Diesel gelling in the cold?

[Dbonzi]

This is the first winter for me owning the mighty Cummins. Can any of you tell me what temp. I will have to worry about the fuel gelling. If it does gell can I change fuel filters and run long enough to get to a fuel station?

 

[SteveH]

Its sure a lot easier and less worry to start running a 50/50 mix of #1 and #2 about this time of the year. When the temps drop in the teens, I run straight #1 and do this the rest of the winter. you will notice a little loss in power and mileage. Temps up here drop into the -20 to -35 range every winter, and I use my truck everyday. So far I have never had a gelling problem. If you really want numbers, I could get this from our engineers next week when I go back to work. The first step the diesel takes is to cloud up. The second stage of this process is the gelling. The actual pour point is important because if you go below this, you will probably gel-up.

Steve H.

 

[illflem]

#2 diesel begins gelling at +10°F, most stations provide a winter blend without even telling you starting about this time of year. I quit using the blend about 8 years ago and opted for straight #2 adding my own anti-gel additive, I use Howe's. There are many other additives that work just as well. With the #1/2 blend you will get worse fuel economy and performance. Never had a gel problem using Howe's, but I live in the warm part of Montana, it only gets down to -30° here.

Go here for everything you ever wanted to know about diesel fuels, blending and additives. Check out the section- LOW TEMPERATURE OPERABILITY

 

[Swamp Donkey]

-40 I have been through quite a lot. Around here the fuel stations pretty much take care of things. We have to put trust in them that they are running the right grade of diesel. Never had a problem, but I do use howes diesel fuel conditioner, so maybe that is doing the trick!

 

[JJW_ND]

Straight #2 and additives is all thats needed!

I think MT, ND and MN all pretty similar COLD weather. Just lasts alittle longer for some of us. I too was very concerned the first winter with my 96 (Winter of 96-97 BTW). I starting pulling trailers back from KS then and drove many miles all night on "southern" straight #2.



Once driving or if starting with warm fuel (above 30) I would not worry about gelling unless you are driving through temps below -40 (without the wind). I have tested 10s of 1000s of miles down to -35 on straight 2 and no additives. This staight fuel does gell based on all the Fords I see setting along side the road on those days. Our trucks have an fuel heater on the filter that will "help" with "thick" fuel. Also, Cummins engines return lots of heated fuel (especially the 12V pumps) to the tank. This is what will keep you going.



It is when your truck is going to sit all night or all weekend out in -10 or colder that #2 will not cut it. I have not had any problems down to -5 on #2 no additives, no blend, here in ND.



In all three states, Cenex at its bigger stations sells #1, #2 , Roadmaster Premium #2 and Manybe Wintermaster #2. All #2 fuels have to be in underground tanks to pump below zero. Stations with only above ground tanks usually have to switch to blends because of this. Most big trucks have fuel heating systems and have no interest in the more expensive #1 and the less mpg. Thus #2 (unblended) is availble yearound. Here is a web site with the specifications of all Cenex fuels http://www.cenex.com/default.asp?item=6A60B18E-515F-4763-A4B6-C40391A007A3



I drive my truck every day. It is garaged at night but sits out all day. It also has made dozens a straight through round trips each year to KS pulling trailers back. All nighters, mostly in the winter. I only use Cenex Roadmaster #2. I add Stanadyne PF additive IF my truck will have set out OVERNIGHT in temps below -10. I have NOT bought or used any #1 since the first winter of 96/97. I have ran Stanadyne and #2 the last 4 winters. Last December the average daily temp was minus something f&*%ing cold everyday for the entire month. I have burned over 15,000 gallons through my truck.



In the States mentioned above..... burning straight #1 or even 50:50 in a Cummins is like changing oil every 2 or 3,000 miles. It might make you feel good but it is really overkill.



jjw

ND

 

[Dbonzi]

Thanks for all the replys, You guys are the greatest. The people on this site are a wealth of knowledge.

 

[JohnE]

We burned #2 fuel in our shop year around for years. The tank was above ground and stood outside. The secret was a ¾" pipe from the tank that ran 1 foot or so inside. That was enough to thaw the wax and not cause any winter heating problems. I don't think the new owners have changed anything.



I ran #2 with plenty of Howe's Diesel Treat last winter. It chugged pretty good on the cold days, but not from waxed fuel.



My brother lives in the balmy Teton foothills of Idaho. He uses Penray products in his menagerie of diesel powered equipment.



