eth and power upgrades

[Sixspeed]

DF, I read that info on the NW bombers site.



So when you were in Tacoma you made 302 rwhp.



Does that mean that your puck gave you a 70 hp increase

what does it do different than a VA or EZ.





Les

 

[Diesel Freak]

I do not think the puck alone gave 70 HP... it was a combination of a new air systen, fuel system, puck, and the 275's, low restriction exhaust... ... I think you get the picture... . all the little bombs work together to make everything as a whole work better.



the 302 was down here in Hillsboro on a Mustang dyno



I made 299 on the dynoget in Tacoma..... the Dynojet did not load my truck as well as the Mustang 31 PSI of boost in tacoma vs 35 in hillsboro... same relative elevation and other crap... .

 

[TomGolden]

You can see what my truck has in my sig. I have only dyoned once, last September on a Mustang dyno at Imler Diesel in Sacramento, CA. My average after 4 runs was around 361 HP, with a peak high of 368 HP and 790 ft #'s of torque. This was with everything in my sig, except I had a DD True Torque Power Module set on the most aggressive setting, instead of my Comp box I have now.



I sold the TTPM to a fellow TDR member, and have a "hot" Comp box. I sent it into Edge directly and talked with Aaron and had them program it as a "hot" Comp for me. I am not sure what it is rated for now... . I have not dynoed with the Comp, but at the drag strip, it gained me 7 MPH on my terminal velocity, and it fairly noticeably more oomph than the TTPM, but not what I consider drastically more oomph. I personally guesstimate that going from the TTPM to the Comp might have gained me up to 40HP more at most on my ETH.



Kurt's B1... . DD's new Cam..... SuperMentals... ..... better VP44... ... .



Tom

 

[SixShooter]

OK, lets say your ETH has 240hp-this is reasonable right since they say it has 245hp- and you add stage 3 injectors which brings it up to 350(110hp gain), then you add a hot comp that puts out another 120hp. Now lets take say 25 off of the box and you have 445hp. I am just guessing here but dosen't this seem correct or do you only get like 20hp increase from the box? This is where I get confused when people start posting dyno numbers. Input please.

 

[TomGolden]

Well, as I posted above, with my 2001. 5 ETH, DD Stage 3 injectors, stock HX40, 4" Jardine exhaust, DD TTPM on most aggressive setting, I got 368 HP. There was someone there that same day with a bone stock ETH that dynoed at around 200 - 210 HP, and with the addition of only an EZ box, he was at about 250 HP as I recall. From what everyone tells me, with an ETH motor, you just won't see the maximum possible power from upgrades like injectors and fueling boxes, because the VP44 is only going to allow so much fuel through itself, regardless of what all your fueling boxes tell it to do, and regardless of how ever much fuel your injectors will flow into the cylinders.



I do agree with other posts here that on the ETH, injectors make a bigger bang than fueling boxes do, but we are limited more than the ETC guys. Our VP44 is a slightly different beast than theirs is.



Someday DD, and maybe others, will come out with a resonably priced upgrade or alternative to the ETH VP44 that will let us take full advantage of our upgrades, and then we can rightfully take our place on top of the high HP mountain



I don't know the price, but I have heard that at least one or two brave and resourceful people have indeed put a P7100 pump on an ETH motor, but from what I heard, you could almost buy another engine for what that costs



Tom

 

[SixShooter]

I see, so the numers that Dodge posts at 245hp are flywheel correct? Thanks for the info. OK, does the ETH smoke as bad as the ETC with stage 4 injectors?

 

[KLockliear]

FYI, I have seen ETH's from 200hp to 245hp at the wheels on our Dynojet. Lawrences and most of the early ones I saw were right at 218-222hp (Lawrences, Psychotty Scotty and several others). I saw one or two CA models that were 200-210. More recently I saw one truck that made 245hp.



Typically, our Stage 3's and the necessary HX-40 will bump that 220hp to 350hp at the wheels. A Comp/Ultimate is worth about 100-110 on a injector BOMBed ETH, putting you at around 450 or so.



One guy had Super Mentals and the rest of that setup and made 470hp with his ETH... then made 551 with our modified VP44.

 

[Sixspeed]

Sixshooter, a 240 rwhp ETH is very much the exception. Like TomGolden said most ETH's are going to be around 200 rwhp stock.



Also I don't think you can just add up the hp numbers like that.



Diesel Freak, so with the mods I have 238 seams normal. Because if so then helping the truck breath better doesn't add hp. It just lowers EGT so you can add more fuel.



Les

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

OK, lets say your ETH has 240hp-this is reasonable right since they say it has 245hp- and you add stage 3 injectors which brings it up to 350(110hp gain), then you add a hot comp that puts out another 120hp. Now lets take say 25 off of the box and you have 445hp. I am just guessing here but dosen't this seem correct or do you only get like 20hp increase from the box? This is where I get confused when people start posting dyno numbers. Input please.

To start with 210-215 seems average for rwhp on and ETH. The ETH does not respond well to the boxes. . so add a PEC gets you to 300hp not 350.



Then add DD3s. . the DD3 alone add 90+hp to put you at 300 also. the PEC + the DD3s should put you near 380rwhp. The preoblem you get into now is that hte turbo is way off the map making 42lbs of boost.



Its now making heat instead of HP.



If you add a turbo (B1) you'll get about 440-450 hp. You just can't get enough air to make the hp through a stock turbo.



