extended oil changes

[Bruce Allen]

With the service plan oil change recommendation at 7,500 heavy use and 15,000 light use what do you guys think of changing the oil every 10,000 and oil filter and fuel filter every 5,000.



thanks,

Bruce

 

[amsoilman]

With the service plan oil change recommendation at 7,500 heavy use and 15,000 light use what do you guys think of changing the oil every 10,000 and oil filter and fuel filter every 5,000.



thanks,

Bruce

I think this is very possible! Personally, I use a hi grade synthetic with by-pass, along with periodic oil analysis, and my current ride has more than 32,000 on the same oil!





Wayne

amsoilman

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I'm at 13,000+ mostly RV towing miles on Delo 400 15/40, combined with a Frantz bypass oil filter, and recently received an excellent analysis from Blackstone:



#ad




I'm shooting for 20,000 miles on this run, but will probably settle on annual oil changes at 12,000 miles or so, based upon results so far in this test.

 

[Lightman]

I'm at 13,000+ mostly RV towing miles on Delo 400 15/40, combined with a Frantz bypass oil filter,



Gary how many miles do you go before you change your toilet paper :-laf

I have the same filter Thanks

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"Gary how many miles do you go before you change your toilet paper

I have the same filter Thanks"



I prefer to replace about every 2000 miles in my mostly-towing use - the oil is usually starting to get pretty dark by then, and the new TP element cleans it up really well, and the added quart of replacement oil keeps my additive package in the Delo up in the good numbers...



Here's a pic of the oil on my dipstick a few hundred miles after my 13,000 mile TP element change in my extended drain test:



#ad

 

[Lightman]

Thanks I do the same

 

[klenger]

Recommended fuel filter change is 15K. 5K is way too often, assuming you don't get a bad load of fuel.

 

[redram]

"Gary how many miles do you go before you change your toilet paper

I have the same filter Thanks"



I prefer to replace about every 2000 miles in my mostly-towing use - the oil is usually starting to get pretty dark by then, and the new TP element cleans it up really well, and the added quart of replacement oil keeps my additive package in the Delo up in the good numbers...



Geez, if you're adding a quart every 2000 miles, you should never have to change oil! In 22,000 miles, you'll have changed the 11 quarts in the engine! My gosh, you should be able to run indefinitely! We had a client do this with a Suburban but he went 5000 on standard filters and a Suburban only has 5 quarts of oil. He sold the truck with 375,000 never having actually changed the oil, just changed the oil filter and added a quart. Before he sold it, the truck was PM'd by the dealership and compression was within 2% of new specs.



The new trucks should be able to go 10,000 easy UNLESS you let the truck idle for extended periods, only run 5 mile trips between start and stop, or only run on dusty roads.



I use an Oilguard on my 96 and could probably run 50,000 to 100,000 if I wanted to although I choose to run 25,000 or once a year with RP 15W40. Oil is cheap but adding a quart every 2,000 sounds like more hassle - then having to dispose of an oil saturated TP roll - that doesn't sound all too environmentally sensitive or green (waste oil in ground water, trees for TP, energy to propose and market all of that)



Just kidding guys. Do whatever oil change makes you guys feel good about your truck. There is no one right or wrong, only what's appropriate for each individual.



For warranty, change your filter at the 7500 or sooner time frame and how would the dealer know whether you changed the oil every other time unless you told them? If the oil causes the failure (unlikely, oil fails due to fuel dilution, coolant contamination, dirt, or lack of oil [insufficient oil level] - all of which are not failures of the oil, but failures of mechanical components in the engine), then the oil manufacturer should stand behind the product.







Cheers,

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

The filter change period I use might seem higher than needed at the mileage I currently have on my oil (13,000+) - but in heavy service like my RV towing, and using the "recommended" 7500 mile or so spec, that would only be 2 extra quarts - one at about 2000-2500 miles, and another at 5000 miles or so - then a full oil change and all new filters. That hardly seems excessive or worthy of concern...



NOR is it unusually labor intensive to swap out the TP element and add a quart of oil - I can do the whole bit in less than 5 minutes, but then I have an extra filter canister I keep loaded with a fresh TP cartridge - and then clean and replace the old one whenever I feel like it.



Some guys unfamiliar with this setup DO tend to make lots more out of it than it actually involves (I have avoided the disposal of *6 gallons* of used oil in my 13,000 miles - and only added about 6 quarts in that mileage!) - after all, extended drains cause LESS waste oil than a complete change, and disposing of a saturated TP cartridge is no harder than disposing of a spin-on filter. Actually, living in the country as we do, we normally use the used filters as fire starters in our brush piles of tree trimmings...

