you may want to have it rebuilt properly. Mysteryman has info about this:
here is the link for the rest of the commentary but here are the main points, notice how he says NO 90 WT OIL IN THE GETRAG... take it from the engineer who built these trucks
http://www.tdr1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=151380&page=1&pp=15
Mysteryman wrote:
The best thing to do is rebuild the Getrag PROPERLY and put it back in... .
There is nothing wrong with the Getrag if you know how to build them !
I have written quite a bit on this subject in the past... Look up the posts...
I know that many think that the NV4500 is a better trans... . But we did have the 4500 several years BEFORE the Getrags were used... The 4500 was only used for gas trucks originally... . We used the Getrag because it was found to be a better trans during testing..... The 4500 was later used behind the diesels... It had a few small changes made to it before it was used in the diesels but that was it... .
The 4500 replaced the Getrag for only one reason... cost !
Rebuilding the Getrag is not hard you just have to pay attention to details...
The Getrag's problems were few but vital... The things that made them fail were as follows...
1) OIL LEAKS
A) drain plug dripped , run out or run low on oil
B) No gaskets on early models , more leaks
C) pilot bushing failures,,, bronze was too soft
D) over loading , trailer too heavy
E) too much hp , turning up the fuel/air
F) overheating ruining the oil
G) wrong type of oil , no 90 weight in the Getrag ! !
H) not knowing how to shift , rattling the gears,, too high a gear at too low a speed
2) Poor assembly
A) setting shim packs too tight , Getrag even did this themselves at times
B) uneven shim packs between main shaft and countershaft causing tail shaft housing not to hit squarely
C) bell housing misalignment
In conclusion, I personally have never had a Getrag fail in any of my personal trucks nor have I ever had to rebuild one twice that I built,, I have seen them go hundreds of thousands of miles in fleet trucks without failures.....
If you still decide to replace it with some thing else I would be glad to buy whats left of your Getrag. . I could use the spare parts ...
Good luck and be sure to replace the pilot bushing. Preferably with a ball bearing... The flywheel will need to be bored out for this... I do my own but the guys at South Bend clutch do them all the time for people.....
getrag failures
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The bearing that fails is the rear main shaft bearing..... This happens due to some of the things I mentioned earlier in this thread... .
What you have is a Timkin tapered roller bearing pressed onto the main shaft..... the race is then placed into the rear of the case partially sticking out. Then the tail shaft housing goes over the part of the race that sticks out pressing it down onto the cone... . There are shims that go between the race and the tail shaft housing that adjust the bearing clearance. .
The failure comes when the clearance is too tight (TOO MANY SHIMS)
This loads the bearing too tight..... When the trans heats up things expand...
This causes the race in the case to lock on the cone and rotate in the case...
This wears out the case and causes the trans to get real hot real fast... Then often times the case will crack between the main shaft and the countershaft bearing bores..... Party over !!!
The bearings in the Getrag are Timken tapered roller bearings just like the front wheel bearings. On front wheel bearings you adjust the clearance with the spindle nut... . On a Getrag you stack thin shims..... For new bearings you want a +. 006 preload . For used bearings you want . 000 clearance.....
Back in the early 90's we were having problems with the remans getrag was sending us... I had about 20 or so that we tore down to find out what had happened... I found that all of them had +. 030 to +. 045 shim packs..... I thought that I was not calculating it correctly or that the failed units were too bad off to be accurate...
I went to the getrag reman plant way back when to get to the bottom of what the problem was..... I pulled 3 off of the line and tore them down to check the clearance... . They all had +. 030 to +. 045 shim packs in them as well..... Oh sh** ! I called for the production manager ... . We discussed my findings... He said that they set them up this way intentionally because they felt . 006 was too lose and caused excess gear rattle during testing... OMG !!!
I promptly told him that he was to stick to the spec that WE told them to use and that I was going to write my report to my superiors that Getrag was the cause of the failures and should be back charged for the failures of the remans that Chrysler had had to eat in the previous 3 years!
For those of you that have had one of the Getrags apart . You may have noticed the the rear main shaft bearing race was excessively thick... .
The reason for this was that when we were testing the very first Getrags we found that under excessive load that the standard race would split and crack the case... So we reduced the size of the cone and had Timkin make a special thick walled race... . It worked and hence the reason for the strange heavy race...
As for the pilot bushing... . Engineering knew it was not going to work before the first one left the plant... But if you did not haul trailers it would work long enough to get out of warrantee... . Engineering wanted to use a ball bearing but . We were shot down due to cost ...
In 94 it was decided to go to a Torrington needle bearing... Great in theory but it just made matters worse... . They ate the imputs alive... .
As for the worn out ends on the imput shafts... What I do is put them in my cylinder grinder and make them round and back on center. . Then I make a steel sleeve on the lathe and press it onto the shaft end... . Then I put them in my cylinder grinder again and finish them to the correct diameter for the ball bearing I am going to use ... The tolerance is . 0001 ot centerline . And no your Craftsman engine lathe you got from dad is NOT going to do the job accurately enough !
Well enough on getrags for the day... . Dog and I are on the road going from place to place and hotel to hotel in search of long lost Dodge trucks and parts. .
Dog (Lucky) is holding on... . but is going down fast... . some days are better than others... He seems to be having a good time though... He has lifted leg on 2 chevy's and one ford so far... He gets a bone for everyone that he does. LOL
I will post some pictures of the trip after I get back if anyone is interested in seeing them..... Until then I will be shifting my Getrag... .
"everyone is driving toyotas and honda's. ". #@$%!
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Well I am a some one and I sure don't ! They stole half of their engineering from us! And yes I know that for a fact... . Did you know that in 78 and 79 that we had a diesel truck with a Jap Mitsubishi engine in it... Half of them blew up ! Those that didn't shook all the bolts out of the truck and you could not see the guy behind you in the rear view because the mirror vibrated too much ! They were slower than the second comming and if you turned the power up on them they bent the rods or blew the head gasket. .
Yes we were the first ever to have a diesel pick up in the usa. . we were the first for electronic ignition, torsion bar suspension,electronic fuel injection, automatic transmissions ect ect ect... . Yes we at CHRYSLER had the best engineers in the industry..... Our Airtemp division designed and made all the HVAC systems in the nuclear subs..... Our Newprocess division made most all the transfer cases for most of the light trucks for 40 years... We owned the industrial engine market and most of the chassis's in the motor homes were Dodge in years past...
And lets not forget that we were the ONLY auto maker that had the balls to put a Cummins 5. 9 in a pickup truck ! Everyone else knew that engine existed
long before we put it in our trucks... But it was our engineers and our chassis that made it happen... . The others could not get it to fit without doing severe design changes to their chassis... . And every engineer knew that the in line 6 was the best design for balance purposes!!
Except for the jap starter and alternator the the 89 to 93 trucks will go down in history as being the best work horse pickup ever built! If the Japs could build a truck for the price that could match ours you can bet your life that they would have built it by now !!!
One last thing... . did you know that the Jap zero that bombed Pearl harbor was built by Mitsubishi and the airplane design was an AMERICAN design they stole !
And isn't it funny that the Toyota trucks today have torsion BAR suspension... That was our design that they copied... . All they need to do now is offer the "handle option" You know... . No wheel barrow is much good with out the handle option!
Frankly I don't care if the japs built the best vehicle in the world... I think I would rather walk than buy one from them ! I know that Chrysler and
Mitsubishi were buddies ..... But engineering had nothing to do with that deal ! We all hated them with a passion... !!!!
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