Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Everyone running dual Carter lift pumps (helper pusher pump) chime in - any failures?

[15w40]

I remain unconvinced that the pusher pumps are the answer and have been following this thread with much interest. As of 4/11, 33% of the stock lift pumps have died before 50K miles and a total of 44% before 100K miles. Looking at the responses to the dual Carter pusher pump failure rate, responses have shown 8 people with no problems after installing the second pump and 3 people with pumps failing. That is 27% with an average of 16K miles on the dual setup. That is not too far from the 33% of the single pump failures. What will happen as they approach 50K miles? I know that in some cases the original factory lift pump died after the pusher pump was installed, but that indicates the added inlet pressure to the factory lift pump may not be helping. More data is needed before these statistics are valid but the trend does not look good.



I hope we can find a solution to this design flaw on the best engine put into a pick-up truck.

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

What you have to keep in mind there Dave is that two of those three were people that already had weak lift pumps when the pusher was added. I only know of one instance where someone started with a good pump at the engine and had a failure. On this thread shooter had 33,000 miles on his, the other failure reported on here they replaced both pumps and did have a failure there. The only other reported failure was from Doc Tinker and he had a failing lift pump when he put his pusher pump on and then went another 20,000 miles before it died.

 

[Todd T]

also remember DAVE, the guys running dual pumps needed them because the single factory pump couldnt keep up. you cant compare nonstock and stock trucks. you need to compare this solution to the other pump solutions needed for more fuel and then those failure rates. to date this is the best and most reliable. not to mention cheapest, with redundancy and the ability to limp home (rather quickly) when/if ONE fails.



Tex Kid, I only had Bully Dog 4's, PM3 and NOS. all i cold squeeze out of the stock turbine was 469HP is that enough? it could hold 5PSI @ WOT.

 

[15w40]

I agree that if the stock pump is failing, the pusher pump may not help and if you are making 500 HP the factory fuel system will need a lot of help. What I am looking for is a solution that is proven to last 100K+ miles. Either that or I will do an annual lift pump change and just think of it as normal maintenance. If the dual pumps prove to be reliable, I’ll jump on the bandwagon. Time will tell.

 

[KatDiesel]

I just added the Carter 4600 to push.



20 to 21 psi at idle



BD IV's + COMP 5x5 = no less then 10psi



This is at the injection pump on the pressure reading.



I replaced my stock lift pump back in Oct... just for the heck of it. Dunno how healthy the current one is, but with the pressure readings I think its ok for now.

 

[TxDieselKid]

Todd,

That is exactly what i was looking for, what you and Kat posted.



Thanks,

Andrew

 

[Larry Willard]

I recently installed the 4600 pusher as well. Idle is pegged on my 16psi Westach gauge and it will just barely move at 3/4 throttle sitting still. The lowest I have seen so far is 13psi. Guess the real test starts Friday evening as we head out to May Madness.

Larry

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

TTT - updates? 50,000 miles on mine and counting - still working great, haven't lost any pressure yet at all.

 

[kscheffler]

Steve: I am interested in your installation instructions but I can not get your thread to open. Can you check the address or provide me with the date and the subject line so I can locate this by using the search option. . thanks kts

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

I updated the link and here it is again - https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19767

 

[kscheffler]

Thanks Steve. Looks like the way to go; another weekend project for me... kts

 

[Red360]

I installed the pusher pump at 23089 miles. At 36023, the factory lift pump died. The truck would start and miss like a hell.

 

[dthorkelson]

Pusher Pump

Steve. I installed my pusher pump from Enterprise three months ago and have not experienced any problems. Getting 21 lbs at idle and minimum of 15 wot. You are to be abundantely thanked for all your work on this obvious poor engineering by DC. Thanks DonT

 

[JTroiano]

So my DD3's are comming in the mail and I can suck my fuel pressure down to 2psi with the Comp on 5/5. Do I put the Carter p4601hp (15psi) on or the p4600hp (7psi) as the pusher. The stock LP is OK but not perfect. I don't want low pressure. Any help would be great.

Jon T

 

[TxDieselKid]

JTroiano,

The 15psi, p4601hp pump goes in the stock location, and the 7psi, p4600hp pump goes at the back, near the fuel tank.



Andrew

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

SO, does the Carter 4600 run CONTINUOUSLY, or only when outgoing pressure drops some arbitrary level? And why do some of you use relays, rather than merely accessing a keyed voltage source with wiring large enough to supply needed current? I'm using a similar fuel pump as my transfer pump from a bed-mounted 50 gallon tank - and have it wired into my cigarette lighter's (keyed) 20 amp fuse line... Works great so far... And did for 100,000 miles on my OLD truck as well...

 

[DEZLPWR]

It is my understanding that the 4600 pusher runs whenever your stock pump is running. They are relayed together. Someone correct me if I am wrong here... .

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Another gem of distilled LP info seems to be that the problem isn't REALLY with the quality or ability of the stock pump - only that it is in the WRONG PLACE to do it's job properly and efficiently without potential damage and failure.



And the question that's been asked, "Why the need for *2* pumps, when *1* is capable of doing the job properly, assuming it's the proper pump in the RIGHT spot to begin with?



If that's TRUE, seems to make more sense to simply MOVE the existing pump and electrical circuitry back as close to the tank as possible, and be DONE with it! I can't see where THAT solution would be any more damaging to warranty claims than the addition of a non-specified second pump added by the user! And it would sure be lots simpler and cheaper... In ANY event, *2* pumps DOES seem sorta like overkill...

 

[KatDiesel]

Originally posted by Gary - KJ6Q

Another gem of distilled LP info seems to be that the problem isn't REALLY with the quality or ability of the stock pump - only that it is in the WRONG PLACE to do it's job properly and efficiently without potential damage and failure.



And the question that's been asked, "Why the need for *2* pumps, when *1* is capable of doing the job properly, assuming it's the proper pump in the RIGHT spot to begin with?



If that's TRUE, seems to make more sense to simply MOVE the existing pump and electrical circuitry back as close to the tank as possible, and be DONE with it! I can't see where THAT solution would be any more damaging to warranty claims than the addition of a non-specified second pump added by the user! And it would sure be lots simpler and cheaper... In ANY event, *2* pumps DOES seem sorta like overkill...

Many people are trying this approach, the trick is finding a pump to last more then 6 months. So 2 pumps may be overkill but until a decent single pump is found and tested its the option that seems to last the longest.



csutton has a single pump setup going on over a year. 2 other members are trying another promising pump ($$$) the PE4100.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

So, you're saying the stock pump STILL fails prematurely - even when moved back next to the tank?



Bummer!