 

[LightmanE300]

Bruce Allen - I think 5k miles for a fuel filter change is excessive. 10k is probably more appropriate for the fuel filter, and the oil filter will last that long as well. Depending on your driving style/conditions and the type of oil you use, 10,000 mile changes without any filter changes can be no problem.

 

[RoryTek]

Well I have over 100k on my 15-40w using a dual bypass system. My filter change interval is 7-14-21 That is evey 7k miles I change the full flow filter and at 14k mile interval I pull a oil sample and at 21k I change the bypass element. The truck now has 201k miles on it. the first 30k were I think on dino oil thats when I bought it. I switched it to synthetics at about 50k went to a bypass at 90k. Still runs strong for a 300hp truck.

 

[Dean Upson]

I have finally settled on 6k oil changes and I change the fuel filter every other time. I would not have a problem with the 7500 oil change/ 15,000 fuel filter change. I always carry spare filters with me and the tools to change them just in case of a fuel filter problem.



Dean

 

[Bruce Allen]

I forgot to ad to the post above the oil is Delo 400 and Flettguard filters. I only drive the truck on weekends and or long trips. So it sits and gets run(good or bad i dont know). I also run power service every other tank.



any other sugestions would be great



thanks



Bruce

 

[LightmanE300]

Bruce - If I were you I'd run the oil and both filters 10k. You'll be well within the safety zone as far as oil life is concerned and won't be wasting fuel filters changing them every 5k. The last oil analysis I did after 10k miles on the oil - the oil was nearly brand new. Granted I have a bypass system, with the stratapore filter you will be fine.

 

[JVolkmann]

I switched to Amsoil at 10,000 miles. Now, I change the oil filter at 7500 miles add a quart, and take a sample. Then at 15,000 I change the oil and filter and take a sample. My oil analysis comes back fine even after 15,000 miles. I change it just for piece of mind. Fuel filter I change every 15,000, but always keep a spare with me in case of problems.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Personally I don't mind running the same oil in my setup out to 12,000 miles or so (tho' by analysis, it COULD be run longer) - the oil still cleans up nicely at a change of the TP element - but it DOES continue to get dirtier and various wear elements DO steadily build in volume - and I just GOTTA get the old stuff out, and fresh stuff IN!



I figure that if I wouldn't buy and use lube with the level of contaminents and blackness of soot buildup, WHY would I want to leave the same stuff in my crankcase indefinitely?



Again, personally, *I* simply CANNOT buy into the notion of paying an elevated price for some fancy lube - then feel compelled to run the stuff to death as a tool to recover the initial cost!



I'd far rather buy the "regular" stuff of good quality and reasonable price - run it through a decent bypass setup, and then CHANGE the dern stuff at a reasonable mileage - THAT I can afford and still feel good about!



YMMV!

 

[amsoilman]

Personally I don't mind running the same oil in my setup out to 12,000 miles or so (tho' by analysis, it COULD be run longer) - the oil still cleans up nicely at a change of the TP element - but it DOES continue to get dirtier and various wear elements DO steadily build in volume - and I just GOTTA get the old stuff out, and fresh stuff IN!



I figure that if I wouldn't buy and use lube with the level of contaminents and blackness of soot buildup, WHY would I want to leave the same stuff in my crankcase indefinitely?



Again, personally, *I* simply CANNOT buy into the notion of paying an elevated price for some fancy lube - then feel compelled to run the stuff to death as a tool to recover the initial cost!



I'd far rather buy the "regular" stuff of good quality and reasonable price - run it through a decent bypass setup, and then CHANGE the dern stuff at a reasonable mileage - THAT I can afford and still feel good about!



YMMV!

Gary,

Iwould like to ask you a couple of questions... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... . First off, If you are taking oil samples and getting back information stating the oil is OK to continue using, WHY CHANGE IT? Unless, of course you do NOT BELEIVE what the sampling results are telling you.

Next question is. When you purchased your CTD, did you think it was a much better choice for your money, rather than the others available too you?



When you talk about some "Fancy" lube, and then trying to recover your costs by extending your drain intervals, isn't that basicly what you did when you decided to get a CTD to do the kind of job *YOU* wanted it to do for you?



Speaking of "Fancy" lubes, you are going to be seeing Exxon/Mobil come out with a "long Drain" 15,000 mile engine oil in just a few weeks! Beleive it or not, people want the conveinience of long drain intervals. That is why GM came out with a system called "Oil Life System", where they monitor certain operational data. There is nothing in the owners manual that says to change oil at a specific mileage or time. BMW and Mercedes-Benz have been installing these types of monitors on their dashboards that light up to indicate when its time to change oil for many years!



