Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Diesel quality

[Tractorat]

The Shell station down the street where I usually buy diesel has become an arco. For gasoline, I normally buy top tier (shell, 76, dhevron etc) rather than 7 eleven, gas n go, etc. Ive always heard from folks with credentials that, in the long run, the top tier gas is better for my gas powered car because of the additives etc.



Here is my question. The "new" arco does sell diesel. Is there a difference between arco diesel and, say, shell diesel ? Are the additive differences ? I think it all comes from the same refinery around here, with the additives (at least for gas) added when it goes to the delivery truck.



I hope someone in the fuel industry might be able to help here.



Thanks,

TRat

 

[HBarlow]

TRat,

Diesel fuel is a commodity very similar to corn or grain. The consumer can't determine which farmer grew the corn or grain and the consumer can't tell who refined his diesel fuel. It would be very difficult if not impossible to tell the difference between Shell's fuel and Arco's.

There have been similar discussions in years past here in the TDR site and some knowledgeable people have contributed. If you could trace the diesel fuel sold by each retailer back to where it was loaded into a fuel tanker truck it is very common to find tankers from various companies loading fuel at the same wholesale distributor's pumps. It is also common to find that an independent fuel hauler hauls the same fuel from the same wholesaler to Shell, Arco, Chevron, etc.

If there is a refinery in Washington it probably sells fuel to a wholesaler who sells it to truck stops and gas stations under various brand signs.

Clean diesel fuel purchased from dealers who sell huge volumes of fuel and keep their filters clean is important, brand name is usually of little or no importance.

 

[Tractorat]

Thanks,

I thought that was the case with diesel. My son in law has done testing on gasoline because of his business, and has found differences from station to station in ethanol content. And there is a difference in the additives in gas. But, I wasnt sure if the same was true for diesel.

 

[Diesel Gunner]

Have you ever wondered why diesel fuel from different Branded Gas Stations is different colors? Sometimes it is somewhat yellow, or green, or clear.



That is because they have different additives that are proprietary to their Brand and helps them to identify their fuel (it is only dye, not the additives themselves). I will not say that the differences are large, but they are there. The first example that comes to mind is Chevron Diesel with Techron.



Branding is very important to these types of companies. If it makes a difference in performance can be argued by the PHD's that formulate them and the consumers till the cows come home. It is sort of like the kind of whiskey you like and I like, if they are different. Unless your buying I will drink mine and you are welcome to join me if I offer.

 

[champspa]

from the information at the stations where I get fuel the only one around here that is different is BP . there fuel is 50 cetane and the rest are 40. I can get more mileage at a BP but it's not worth the difference in price.

 

[jgillott]

My area is dominated by Sunoco stations. There are a few others including a BP and a Shell I believe. From what I understand, as others here have said, all of the base fuel stock comes from the same depot about 30 miles north of here with the additive packages added as they are loaded on the trucks. We also have several Sheetz convinence stores. I believe that their fuel is sourced at a different location, but I am not sure of where that is located.



The Sunoco that I usually buy from is a high volume dealer. A little while back, they had some underground tank issues. Even though they are fixed, I've wanted to wait a few weeks before buying there again just to be safe. So, I've purchased the last few tanks from our local Sheetz. I'd love to know what they use as an additive package that differs from the Sunoco. That fuel seems to really quiet the injectors down. I can't really comment on any difference in fuel mileage since I always loose a little on winter fuel but it sure has a noticeable difference in sound/feel.

 

[RustyJC]

Just to relate a situation that happened to us with our 2002 Ram that is pretty positive proof that not all diesel fuel is created equal.



We were in Nashville, TN getting ready to head back from an iRV2 National Rally pulling our 5th wheel RV. I filled up at a station (can't remember the name) near our campground that had a diesel pump sitting off by itself away from everything else. On the run out of Nashville, the Cummins was clattering so loudly that we had to yell to talk to each other - it was literally deafening! We stopped for lunch in West Memphis, AR and filled up at the Flying J. Within 5 miles of getting back on I-40, the Cummins had quietened down and everything was back to normal.



Obviously, the cetane rating must have been really crappy on the load of fuel I picked up in Nashville.



Rusty

 

[Bob Cochran]

Cetane rating is the reason for better performance and mileage. A lot of the other reason are a lot in ones mind while not all of course. I swear my truck runs better after it has been washed and waxed!!! I know it is not true but it sure feels like it to me. Perhaps it slips through the air with less resistance.

High volume stations such as truck stops assure there is little condensation build up in their tanks and no algae. I know it still can happen but way less likely.

 

[subodh]

the only real diffrence is summer and winter fuel. .

gas can have more diffrence

i wouldnt say i can notive with diesel fuel

but some special kind of diesel / heating oil

used to produce gas for plants in greenhouses

is quite bad tried it some times in old cars

when i was a teen. . it isnt the same grease/fat

in it so the engine was running abit more rough and less power

(wouldnt dream of putting **** like that true my cummin)

but the color you talked about really takes me back when i was a few years old i remember diesel was always green. . i miss it havnt seen diesel with other color than clear for years now up in nordic countries

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

There was an article in TDR in the early 2000s talking about premium diesel fuel and when numerous stations were sampled and cetane rating tested it was all over the map. As I recall in one region fuel with cetane in the low 30s was found.

One time several years ago I filled up with diesel at an Exxon in Missoula Montana, which was the worst load of diesel I ever bought. It made my '96 rattle much louder than a 24-valve, MUCH louder. You should have heard it when it when I first fired it up the next morning on that tank too, the combustion was like a series of detonations.

 

[Tractorat]

We may have gotten off track here. I was really interested if there is a difference between the top tier gas station diesel (shell, 76, etc) and the lesser tiers (arco, gas and go, etc)

 

[Bob Cochran]

I think the majority seem to say NO. While there can be problems because of low sales of fuel sitting in the tanks to long.



I think you will find some who swear by a brand probably like talking to a Ford, Chevy, Chrysler guess abotu whoes is the best truck.



Anyway that is my opinion for waht it is worth.

We may have gotten off track here. I was really interested if there is a difference between the top tier gas station diesel (shell, 76, etc) and the lesser tiers (arco, gas and go, etc)

 

[HBarlow]

The answer is generally no. There may be minor differences in additives added by retailers, even color dyes added by some retailers, but cetane variances are more likely to be regional, not brand related.

The way to know if you are really interested is to determine where the refinery is. If there is more than one refinery in your region operated by different brand names (Shell, Arco, Shamrock) there might be differences in fuel between retailers. If there is only one refinery in your region you can safely assume all the fuel in that region is probably coming from the same source.

It would be silly to think Shell was trucking or piping fuel all the way from, for example, Houston, TX to Seattle if Chevron has a refinery in the state of WA.

 

[Grizzly]

Harvey,



When I bought my first diesel, a 95 Dodge Cummins, I used to purchase fuel at a Love's truck Stop. About two years later, a diesel mechanic told that I would get better mileage if I used Chevron because of it's additives. I used Chevron from then on and I did get about 1 to 1. 5 mpg better. I don't buy much Chevron anymore because most Chevron's are gone. Perhaps the answer to my question is the difference in Cetane which I never payed attention too before.



I hand calculate my fuel mileage every fill up and I do get slightly better mileage with a major brand than I do with a cut rate station.



george

 

[Diesel Gunner]

Branded fuel can be different from unbranded. Chevron, Shell, Unocal, etc have their branded products. Flying J, XXX Fuel, get diesel from wherever without the proprietary additive packages of the Brand names. You cannot buy Chevron (or any other braned) gasoline or diesel fuel from a Rotten Robbie or other unbranded station.