Death Wobble Gone

[TexBamBam]

Got rid of the BFG 315's and replaced them with the MTR 37" tires and the DW is gone... . WOW. Thanks for all the info on this. Oo.

 

[SHyans]

Hey Tex-

Just joined TDR. My main motivation was I started the "death wobble" a few hundred miles ago. Dealer replaced right side upper and lower ball joints, drag link ends and track bar (9/21/04) and then left side ball joint and steering dampener (10/04/04) after I took it back because the death wooble wasn't fixed. Test drove today but I've lost all confidence in this thing. I have BFG All Terrain 315's, what gives?

 

[rbattelle]

Hey Tex-

Just joined TDR. My main motivation was I started the "death wobble" a few hundred miles ago. Dealer replaced right side upper and lower ball joints, drag link ends and track bar (9/21/04) and then left side ball joint and steering dampener (10/04/04) after I took it back because the death wooble wasn't fixed. Test drove today but I've lost all confidence in this thing. I have BFG All Terrain 315's, what gives?

One theory on the DW is the sidewall on the BFG's being D-rated and hence not strong enough (not enough plies) to cope with the massive front end weight (>4000 lb).

 

[SHyans]

Great... . what's another threory so I can save my dealer some money... WTF doesn't the dealer know this???? The DEATH WOBBLE has made me crap my pants three times now.

 

[SHyans]

While I wait for more info from other DW victims, let me clarify that the DW as I know it is an inconsistent massive vibration in the front end that happens at between 55-65mph. It almost yanks the wheel out of my hand and feels like the front wheels are bouncing 6 inches off the ground.

Is this the DW as others know it?

 

[TAlens]

living in fear!?

hey guys, new member here w/'04 reg cab l/b 4x4. i installed BFG 315's shortly after purchase and have had no problems. did NOT lift truck. a little careful body work on the lower rear corner of fender and they clear fine even on uneven ground. everytime i read about this issue i get a little nervous! wondering, of those with the problem, how many have modified the suspension?

 

[SHyans]

All I have is a leveling kit.

"FEAR"? You bet. When this thing starts to buck at 65 mph it feels like time to bend over and kiss your ass goodbye.

 

[JDerbedrossian]

never had a problem with level kit/315's, and still have no problems with 4 inch lift, 24000 miles. actually all of the problems that have been posted ive never had one except window tint scratch.

 

[Yo Hoot]

I have H2 wheels and BFG 315's. After installin a 2" leveling kit I got the death wobble.



After adding some caster the wobble dissappeared.



The experts keep repeating... ... alignment and caster is key to eliminating DW. It worked for me.

 

[DJOliver]

I'm wondering if it is all based on caster. I have no death wobble but as soon as I put on 315's I got my front end aligned__just lucky so far???????? Should I go back down a size before problems start???????????

 

[rbattelle]

I'm wondering if it is all based on caster. I have no death wobble but as soon as I put on 315's I got my front end aligned__just lucky so far???????? Should I go back down a size before problems start???????????

I wouldn't take the step of changing back to stock tire size, but perhaps to be on the "safe side" save your stock tires.

 

[DPelletier]

While I wait for more info from other DW victims, let me clarify that the DW as I know it is an inconsistent massive vibration in the front end that happens at between 55-65mph. It almost yanks the wheel out of my hand and feels like the front wheels are bouncing 6 inches off the ground.

Is this the DW as others know it?

Yep.





Dave

 

[SHyans]

After adding some caster the wobble dissappeared.



Sorry but what the hell is "caster"...

 

[DPelletier]

All I have is a leveling kit.

"FEAR"? You bet. When this thing starts to buck at 65 mph it feels like time to bend over and kiss your ass goodbye.

OK, I'll spout my beliefs on the DW once again;



- The DW is caster shimmy as Yo Hoot has suggested. A number of things can set off caster shimmy IF the underlying conditions are met (i. e. suspension geometry and caster settings). Such things are;

- worn suspension components such as ball joints, tie rods, steering box, etc. etc.

- worn steering damper

- soft tires (load range D and low air pressure)



I think you'll find that as you research the issue, a large number of DW trucks have had the 2" leveling kit. This kit changes the factory caster settings setting the condition for DW IF one or more of the "path of least resistance" issues are also present. Of course those people installed the 2" leveling kit for a reason; to install larger tires. The most popular tire: BFG 315 load range D tire (max 65psi). It's my theory and I'm sticking to it.