Wayne

amsoilman



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[LightmanE300]

I switched to Amsoil at 10,000 miles. Now, I change the oil filter at 7500 miles add a quart, and take a sample. Then at 15,000 I change the oil and filter and take a sample. My oil analysis comes back fine even after 15,000 miles. I change it just for piece of mind. Fuel filter I change every 15,000, but always keep a spare with me in case of problems.

I'm sorry but I have to say that the above post makes no sense. You are not supposed to test AFTER you changed the filter or oil, that defeats the entire purpose. The point of testing is to test the oil at it's absolute worst state, to see if you are exceeding certain parameters - which would warrant a shorter drain interval. Testing after you've replenished the oil's additives and changed the filter does nothing but make you feel good about yourself. Maybe(I hope) your wording just makes it look like you test after those changes.



Wayne - please don't try to compare GM's oil life counter - which basically just counts miles - with mb's oil life monitoring system! The mb system has several sensors in the oil pan measuring viscosity, contaminant levels, etc, and weigh that against mileage, engine temp reached vs time, etc. Quite an advanced system. Anyway just for the record

 

[amsoilman]

Wayne - please don't try to compare GM's oil life counter - which basically just counts miles - with mb's oil life monitoring system! The mb system has several sensors in the oil pan measuring viscosity, contaminant levels, etc, and weigh that against mileage, engine temp reached vs time, etc. Quite an advanced system. Anyway just for the record

The information I read on the GM's "Patented (OLS) Oil Life System" came from an article in "Lubes N Greases" Vol. 10 Issue 5 titled "Supersize me! GM moves to extended drain intervals. "



The article states that each OLS computer model is "engine specific" because GM believes each engine behaves differently under various driving situations and conditions, and includes the engines "operational data" including temperature, RPM's and speed. They go on to say "(QUOTE)Driving styles vary as well. The OLS allegedly calculates all factors pertaining to both the engine and the driver and thereby makes its oil change recommendations. " According to GM senior Project Engineer, Robert Stockwell, who has been studying analyzed oil samples from vehicles with OLS, "In all cases where the OIL LIFE SYSTEM signaled for an oil change it was before the oil was worn out. "and how long were the drain intervals? Many of these samples, said Stockwell, "were from vehicles with greater then 10,000 miles on the oil, a few with more than 14,000 miles and at least one with 16,000 miles. These Intervals were recorded in vehicles using regular "Mineral" oil. Synthetic oil gets even longer oil change intervals. " The "owner's manual" in today's GM fleet no longer make specific milaeage recommendations at all. "(END-QUOTE)



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

"WHY CHANGE IT? Unless, of course you do NOT BELIEVE what the sampling results are telling you. "





Fact is, I *DO* believe what it is telling me - which is that while from a pure analytical sense, the oil still maintains it's overall lubricating qualities - but it ALSO is telling me THIS:



#ad






Notice the reference to the predicted steady increase in wear metal content - which obviously also includes other contaminants such as soot, as evidenced by the increasing blackness of the oil.



I realize some will claim that those contaminants, especially with use of a good bypass system, will hold particle size to a smaller size than will harm engine parts - but my own personal belief is that while smaller sized contaminants might take LONGER to do their dirty work, they WILL still do it!



Put it this way - if I stood before you with 3 containers, one empty, the another filled with fine dust, and the last with sand - and asked WHICH container you would prefer inside your engine, which would you choose?



I'm pretty sure we would all choose the EMPTY box, regardless of HOW small the particles in the other boxes were - at least that would be MY choice!



So what do *I* prefer in my engine, NEW oil with minimal contaminant levels, OR extended use oils that analysis clearly shows to be increasingly contaminated with wear and other particles?



Easy choice!



I sure wouldn't pay for NEW oils at those contaminant levels as compared to other oils at lower levels, regardless of WHAT analysis said regarding suitability for use - so why leave the OLD stuff in there WITH those contaminants?



Yeah, I realize my viewpoint differs from some others in this regard, especially those who are willing to accept rather high percentages of buildup of contaminant levels in their extended use oil because they feel the SIZE of those contaminants is insignificant, and that other basic lubricating characteristics are still what they are willing to accept.



I'm simply NOT comfortable with that, and still appreciate and am willing to pay for reasonably regular changes of nice clear, visually clean oil with corresponding low contaminant levels.



To each his own...