Drilling and tapping exhaust manifold

[GCraig]

I was planning on working on my truck later today to drill and tap the hole in the exhaust manifold for my Westach Pyrometer. The instructions indicate where to locate the hole. I also did a search for posts on this subject and found some helpful information. I saw where some have disconnected the turbo from the exhaust manifold and sliped a skillet between the manifold discharge flange and exhaust inlet to the TC. While this may be a little more labor intensive then other methods I thought it was the safest way to be sure no metal shavings get into the TC.



1. Does anyone know what the gasket between the manifold and TC is made of and can it be used again? Organic gasket materal must be replaced but stainless steel gaskets can sometimes be used again. What have others done?



2. Can anybody tell me what the 4 nuts and bolts that fasten the exhaust manifold to the TC should be torqued down to?



Thanks for any assistance you can offer. BTW I have really been enjoying this site. There is so much knowlege here. I frequent several automotive related web sites and TDR has some of the best tech I've seen anywhere. Please keep it up.

 

[jerryrigg]

Here is the torque settings for a 2001.



(1) Turbo to Exhaust Manifold 32 N·m (24 ft. lbs. ) torque.

!!!Don't forget the Anti-Seize!!!

(2) Oil Drain Tube 24 N·m (18 ft. lbs. ) torque.

(3) Oil Supply Line 20 N·m (133 in. lbs. ) torque.

(4) Air Cooler inlet pipe 11 N·m (95 in. lbs. ) torque.

(5) Air inlet hose 11 N·m (95 in. lbs. ) torque.

(6) Exhaust pipe 34 N·m (25 ft. lbs. ) torque.



I have not pulled the turbo so I can say for sure about the gasket.

Hope this helps.

-Matt

 

[Shovelhead]

The gasket on my '99 is stainless steel.

I reused mine and now 10k mi with no leaks, and good boost pressure.



HTH

 

[illflem]

Forget the skillet and just remove the two oil lines and two clamps on the turbo then move it all the way out of the way, take you maybe 5 minutes more. Then you can stuff a rag up inside the manifold beyond where you are drilling, pull it out with all the chips. I've always used the gasket over with no problems. Removing the turbo takes less time than fooling around with greased taps, magnets and shop vacs, plus you can be sure all the chips are removed.

 

[Big White Beast]

Be careful.......

I would do what Illflem suggests. On my 01 I had no problem so I was a little lax when doing the 02. Well, the drill bit shattered drilling the hole. Yanked the turbo and proceded to look for all the pieces. Magnet, shop vac, compressor and everything looked fine. All except for that little piece of hardened steel that must have gone back down the manifold. It has a slight downward slope to it and even with a magnet and shop vac it didn't come out. Needless to say it trashed the turbo. Had I yanked the turbo loose to start with and shoved a rag in like I did the first time it probably would have been fine. If your really unsure fire up the truck with the turbo off for a second and blow out anything remaining.



Garrett



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[illflem]

Garrett, I'm sure you must have heard the blades fall apart. What I'm wondering is how it sounded afterwards, vibrate a bunch or just lock up? You're not the only one this has happened to but what usually happens is a chip will wedge in-between the tight clearances in the turbo and keep it from turning, sounds like you have an exhaust brake on. If it's run very long locked up the vanes on the side facing the manifold overheat and warp. I'm continually surprised when folks here even recommend drilling and tapping without removing the turbo. Damage may only occur once out of a thousand times but that's enough for me.

 

[Big White Beast]

Within seconds..........

Fired up the truck and it made a god awful grinding noise. Shut her down right away but as you can see from the pic the damage was done. I had the HY from my truck to put on her's thankfully.



I doubt small shavings would be able to do that much damage. The kicker was the hardened steel of the drill bit. I disected the turbo afterward and the piece from the bit was tiny, but as you mentioned the clearances are so tight anything will get caught.



I suppose I should send it out for a rebuild so I have a spare just in case I have to debomb the truck for a stealer trip.



Garrett

 

[GCraig]

Originally posted by illflem

Forget the skillet and just remove the two oil lines and two clamps on the turbo then move it all the way out of the way, take you maybe 5 minutes more. Then you can stuff a rag up inside the manifold beyond where you are drilling, pull it out with all the chips. I've always used the gasket over with no problems. Removing the turbo takes less time than fooling around with greased taps, magnets and shop vacs, plus you can be sure all the chips are removed.

Thanks to everyone for their input. This is great information! However I have managed to come up with another question or two.



