Death Threats....

[Wheezy]

A few weeks back I recieved a voicemail from a guy that I don't see eye to eye with... . It has gotten a little more serious, so I went to the police, they pretty much didn't care, they said it wasn't worth the time or money that would be spent dealing with it since the guy has a clean record.

He has a CCW permit, and carries 2 handguns. He is on Prozac, so I am not too sure about his mental state. Our paths cross occasionally... . I grew up around firearms, and have multiple handguns, assault rifles, and shotguns, but I don't have a CCW permit. What would you do?

I am not afraid of him. If he were to pull a weapon on me, I would tell him to use it, and make sure he had good aim/enough rounds. I am not trying to sound like a badass, but I have a very clear mind when it comes to these types of things, and I fully believe whatever happens, happens for a reason. This may sound stupid, or like I am some sort of homicidal maniac... But what would you say if someone pulled a gun on you... . while unarmed?

Anyway, thanks for any and all input you may have-





John

 

[ndurbin]

I'd start carrying a handgun with me, whats the worst they're (the police) going to do if he pulls a gun and starts shooting at you and you shoot back? If the police won't protect ya then portect yourself.

 

[Mbalice]

He has a CCW permit, and carries 2 handguns. He is on Prozac, so I am not too sure about his mental state.



John

Not sure, but I though if a person is on depression drugs (prozac) or has a restraining oders against them, the CCW is void, this might work in you favor but I would check your local laws.





M

 

[MKinner]

first thing that i would do is get my concealed weapons permit. then you can at least show the police that you are permitted, if it should ever come to that. i've delt with a couple people on prozac and i can't imagine them with a gun. that would be enough to make me carry.

 

[AfterBurner]

"don't carry a knife to gun fight"



I know this is serious but I can't help it I have to say it:

"If you can't Dodge it, Ram it"

 

[Boomer II]

I'm thinking with a little foot work you can get his permit yanked. I'd find a sheriff or go to the DPS and tell them what's going on. I'd get a permit, but carry anyway now, better judged by tweleve than carried by six.

 

[MFalkinham]

If he's mentally unstable and off his meds, then he will still carry even if you manage to have his permit revoked. Apply for your own CCW permit, but even if you don't get it I'd still consider packing for protection under these circumstances.



Also, you mentioned you have a voicemail from him. If he threatened you in this message, make an audiotape copy and give it to someone you can trust. I'd also try for a restraining order if you have such proof of his threats. God forbid if something were happen to you, the DA might be able to use the tape as evidence against him so he can't hurt anyone else.



Watch your back, and God bless.



- Mike

 

[Wheezy]

I have a digital copy of the threats... . So at least I have that taken care of. I appreciate everyones comments. I have already started carrying my Glock





John

 

[dalton4]

It would be nice if your trip to the police was a recorded complaint and not an "off the record" info gathering trip. This would show lawful actions by you to get help in correcting the problem.



The voice mail would be valuable in proving your case for self protection since the cops can't or won't help. This and the above complaint record would be to your benefit if you had to face a jury.



I would get the CCW training and start packing. From what I hear, this training will fully explain the lawful use of deadly force for self protection in your state. If possibe, I would also try to stay away from this loose nut and not do anything to fan the flames. You should always think, talk and act in a way that will be to your legal advantage.



Good luck and take care.



Jerry

 

[MFalkinham]

You should always think, talk and act in a way that will be to your legal advantage.



Jerry

What Jerry posted here is key in the event you do have to use deadly force. Let's say he does come after you with a gun, and you are forced to shoot him dead. Never use the word "kill" in any statements to him, bystanders, the police, etc. The DA and his family lawyer will use that word against you in court. Always use statements like "I felt that my life was in danger and fired to defend myself" or "I used my weapon as a last resort to protect myself". Saying something like "I had to kill him" would have a very negative impact with a jury.



Just something that I was told during a handgun training seminar once.



- Mike

 

[Mike Ellis]

You need to go to the cops and swear out a complaint, if you have him on tape making a death threat that is a CRIME and his CCW license is going to go bye-bye. But ONLY if you swear out a complaint.



PS - You ask what would I say if I was unarmed and somebody pulled a gun on me? "DON'T SHOOT!" :-laf Seriously, your best bet if somebody has a gun on you, is to try to talk calmly and defuse the situation, say whatever you have to in order to keep from getting shot. Remember, to kill you he has to exert less than 10 lbs of pressure over less than 1/2" of distance, to disarm him you will have to move much more weight over a MUCH longer distance - which action do YOU think can be accomplished FASTER? If you can distract him, you may (stress "may") be able to act before he can fire, best bet is to focus on levering the gun away from him - grab quickly and force out of line with your body, use mechanical advantage to lever the gun up and out of the hand by grabbing the barrel. Unfortunately this takes strength, and luck. Not to mention if the fellow has 2 guns, taking one away will only make things even - you must be prepared to end the conflict.



Life isn't like the movies, if you want to see how well disarming somebody works, give a buddy a paintball gun, let him cock it and hold it on you, and see if you can grab it away from him before he splats you. Not easy, unless you have the reflexes of a Bruce Lee. If you want to try the TV "take away the knife" routine, give your buddy a red permanent marker to hold like a knife, and see if you can get it away from him without getting touched.



