Exhaust Manifold Removal advice needed

[JimBob24]

Howdy y'all. I'm looking at the maintenance manual for my '04 and it says to remove the turbo first when removing the exhaust manifold. Just looking at the manifold it LOOKS LIKE you should just be able to leave the turbo in place hanging on the exhaust elbow and remove the nuts from the turbo studs. Since the exhaust manifold is held on by bolts instead of studs it looks like once the heat shield and bolts are removed the manifold should just lift off the turbo. Is this just wishful thinking or will that work?



I have an almost new stock 600 manifold from a wreck and I thought I would drill and tap it for a pyro just ahead of the turbo flange while it was off the engine to avoid any debris that might drop into the turbo. I thought about having it ceramic coated before putting it back in. Is this a good idea or really dumb???



Also, some EGT probes come with a choice of a 1/8 NPT or 1/4 NPT fitting. Is there an advantage to a particular size, other than the obvious fact of drilling and tapping a smaller hole? Any advice will be GREATLY appreciated.



Jim

 

[rbattelle]

I can't comment on the manifold removal since I've never done it. But I believe you are correct - the manifold can come out without removing the turbo. Someone who's done it will correct me if I'm wrong.



If I were you, I'd get it ceramic coated. But that's just because it looks nicer than an old rusty iron piece. It won't give you any performance benefit.



Choice of fitting is a complete toss-up. It's a tradeoff: a smaller probe might respond slightly faster, but a larger probe would be less likely to break off. Of course, a well-designed probe simply isn't going to break off... has anyone ever heard of anyone breaking one?



-Ryan

 

[Joseph Donnelly]

Keep your stock manifold and paint it with VHT header paint (from a speed shop or Checker Auto Parts). The 600 mfd isn't much better. Either is far inferior to the ATS manifold, imho. You should be able to leave the turbo on the truck when your r&r the mfd. Get the gaskets from Cummins; they are expensive from Mopar.

 

[JimBob24]

Thanks Joe. My stock manifold is a 600 too. I just happen to have this other one (also a 600) which I can drill and tap, then paint or have coated and swap with the stock one. My thinking was that it would be easier to prepare it off the engine then swap them out, especially since I want to mount the probe on the hottest side of the vertical part of the manifold just above the turbo mount flange. I was just going to paint or coat it for looks. I will check into the VHT paint... . if it will stand the heat that would be the way to go. Good idea on the gaskets too.



Much appreciated.



Jim

 

[Briman]

If I were going to all the work of R & Ring the exhaust manifold I would certainly replace it with an ATS. I know, it's only money.

 

[MMeier]

If I were going to all the work of R & Ring the exhaust manifold I would certainly replace it with an ATS. I know, it's only money.

Damn, you need money to work on these things, who would'a thought!! :-laf

 

[JimBob24]

Money is not the problem! LACK of money is. I thought about the ATS and that is probably down the road ... still got to do the gauges first. I already have the spare manifold ... maybe I just need a project. Anyway, I can only do a little at a time so maybe the wife won't catch on. :-laf

 

[AndyMan]

Hey Jim, rather than let that stock manifold lay around and collect dust once removed, a nice idea would be to pass on your stock manifold after it's replacement to another member so that he or she may also benefit from being able to do the setup off the truck where it's safer. You could still ask for a nominal fee (to help recoup your costs), and of course shipping.



Just food for thought, good luck... Pay it forward. It's what the TDR's all about.



Andy

 

[JimBob24]

Not a bad idea, Andy. About to leave pulling the RV from GA to west TX so I probably won't get to this project until Jan 05. I will probably do that after the project is done.



Thanks for the idea.



Jim

 

[mberry]

I just did it this past Saturday. You can leave the turbo in place IF you can get the nuts off the turbo flange. The nuts are 15MM and you have to be careful since the wastegate actuator makes it tricky to get the socket on square. I tried for 2 hours and finally had to remove the manifold with the turbo as an assembly. That metal flex tubing that goes from the turbo to the oil pan isn't too bad to re-attach if you take your time. I actually had to use a cheater bar to get the last nut off it was on so tight.



The only other PITA is the heater hose bracket. It WILL NOT come off without being bent or cut. I suggest bending it so it will come off if you plan to reinstall it.



I got the new gaskets at Cummins for $8. 50 a piece so it's not a big deal. The turbo gasket is metal and can be re-used if it's in good shape.



I installed an ATS manifold in place of the stock one. It was really easy to assemble and using the old manifold as a template was a fantastic idea. I only had trouble with one bolt hole being slightly off.

 

[JimBob24]

Thanks mberry. Does the ATS have a pre-drillled threaded port for an EGT probe, and is there a significant benefit to using the ATS manifold with an otherwise stock 600 engine?



Jim

 

[mberry]

Jim,



It is not pre-drilled, but is easy to drill and tap if you take your time. I didn't notice any real difference until I got back into the mountains on my way home. There was definitely something different but it the power was much smoother and there seemed to be more of it.



Mark.

 

[JimBob24]

Well, SHOOT! Here I was going to get by real cheap and now y'all have about convinced me to go out and buy an ATS manifold!!! Thinking about it I really only want to remove/replace this thing once since I am too lazy to make a habit of it. :-laf Guess I'll have to flip a coin ... best 2 out of 3?? 4 out of 7?? 51 out of 100???? Maybe Santa will be good to me. Oo. Anyway, it's all about having a good time. Thanks for all the input.

 

[BStoecker]

You can do it without touching the turbo. I cut that one bracket off instead of bending it. Just make sure that you put the turbo flange bolt nuts on FIRST!!! Then do the bolts into the side of the motor. I made that mistake. I put the bolts into the side of the motor first and could not get the last nut on the turbo flange bolt towards the front passenger side of the turbo. The ATS is a very nice piece of work and worth the time and effort. I did not buy new gaskets. I only had about 4-5k miles on the truck when I did this and the fellow at ATS said to go ahead and reuse them.

 

[Briman]

Enjoy your trip JimBob.

 

[mberry]

You can do it without touching the turbo. I cut that one bracket off instead of bending it. Just make sure that you put the turbo flange bolt nuts on FIRST!!! Then do the bolts into the side of the motor. I made that mistake. I put the bolts into the side of the motor first and could not get the last nut on the turbo flange bolt towards the front passenger side of the turbo. The ATS is a very nice piece of work and worth the time and effort. I did not buy new gaskets. I only had about 4-5k miles on the truck when I did this and the fellow at ATS said to go ahead and reuse them.

Excellent advice if you don't have the problem getting them off like I did. I would have replaced the gaskets anyway but if re-using them works for you go right ahead. Like JimBob said, I didn't want to make a habit of it by re-using the old gaskets. Good luck with whatever you choose.



Mark