Dodge to run a Benz Diesel in 08

[ezcurra]

Alan,

If these two pages are correct (truck link, limo link), these two were just technology demonstrators. The two Daimler-Benz vehicles I listed were production vehicles, available to the public. DB made over 2000 260D´s before WWII

This link puts the appearance of the first DB diesel trucks in 1923-24, probably just prototypes.

If you have more info on this, I´d love to see it

Let's see... Clessie put a U model Cummins in a 1925, 7 passenger Packard limousine in Dec of 1929 & a diesel truck in 1931.

 

[Wayne M.]

From what I know, Mercedes still uses glow plugs as a starting aid. I refuse to pruchase a diesel engine that uses a glow plug.

We just got in some new Sterling medium's with the MB900 engine, and they aren't doing as good as the GMC/Cat 3116's they replaced- now the bosses are thinking about cancelling the order for a bunch of sprinters.

I don't think Mercedes has a historical advantage over Cummins- they both made junk!

FYI, the MB900 engine uses DDEC (Detriot Diesel Electronic Control) for engine management and lot's of emmission controls.

 

[fox]

I'm not saying MB can't or doesn't build a fine engine, but the one in the Sprinter is not their best work IMO. It does get great mileage though. [/QUOTE]



They all get great mileage while hooked to a tow truck!

 

[tgee]

From what I know, Mercedes still uses glow plugs as a starting aid. I refuse to pruchase a diesel engine that uses a glow plug.

We just got in some new Sterling medium's with the MB900 engine, and they aren't doing as good as the GMC/Cat 3116's they replaced- now the bosses are thinking about cancelling the order for a bunch of sprinters.

I don't think Mercedes has a historical advantage over Cummins- they both made junk!

FYI, the MB900 engine uses DDEC (Detriot Diesel Electronic Control) for engine management and lot's of emmission controls.

FYI, the MBE 900 does use electronics, but they are not like DDCs DDEC system. Besides, whats wrong with DDEC? DDEC has been around since 1985 or so, good system that the competitors have been trying to top for how many years now?

 

[Paychk]

Alan,

If these two pages are correct (truck link, limo link), these two were just technology demonstrators. The two Daimler-Benz vehicles I listed were production vehicles, available to the public. DB made over 2000 260D´s before WWII

This link puts the appearance of the first DB diesel trucks in 1923-24, probably just prototypes.

If you have more info on this, I´d love to see it

You Are most correct, D-B was the first for production, but all you specified was "the first". I know I'm splitting hairs with an atom ax, but how else to amuse myself on a long weekend.

 

[Jengle]

Well, they got the MB transmission in there, so why not the engine, next? Keep things more in-house.

 

[Missouri Mule]

Don't fix it if it isn't broke. Dodge doesn't have to advertise the Cummins to sell their trucks.

 

[Wayne M.]

FYI, the MBE 900 does use electronics, but they are not like DDCs DDEC system. Besides, whats wrong with DDEC? DDEC has been around since 1985 or so, good system that the competitors have been trying to top for how many years now?

There's nothing wrong with DDEC, I just think it's strange if not flattering to see an american system prevail over a german system although I don't now what they were using before. I have a book on the 900 and it states that the 900 uses a DDEC VCM and ECM.



I think the prime driective in DCX is to use in house rescources.



The new Charger/300/Magnum shows it (they use benz suspensions and other parts),

the sprinter shows it (it caused the Dodge B-van to die (RIP :{ )).

I think what's happened to Freightliner, Sterling and all other DCX trucks will happen to the RAM- and that is you will get what DCX has in house- just like the Liberty CRD, a small Italian engine that DCX happens to own.

I have to add that DCX owns Detroit Diesel too and that's why I not suprised see DDEC on the MB900.



If you think about it DCX has a big chunk of the truck market, and it's scary! All they need to do now is to take over Volvo truck and they'd have the world cornered.



I think that when they were doing the 3rd gen truck a few years ago, they weren't ready to kill the big "C" and that's why they have the contract ('till '07?).

 

[one8upcb]

If they put a MB in the dodge I would buy another one, if everything was to my specs.

 

[HEMI®Dart]

If they put a MB in the dodge I would buy another one, if everything was to my specs.

Same here. I would buy a MB diesel Ram over the other two choices for a light duty diesel pickup.

 

[PatrickCampbell]

If they put a Benz in the Dodge then someone else will get to use the Cummins. So it would be a pretty dumb idea. But maybe they can save that much money by using Benz motors. I would probably continue buying used 3rd gen Dodges until the kinks get worked out but I'm sure they would pick a worthy Benz motor.