Saying everything happens for a reason, is a cop-out. You probably don't play Russian roulette, do you? If you won't gamble with your life when there ISN'T a threat, why gamble with it when there IS? Take precautions, live to fight another day.

 

[RankRam]

Mike Ellis, that was a great post!

 

[Wheezy]

You need to go to the cops and swear out a complaint, if you have him on tape making a death threat that is a CRIME and his CCW license is going to go bye-bye. But ONLY if you swear out a complaint.



PS - You ask what would I say if I was unarmed and somebody pulled a gun on me? "DON'T SHOOT!" :-laf Seriously, your best bet if somebody has a gun on you, is to try to talk calmly and defuse the situation, say whatever you have to in order to keep from getting shot. Remember, to kill you he has to exert less than 10 lbs of pressure over less than 1/2" of distance, to disarm him you will have to move much more weight over a MUCH longer distance - which action do YOU think can be accomplished FASTER? If you can distract him, you may (stress "may") be able to act before he can fire, best bet is to focus on levering the gun away from him - grab quickly and force out of line with your body, use mechanical advantage to lever the gun up and out of the hand by grabbing the barrel. Unfortunately this takes strength, and luck. Not to mention if the fellow has 2 guns, taking one away will only make things even - you must be prepared to end the conflict.



Life isn't like the movies, if you want to see how well disarming somebody works, give a buddy a paintball gun, let him cock it and hold it on you, and see if you can grab it away from him before he splats you. Not easy, unless you have the reflexes of a Bruce Lee. If you want to try the TV "take away the knife" routine, give your buddy a red permanent marker to hold like a knife, and see if you can get it away from him without getting touched.



Saying everything happens for a reason, is a cop-out. You probably don't play Russian roulette, do you? If you won't gamble with your life when there ISN'T a threat, why gamble with it when there IS? Take precautions, live to fight another day.

I agree... Great post :--)



You have a lot of useful info that I am going to use to my advatage..... Staying away from him being the first



Thanks, and keep it coming-



John

 

[Philip]

After you file the complaint with the police dept. Contact the local D/A and make sure he is aware of this issue also. The police might blow it off. The local D/A most likely will not.



Get your CCW. Untill that time about all you can do is be watchfull. Keep a close eye on your surroundings. Watch for him. If you see him go another way. Try to avoid contact.



If contact happens. At that point it might get bad. If your not armed and he has any distance to use a firearm you could get hurt. The key word is distance. Close up you might have a chance. Out of arms reach you better be moving fast and low. If you can get within arms reach you stand a better chance of walking away. Remember a broken collar bone will render that arm useless. Plus it requires less force than trying to break a jaw.



I hope you do not have to use any of these suggestions. Good luck

 

[merryman]

Such threats MIGHT lead to an effort to carry them out, but it is pretty unlikely.

Over 30+ years as a trial judge handling thousands of criminal cases, I have received dozens to hundreds of threats on my life--many by convicted felons; There has been only one half serious effort to carry one out.

While I try to be pretty aware of what is going on around me, and, yes, I do generally carry, I really just ignor them.



Vaughn

 

[MrWinkey]

If he leaves you another message on your answering machine go get a restraining order and be done with it.



I think any Judge with half a brain heard a tape or something like that he would grant you one. Then like others have said Document Document Document.



Never say ANYTHING about killing. Just say you felt your life was in danger and you felt the need to defend yourself and your family.



If possible try and defuse the situation. Record the call then call him up and tell him he's taking this way too far and it's not that big of a deal Yada yada yada that way you have something else. Give that tape to a friend.



Good luck and if he's got a gun I would do most anything he says cept go with him. If he asks for $$ give it to em car keys no problem but dont get into a car or go somewhere remote with him of your own will. Really bad idea.

 

[Dull Pain]

Counter INTIMIDATION works really well!!!

 

[ToolManTimTaylor]

Remember if his CCW permit is revoked that does NOT mean it's over!!! That card does not grant you access to your weapon it just tells the LAW you can Carry your CONCEALED weapon LEGALY. So keep your guard up either until this is resolved (Hopefully Peacefully) or is dealt with leagaly. Remember:



There are NO such things as LEGAL CRIMINAL actions or intentions.



So being this guy is prozacin' and packin' I would make this a top priority in your life's path at the moment.



TMTT



Your fellow . 45 glockster and beretta boy.

 

[DarrellB]

Don't carry just one pistol, get you a good backup as well.



I carry a Commandar sized 1911 in . 45 and also a nice little KelTec . 380 on the ankle. The one thing you have to remember is all the guns in the world will do you no good if you can't use them. Take your carry guns and shoot them and shoot them often. Doesn't have to be a 25 to 50 yards, but get up close say 10 to 30' and get good with them. Get some snap caps and practice drawing the weapon from the holster you will use with a loaded mag. Know those guns inside and out, so if it does come down to it, you know how they will work and how you will respond. I'm so comfortable with carrying now that I sometimes forget and still have my pistol on my person while relaxing around the house. Also get a good scatter gun for the house, nothing better than a good 12ga. shotgun for home intruders.



Double Tap Center Mass and One to the Head for Good Meassure.



D

 

[Sled Puller]

Double Tap Center Mass and One to the Head for Good Meassure.



D

I HOPE that would be sufficient for most intruders!! :--)