Dave

 

[DPelletier]

After adding some caster the wobble dissappeared.



Sorry but what the hell is "caster"...

Caster is the angle between the upper and lower ball joints looking at the truck from the side. Positive caster has the upper ball joint ahead of the lower. Picture a shopping cart wheel.



Dave

 

[Yo Hoot]

Caster is an alignment term for the angle of the centerline of the upper and lower ball joint, looking at the side of the truck.



Typically they set the upper ball joint back some with respect to the lower joint.

Adjustment is facilitated by shortning or lengthening the lower control arm which

rotates the axle.



Picture having the ball joints totally horizontal. Basically like the hinge of a box lid. The weight of the truck would cause the wheels to fold up.



Now picture the ball joints at a 45 degree angle. They still want to fold but the face forward mostly. Just like a door with a hinge thats not plumb. Gravity tries to swing it.



Now picture your ball joints as you would expect, high and low. A door that is stable and doesn't try to open or close in any position. Without the tie rods the wheels would flop out or in depending on where they are from the start when you started moving.



What designers found is if you tilt the axis back some, you induce a tendancy for the wheel to try and fold together at the front... . just from the weight of the vehicle.



This is what causes your steering wheel to snap back to center when you let go of the wheel.



By adding a spacer lift, the axle drops, which really is a pivot around the anchor points of the upper and lower control arms. This geometrically reduces caster. You have to put it back by adjusting the lower arms so they are longer. There are eccentric adjuster on the front parts of the two lower arms.

 

[SHyans]

Stupid Questions?

Why did my dealer replace both ball joints, drag link ends, steering dampner, track bar, etc in an attempt to fix the DW?. Did I trash them with the 315's? I had 3000 miles on the 315's before the DW started.

Is the DW not going to cease until I do the caster fix? I am heading out to fish for the day tomorrow and that's when I plan a road test to find out if the dealers replacement of the ball joints and stuff was their guesswork or a fix.

Should I write my will before I head out?

Who should I have do the caster fix?

Why didn't the dealer know about this?

Pray for me! :--)

 

[DPelletier]

Stupid Questions?

Why did my dealer replace both ball joints, drag link ends, steering dampner, track bar, etc in an attempt to fix the DW?. Did I trash them with the 315's? I had 3000 miles on the 315's before the DW started.

Is the DW not going to cease until I do the caster fix? I am heading out to fish for the day tomorrow and that's when I plan a road test to find out if the dealers replacement of the ball joints and stuff was their guesswork or a fix.

Should I write my will before I head out?

Who should I have do the caster fix?

Why didn't the dealer know about this?

Pray for me! :--)

DW probably isn't really good for those parts you mention, but I suspect they just don't know what's causing it so they are replacing the parts they think could be causing the problem. I think your DW may indeed be "gone" after replacing these parts BUT unless the underlying cause is repaired, the DW may be only dormant (waiting for something to wear to provide the "path of least resistance I referred to earlier), not gone forever. I would have a reputable alignment shop adjust the caster properly. DC's manuals give them too wide a range (like 4 - 6 deg. for example). A member who is an alignment guru posted what I believe to be the proper settings a while back. Sorry, I didn't write them down so you'll have to do a search.



Good luck,



Dave

 

[amsoilman]

All I have is a leveling kit.

"FEAR"? You bet. When this thing starts to buck at 65 mph it feels like time to bend over and kiss your ass goodbye.

My Grandson's 03' has had the DW for some time now, and just this past week had the service manager ride with him. It happened, and they took the truck in and changed both front hubs, track bar, all 4 ball joints all 4 link bars, bith front shocks, and the steering dampner. Took it back out and it still had the DW. Then they took truck in and removed the 2 inch spacers, and they have not been able to get the DW back! The truck has the original tires on, and has just over 37,000 miles. Dealer is now claiming the 2 inch puc's was causing the problem. However, Dealer also said DC is looking into this problem, so apparantly they have had otheres that have domne the same.



I might add, the only way they can get this thing to DW, is to drive fast... ... ... ... over 75 MPH.



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[TexBamBam]

OK... I know it may be the lift kit... but why did it go away when I went to the MT/R's??? Can ayone explain that? I had no problem with the BFG's for about 30,000 miles... but when I went over 30 the DW started. It's gone now, I have tested it down the same patch of road where I always got the DW with the BFG's. So I know for certain it is the BFG's. Perhaps they just wore out faster and the side walls got week.