Dually vs Medium Duty Truck

[Ramtough]

It is clear from reading this forum that anyone who has ever driven a DRW truck is sold. That question seems resolved, at least for the purposes of this forum. My question is - what experience is out there on light duty (3500) vs medium duty GM 4500-5500 or Freightliner M2 business class trucks? Some preliminary investigation is leading me to believe that the medium duty trucks are price competitive while offering much higher GCWRs and air ride seats. Having just returned from a 1,500 mile trip over bad concrete road, the air is looking more and more attractive. What if anything am I missing?

 

[JUeckert]

what r u missing ? less mpg,higher maint cost,more exp tires,higher registration prices,less of a demand for that type of vehicle if and when you want or have to get out of it. also consider the price,availability of insurance,+ the possibility of having to upgrade to a cdl dl [depending on weights,trailers etc]. long story short,dont do it unless u need it! or have plenty of money and just want one. .

 

[OTRPU]

JU's got it. . . cept I'd prolly be ahead if I'd got one to start with. Couple my good buddies run FL-70's and pull trailers fulltime. One put nothing in his, but the wind blew him & his MT Enclosed trailer clean of the road. No truck now. Other friend's put $9k in his this year. He makes more than me, but spent more on his truck 'n trailer this year than I have. But, I'm closing the gap. Mine probably isn't as marketable as any MDT.



Cheers,

Steve J

 

[Bill Stockard]

My question is - what experience is out there on light duty (3500) vs medium duty GM 4500-5500 or Freightliner M2 business class trucks?

The GM 4500-5500 and Ford F450-550 aren't real medium duty trucks even though they are advertised as so. Both are built using light duty truck components ie. engine, transmission, cab, etc. The Freightliner M2 is a real medium duty truck.



Bill

 

[Ross]

You're right, Bill. The GM 4500/5500 has 3/4 ton chevy truck drivetrain components (engine and transmission). If you look at the extra weight of the truck, and consider the hp/tq of the duramax, you can actually tow LESS. That said, the real advantage is stopping power. These heavier trucks can really handle a load when it comes to stopping. The chevys have juice brakes, so they're not ALL that much better, but they are bigger. The FL 70s may have air brakes, what an improvement.



My experience with medium duties is they are all lacking power. I towed with my Dodge 3500 for 7 years, while trying out several FL 70s (cat powered) and an international 4700 (DT 466). They were all far less capable when it came to pulling hills and excellerating. The DT 466 could top most hills at 40 mph! I added fuel (it had a P7100 pump), and got some more power out of it, but then I had to watch the pyro more than I wanted. It would get hot just trying to run 70 on the flats... ...



So, you might want to consider what a good number of folks are doing (including myself): Get yourself a converted heavy duty truck (HDT). I now drive a 2000 Volvo VNL 610. It has a 500 hp Cummins N14, and a 10 speed autoshift. I get a little better mileage than my trusty dodge 3500, with all the power and security you could ever imagine. Here's a good link that a lot of us use to talk about our HDTs. Escapees HDT Forum

 

[DaveK98]

The Ford 450's and 550's have the same engine and transmission but the axles, frame, and brakes are much more heavy duty.



I would love for ford to make a 550 with a cummins and a bed! But they make you step up to a 650 to get a cummins and that's just a little too big.

 

[edmeyers]

Ross

when you say you are able to get a little better mpg out of the volvo what kind of numbers are we talking?

i like the idea of a larger truck but i wonder if the a truck that big would wind up being more of a specialized use truck that a mutiple purpose vecicle like our dodges.

i really like the components minus the engine in the f-550 but i could see a f-650 low profile being a usable truck on a wide scale as well



have any of you tried the f-650's cummins or cat powered? what were you impressions could you have seen driving it every day in light traffic? as i would have to give up my 3500 on one of these. as far as power goses all stock trucks need a few tweaks.

 

[Ross]

Well, my trailer is quite large & heavy. 24,500 # loaded with about 6000 pin weight. So, my Dodge was "bombed" to deal with this weight. Injectors, TST, PDR turbo, on and on (see sig). I also had to install air bags to account for the weight. With all these mods, I would get anywhere from 7. 5 to 8. 5 mpg running the speed limit (65 to 70 mph). The dodge had no trouble pulling hills, although I would have to back out of the throttle on long pulls due to high EGTs. I did feel like I was having to work it pretty hard, though. I would maintain over 20 psi boost practically all the time, even on the flats. I estimate my Dodge horsepower in the 450 hp range (based on a 92 mph trap speed at the drags last October). So I feel I had "enough" power. Empty, the Dodge would get a respectable 18 mpg.



The Volvo, on the other hand, gets 11. 9 empty, and has done as poorly as 8. 1, and as good as 9. 1 towing the trailer. I've only checked one tank empty, mainly because I hardly ever unhook from the trailer. I use the Dodge for my "running around town". The N14 in the Volvo has 500 hp and 1650 ft lbs torque. It truly doesn't act like it knows the trailer is there. I set the cruise on 70, and forget it. I've not encountered a hill that required a downshift yet. That said, I've not cross the rockies, or any other major mountain chain. Just long rolling hills in Texas and Southern NM.





I did drive a 2004 F-650 with the CAT the other day. Had a trailer very similar to mine hooked to it. It was pretty short on power in my opinion. 65 MPH was about all it had, plus it rode like a buckboard. No airride seats, and spring suspension on the axles. Very rough. The CATs are expensive to bomb, so I've heard. I think they're rated at 330 hp/860 tq. Like I said earlier, you give up a lot of this "extra" torque just to pull the extra 6,000 pounds of truck your driving around. That makes the extra 240 ft lbs over a Dodge 5. 9 basically "a wash. " I know a few folks that purchased Mediums only to have them move to an HD later. The Crew Cab FLs are very expensive, too.



Bottom line: There's no "perfect" truck that excels at everything. The Dodge was perfect for me initially, but as my family and towing needs have increased, it lacks some capacity (both people and load). In 2003 when I upsized my trailer, the Dodge proved to be a little weak in the britches from a suspension/duty standpoint. The medium dutys have their problems too, mainly low power (IMO). The HDs? Well that's where I'm at now, and I like it but my wife won't even get behind the wheel. Maintenance and repairs are more costly, too. So there's no perfect truck out there. Some guys will disagree, but then again, there are guys that think towing a 8,000 travel trailer is really loaded!



Investigate all the options, and list the pros and cons of each. Each option will have its shortcomings. Then, make your choice based on which option has the fewest compromises for your given situation.



Good Luck.

 

[edmeyers]

Thank for all of the info