You'll see high torque numbers (~900ft lbs) and low HP (375 or so) because to turbo is spooling up like there's no tomorrow. It just runs out of wind on the top side.



You should see TQ being about 2. 15 times HP when breathing well on our motors. 375*2. 2= 825. 505/245=2. 06. . in my case 449/212=2. 12



This is a rough rule of thumb.



The factors are gonna change when the turbo and fuels change so this is not as simple as it looks.



My truck should be near 450hp and well over 1000ftlbs.



FWIW,

Mark

 

[TomGolden]

Sorry, I should have thought to point that out. Yes, the Dodge advertised numbers are measured at the flywheel, as I'm sure are the numbers for the PowerStroke and Duramax.



I have never personally been around anyone who had larger than stage 3 injectors, except when Chris Sutton first got his BD 5's I saw him pull once with them. I can't really say how much an ETC with stage 4's can smoke. I can't even really tell you how much my truck smokes. I have never stood outside while someone else drove it to see, and from inside, I know I don't see very much smoke, unless I hammer it at very low RPM. If I am going say 35 MPH and shift into 5th gear and nail the diesel pedal, it will smoke quite nicely but I'm sure the view from outside is much better than it is from the driver's seat.



Last weekend drag racing, I hardly noticed any smoke from inside. But the guys watching told me it smoked pretty good, most of the way down the track.

 

[Diesel Freak]

Originally posted by Mark_Kendrick





If you add a turbo (B1) you'll get about 440-450 hp. You just can't get enough air to make the hp through a stock turbo.



You'll see high torque numbers (~900ft lbs) and low HP (375 or so) because to turbo is spooling up like there's no tomorrow. It just runs out of wind on the top side.

That is the exact wall I am up against now! My little HX35/12 is a cork!... ... 358HP@2500, and 876 FTxLBF@2000. I have my wastgate backed off to 35 PSI ( I can achieve this boost pressure at absurdly low rpms) to help it breathe a little better, but I am in need of a larger turbo that spools by 1600 RPM, breathes above 2700 rpm, and DOES NOT BREAK!



SOUNDS LIKE A PIPE DREAM TO ME!:{

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

Sounds like MY B1!!!!



Dude, she screams.



The B1 with DD3s spools a bit better than a stock truck w/a HX35 and is good all the way to 60psi.



With the PEC on 1/1 there is little or no smoke. 5/5 resembles a lunar eclipse.



Later,

Mark

 

[KatDiesel]

Originally posted by Mark_Kendrick



The B1 with DD3s spools a bit better than a stock truck w/a HX35 and is good all the way to 60psi.



With the PEC on 1/1 there is little or no smoke. 5/5 resembles a lunar eclipse

Injectors alone. . with COMP off..... spools respectably. With the COMP in 1/1 I don't like it... not enough fuel.

 

[Bigsaint]

HX40, ATS manifold, 4" BD exhaust, Scotty air, Edge EZ and Bully Dog 3's gave me 366 RWHP on my ETH. I have added the TST comp. box and Bully Dog 5's and fuel line upgrades since then, hoping for around 450 RWHP, should find out in a few months when I dyno again at the same shop/dyno. What ever I have, I can honestly say it's enough for me. The combo of the BD 5's and the Edge EZ box make for a great daily driver, the TST is used for short term play only. So far, I have resisted drugs, but may take a stab at a custom NOS set up from Auto Wurks sometime this year.



Scott W.

 

[SixShooter]

My question is which is better 5 or 6?
power or engine control? My plans are to have 450hp, and I have been told different things. I only want go with Stage 3 injectors and a comp box of some sort. Now I could get to my desired level with the ETC, or I could do pump mods-$? and get there with the ETH. Is it worth the extra gear to do more work for the same power? Opinons please. I would like to know if the sixspeed to what it is all talked up to be.

 

[Jetpilot]

SixShooter,



I can't help you out on the 5 vs. 6 speed issue as I am running an auto. But on making 450 HP I can give you some insight there... . I think you will be around 400-425 with the setup you are looking at. I dynoed 452 with everything I have (see sig). But then again dyno's have lots of variables so you might see 450 on one dyno and less on another.



I will say this the ETH is a good engine likewise with the ETC. There are no good mods yet for an ETH or ETC VP44 pump. That being said if you want more HP with whats out there right now I would go with the ETC. You can make an ETH = and ETC but you will have to be a little more imaginative.



Good luck with your decision,



Doug

 

[Mark_Kendrick]

My question is which is better 5 or 6?

SixShooter,



Power wise the ETC responds better to mods. I think the NV5600 is well worth the tradeoff. It's all but bullet proof. I broke mine but it still drove fine and it was a known issue(TSB on it).



It's a hard question. If you're gonna work mostly and play some. Get the 6. if you're gonna play mostly and work some, get the 5.



FWIW,

Mark

 

[MikeR]

Jacob,



First of all, you have never told us what your intended purpose is with this truck. C'mon, give it up... what are you going to be doing with it?? You should really decide what you need a truck for before dreaming of hp mods. I don't want to be a jerk here with you, but for the last year you've kept asking us 'what if' and 'what about... ', but it would be nice and helpful if you told us why you 'need' it.

From what I read about your posts is I see a guy set on power and speed, and no towing or the need for the truck to be an income source. If that's the case get the least amount of gears possible.