This winter? I'm adding a new ESPAR heater. It will help the cold engine. I still plan on the #2 and Howe's.



Dbonzi, remove your radiator fan! It did that last weekend. It is the nicest thing you can do to the truck in the cool months. 2 posters <font size=1>(I won't mention JJW &amp; illflem )</font> here are the ones that talked me into removing the fan. I suprised they didn't add the same message to you. That and a cold front will help, too.



-John

 

[Dbonzi]

JohnE:

How does removing the fan help if the thermostat is working? Can you tell a difference in how fast it warms up. And will this help with the gelling problem.

By the way what is the espar heater?



Dennis Bolduan

 

[Blakers]

I have run all kinds of diesels all my life and only once had any trouble with gelling. That was one day in 1980 on my way to college in Bradford, Pa. with my 1967 Benz. It was -20° F in the valleys and -30° F on the hilltops.



She just lost all power and would not pull a load at all, but she was getting enough fuel to idle and I could move slowly in low gear.



I called my room mate and he towed me the remaining 40 miles with his pickup. The next day it warmed up a little and the Benz started right up. Never had that problem again.



Blake

 

[JJW_ND]

Fanless to only way to Go!

Dennis, the radiators are almost overkill on these trucks, especially in the winter. T-Stats on the 12V motors run cooler then the 24V and with either are probably closed all the time most of the winter (unless towing). Their is not much heat generated running empty and even worse when idling around town. When cold out (I know it gets cold in MN), and pulling off the Interstateand idling even just a few minutes drops the coolant temps ASAP.



Like some have said, The heater core is probaly enough cooling in the winter months.



Removing the fan helps warm up quicker, slows cool down when stopped. And best of all makes the truck much quieter.



THe only thing to be aware of, is the AC system. If you select defrost you need to be moving or your system will overpresure. I used the trick posted on Fritzs site to disable the AC on all level settings with the 94 - 97 HVAC controls. THe only time the AC compressor kicks in now is when I selct the AC fan speed options. I go fan less from September to May here in ND. I only put it back in what I need to use the summer AC. I have pulled stock trailers in 80 degree weather without a fan and the coolant temps are the same as w/ a fan just have the noise.



The guys running Horton fans proably notice how little the Horton kicks in even in the summer. AC will kick it in way before coolant temps will.



Take it off your will like it.



jjw

ND

 

[JohnE]

Dennis;

I tried posting a reply last night but my keyboard stopped talking to the computer. It was restart and post or shutdown and get some sleep. Sorry, you lost.



JJW got all the benfits of being fanless. The only disadvantage I notice in fanless is that the engine cools FASTER. The only way I can figure that is that my fan clutch may be defective and drawing a lot of parasitic power. Still my mpg is mid 20's grossing 8k so I'm open to suggetions.



<a href=http://espar.com target=_blank>Espar</a> is a supplemental heater system for engines. This unit draws fuel from the tank. It can be triggered by a timer or remote control (optional).

I started the install process this week (ok, I just bought the kit). I'm keeping a photo journal of the whole process and will post my diary on <a href=http://nwbombers.com/ target=_blank>NWBomers</a>.



-John



edit:

Removing the fan will probably not help in reducing winter gell. It will help in other ways. Fixing a know winter gell requires lots of anti-gel, blended fuel, or fixing the fuel preheater (they do go bad).

 

[Jeff H]

No gelly for me..

Where's that town yer from? Never heard of it. I'm an hour west of the TC.

I've been running #2 with antigell in it. But latley its become more scarce. New owners of fuel stations means changes. I've never gelled up yet. Get some anti gell additives for just incase. I oredered those winter cold fronts from Eric Buckle form this sight. They look better than that big heavy vinyl cover I once used.

 

[boathead]

Stanadyne Performance Formula

I've been using the Stanadyne Performance Formula for the last three winters and have noticed a great improvement in cold starts, even down to 0 degrees without plugging in the block heater. It also seems to help with power, although mileage is unchanged. Diesel Injection Service carries it and they seem to have the best prices, about $4 a pint(enough for two tankfuls).





http://www.dieselpage.com/add1.htm

 

[Taz]

to the post about changing oil every 3000 miles

It actually does help. It's true the oil can handle many more miles. But you have to also take into account that oil is also the sewage system of your engine. So changing your oil regular helps to keep it clean on the inside. Condensation can form on the inside of a hot engine as it cools down, therefore a moisture build up will cause sludge. Changing your oil helps to reduce the crud build up in the engine.