 

[klenger]

I can't imagine DC going to all the expense of getting the CTD to meet the 2007 emmisions just to dump it the next year. Either they will switch in 2007, or after 2010 IMHO, if ever.

 

[Wayne M.]

I can't imagine DC going to all the expense of getting the CTD to meet the 2007 emmisions just to dump it the next year. Either they will switch in 2007, or after 2010 IMHO, if ever.

It's true that DCX has to do the actual EPA, CARB, etc. certifications for the vehicle, but i'll bet the farm that Cummins is actually certifying the varoius arrangments of the engine for their other uses and giving DCX what they need to get their job done.



I just visited Freightliner.com, WesternStar.com, and Sterling.com, and all three trucks only offer DCX engines (MBE or the series 60) and nothing else. The strange thing was that for info about MBE engines, you are directed to DetroitDiesel.com . The Ram is the misfit at this point!

I think the handwriting is on the wall!

 

[blacksheep4x4]

Ss it true? Is the beloved Cummins going by the wayside to allow for German Engineering to take over?

Lets not forget that Cummins is a German company too.

 

[blacksheep4x4]

Relax the Benz motor is an excellent choice for Chrysler to put in the Dodge truck. They are built stouter and are more efficient and vertually have no problems. The production plants for both Cummins and Benz engines sit side by side in Germany. They are both German companies. If this happens we may lose alot of wiring like Freightliner did. They use a wiring system that uses a 3rd of the wiring normal trucks use. The same wire can opperate several functions at the same time kind of like fiber optic lines. Besides if the new 4500 and 5500 trucks are going to use the Freightliner frame why not the same engines?

 

[Wayne M.]

Relax the Benz motor is an excellent choice for Chrysler to put in the Dodge truck. They are built stouter and are more efficient and vertually have no problems. The production plants for both Cummins and Benz engines sit side by side in Germany. They are both German companies. If this happens we may lose alot of wiring like Freightliner did. They use a wiring system that uses a 3rd of the wiring normal trucks use. The same wire can opperate several functions at the same time kind of like fiber optic lines. Besides if the new 4500 and 5500 trucks are going to use the Freightliner frame why not the same engines?

I always thought Cummins built most of their engines in Indiana. What Cummis engine is assembled in Germany for use in North America?



The wiring system you are describing is called "miltiplexing" and is nothing new. I believe International was the first to use it about 5 years ago in their medium trucks. Nowadays multiplexing is pretty common.



What benz engine is in the ISB size range?

 

[jwilliams3]

The production plants for both Cummins and Benz engines sit side by side in Germany. They are both German companies

Thats a good one :-laf :-laf :-laf :-laf



Tell us more!



Thanks for the information.



The internet never ceases to amaze me about how much misinformation is spread.



Yeah stouter, sure. :-laf

 

[jwilliams3]

For the record:



The Cummins ISB 5. 9L for the Dodge pickup is manufactured in Columbus, Indiana.

The plant is called "Columbus Midrange Engine Plant".

They manufacture all of the B series engines for Dodge.

CMEP also has an B series Block machining line.



Cummins Fuel Systems plant, Cummins Technical Center are also located in Columbus.

Cummins Corporate headquarters is also in Columbus, Indiana.

Cummins is an Indiana based Company and was founded in Columbus Indiana.



Cummins Historic "Engine Plant 1" is located here also and is currently called "HDMO" Heavy Duty Machining Operation.

CIC Cummins Industrial Center is located in Seymour, Indiana about 20 miles from Columbus.



Cummins has a large plant that is a joint venture with Case in Rocky Mount, North Carolina they manufacture many different engines there and also have a machining operation.

Cummins manufactures its M11 and ISX etc. at the Jamestown Engine plant in New York.



If you want real info check out www.CUMMINS.com

 

[FATCAT]

If they put a Benz in the Dodge then someone else will get to use the Cummins. So it would be a pretty dumb idea. But maybe they can save that much money by using Benz motors. I would probably continue buying used 3rd gen Dodges until the kinks get worked out but I'm sure they would pick a worthy Benz motor.

I'd make an even bet that if the Cummins is let go by Dodge, there would be two companies that would love to use the engine and who want to brake into the US Diesel truck market with a quality engine name, made in the US (beat import rules) ... . can you say Toyota or Nissan!



I bet there might be a HD Tundra or Titan running around somewhere out in the desert south-west with an ISB tucked under the hood.

 

[Hitec.Redneck]

For what ever its worth, I recently has a service company out to repair my water softner and the guy was driving a Dodge 3500 van with a Mercedes Diesel. He said the van was new, he had it for about 2 months. After listening to it idle for about 30 minutes I finally had to ask him what the motor was, it did not sound like a Cummins.