While out looking things over I made the following observations:



1. I am assuming the 2 clamps you mentioned would be one for the flexible air inlet from the filter box and one for the TC air discharge to the aftercooler?



2. The oil inlet line is a SS jacketed hose and appears to have sufficient slack to allow the TC to move out of the way with out having to disconnect it.



3. Can the TC remain connected to the exhaust pipe or does it need to be disconnected? It doesn't appear like the exhaust system would allow for much movement.



4. What is the easiest way to unhook or remove the oil drain tube from the TC back to the engine? I reached around and felt under the TC where it connected and couldn't feel any fasteners.



Sorry for all these questions but since my accident it is hard for me to crawl around underneath and view things from a different angle. Please bear with me guys. I don't move like I used to.

 

[nickleinonen]

what about drilling and tapping with the engine running



many people on the dieselpage forum have done that when drilling and tapping. that way, when you drill, the shavings are forced out the hole that you are drilling.



you still run the risk of having a drillbit break and fall in, but the shavings should all just blow out

 

[illflem]

Nick, I don't know if a Cummins will stay still enough to drill and tap while running. Still seems like the chips when you first break though the manifold would go though the turbo since the drill bit is blocking the hole.



1) Guess I assumed the tube to the filter was removed, there are three clamps total. Also pull the airbox out for more room, it's just snapped on, pull straight up.



2) Never tried it this way, if you do swing it out of the way make sure to cover the air and exhaust inlets. If you remove the SS line watch out that you don't lose the sealing washer inside, it is reusable. Just a few drops of oil will be spilled.



3) the exhaust clamp must be removed



4) Remove the oil drain tube at the connection low on the engine block, just a hose clamp on a short piece on hose. The connection at the turbo is too hard to get at. Removing the inlet oil hose will make removing/installing this end easier.

 

[JohnE]

pressurize the exhuast manifold

Local diesel performance shop does it that way without running the engine. They put a plug in the tailpipe and pressure it with a regulator. They say all the chips blow back out. Hey, if it works for the KDP jig why not for a pyro?



I chose to pull the turbo myself. Only one nut on the exhaust flange is a real *****. A crows foot would have been nice.



-John

 

[Bhale]

Just a thought...

... would it be possible/feasable to fab a spacer, perhaps 1/2" thick or so, from SST that would bolt between the turbo housing and exhaust manifold? This spacer could be pre-tapped for the thermocouple... Would need longer bolts but it might be an eaiser install than the drilling/tapping/chip removal process.



Brian

 

[JohnE]

it would be easier and cheaper to buy an ATS 3 piece manifold. It come with a port to drill and tap for your pyro probe.



Drilling the mamifold is only scarey the first time. Just DO IT.



-John

 

[GCraig]

Originally posted by JohnE

Drilling the mamifold is only scarey the first time. Just DO IT.



-John

Oh I'm not scared. I am simply making sure I've thought it all through and clairified the proceedures with those that have done it to be sure I don't make any mistakes. I'd hate like he11 to have to buy another TC because of getting in a hurry and not thinking the project through.



I agree with illflem's proceedure to be sure the shavings don't get into the TC.

 

[illflem]

This may also help http://www.dieselpage.com/gipda.htm

Sort of funny that step one is "1. Remove turbo from exhaust manifold. " That's all they say becuse that's how simple it is.

 

[cullyguy]

When Drilling, Remember that the manifold is not very thick! & If you mess it up It's a good excuse to call Piers for a new 3 piece manifold What the Hey, screw up the turbo & get a Piers HX-35 too. Of course that is assuming you have some available credit on the plastic

 

[JohnE]

<blockquote>GCraig said

<small><b>Oh I'm not scared. I am simply making sure I've thought it all through and clairified the proceedures with those that have done it to be sure I don't make any mistakes. I'd hate like he11 to have to buy another TC because of getting in a hurry and not thinking the project through.



I agree with illflem's proceedure to be sure the shavings don't get into the TC. </b></small></blockquote>



Didn't mean to insult you. I did EXACTLY the same as you. I checked and read the instructions until I was goofy. I finally just removed the turbo to verify the dimensions; drilled the manifold; and cleared the chips. If <b>I</b> did yours, I would remove the turbo; drill the manifold; and clear the chips. I got the dimensions now. FWIW, My dimensions do not match the ones posted on common web sites



-John

 

[GCraig]

Originally posted by JohnE



Didn't mean to insult you.

-John

No problem John I wasn't insulted I just didn't want you all think I have never been around cars before. I might be new to Dodge trucks but I've been messing around with cars for a while.