap... ... .



I took the truck in this morning and the service writer said "sounds like a diesel to me". I'll have to wait and see what the mechanic has to say about it.



The engine NEVER knocked like this before and sounded exactly the same whether in park or loaded with the transmission in drive.



Dan

 

[rbattelle]

I ran it and cracked loose each injector line to see if it would disappear



Then crack loose each injector line loose one at a time and see if it goes away...

Terry, do you own an '03-up truck? If so this is EXTREMELY dangerous... there's even a big sticker on the valve cover telling you not to do this.



Please please please be careful if you're going to crack open common-rail injector lines on a running engine! Better yet, don't do it at all!



-Ryan